Jump to content


Heisler

Auctioneer
  • Content count

    8726
  • Joined

  • Last visited

  • Days Won

    2

Everything posted by Heisler

  1. Heisler

    Disaster with the Flat Coat sealer

    This was actually the final sealer coat to protect the weathering.
  2. I was just trying to finish this tank off for gaming and I pulled down my can of Army Painter flat coat. I now have a lovely speckled Sherman tank. Any ideas on how to fix it? I literally keep looking at it and turning around and going back upstairs.
  3. Heisler

    MSP Open Scoring Changes for 2019

    That’s part of it, although to be honest I usually use that pedestal as a handle to view the mini. Although it does vary by division, basically it is about you display the miniature for viewing. At the most basic a miniature should be on a base that might suggest the environment the miniature is in or provide some kind of context. For example in the painter division a miniature on a finished base simply looks better. If you take the same miniature and just put it on a stock, unfinished base you may well drop yourself a medal level. Hence why it’s such a small component of the score but it might be the tie breaker in a judge’s mind between one medal level and another. However, in the diorama division presentation is critical, it brings all the elements of the entry together to actually tell the story. Does that answer the question?
  4. After a brief back and forth Michael and I have agreed to some proposed changes to the weighting of the judging components beginning with the 2019 MSP Open. Painters Division - No changes Difficulty 5% Creativity 10% Workmanship 10% Painting 70% Presentation 5% Open Division - No changes Difficulty 15% Creativity 10% Workmanship 30% Painting 30% Presentation 15% Diorama Division - Changes to Four Components Difficulty 10% changes to - 15% Creativity 20% changes to - 15% Workmanship 15% changes to - 25% Painting 30% No change Presentation 25% changes to - 15% Scoring was change to better reflect that judges should be looking at the overall piece and how it is presented to the viewer. Did you successfully tell your story? Armor/Ordnance Division - Changes to Four Components Difficulty 15% No change Creativity 5% changes to - 10% Workmanship 15% changes to - 30% Painting 60% changes to - 35% Presentation 5% changes to - 10% Scoring was changed to bring the Armor/Ordnance division closer to the Open Division. The two divisions share a lot of similarities with each other and these changes better reflect what weight the judges should be given to the various scoring components. Feel free to ask questions, but I would prefer that you post those questions in the post specific to the category you have a question about: http://forum.reapermini.com/index.php?/topic/82720-judging-the-reaper-con-msp-open-painters-division/ http://forum.reapermini.com/index.php?/topic/82789-judging-the-reaper-con-msp-open-open-division/ http://forum.reapermini.com/index.php?/topic/82838-judging-the-reaper-con-msp-open-diorama-division/ http://forum.reapermini.com/index.php?/topic/83014-judging-the-reaper-con-msp-open-armorordnance-division/
  5. This is the fourth, and last, in a series of four posts each concentrating on a different entry category. You can find information about the scoring system itself in the Painter Division post. From here forward I will just concentrate on how the component guidelines apply to the other three divisions. Armor/Ordnance Division At MMSI in Chicago and elsewhere around the globe this category is usually filled with armor, planes, artillery and the like. At the MSP Open it is more along the lines of the red-headed stepchild. This division shares a lot with the Open Division with workmanship and creativity being big components of the scoring. While many entrants are willing to spend hours pouring over a single miniature and eradicating mold lines and filling gaps, they seem to be loath to do that with an entry into the armor/ordnance category. Just like the other divisions preparation is key, a visible mold line or a seam is likely to drop you a whole medal category in the judging. Since many of the entries are from plastic and resin kits visible seams are usually the biggest problem I see as a judge, following that would be mold lines in difficult to reach places. At the 2018 MSP Open there were a lot of larger Games Workshop pieces. Almost everyone single of these had visible mold lines in the hoses and seams in the armor panels on the back of the legs. This dropped everyone of these entries a medal level. Decals are often used in this division and there is nothing wrong with using them. You will get marked down for poor application though, treat a decal like freehand and don’t just slop it into place. There is a right way and a wrong way to apply decals and it can be a bit of an art to the proper application. Again, if you have just a single entry then the judges can just go ahead and score your entry, no discussion is necessary. If you have multiple entries, then there will be a discussion between the judges on which entry they want to score. That conversation is typically the only conversation although these discussions tend to be longer than they might be in the Painter Division. However, when selecting the scoring entry the conversation is still based on “I can score this one higher than the others” or words to that affect, till they come to a decision just as it would be for the Painter Division. If multiple entries are visually very thematic the judges may decide to judge them together as a single entry. Let’s take a quick look at the scoring guidelines the judges use (which is published as part of the MSP Open rules. These are guidelines are subject to change. Difficulty: 15% Creativity: 5% (proposing to change to 10%) Workmanship: 15% (proposing to change to 30%) Painting Skill: 60% (proposing to change to 35%) Presentation: 5% (proposing to change to 10%) Difficulty: This and the Open Division are the places where difficulty does have a significant impact. The difficulty of assembling some of the kits available on the market can vary widely from manufacturer to manufacturer. Especially when dealing with a plastic kit like those produced by Tamiya and Games Workshop to the five piece resin game oriented kits put out by other manufacturers. Creativity: There is not a lot of creativity involved with a straight up kit build, but when someone goes to the extra lengths to “upgrade” their kits with after market or hand made parts that impacts the creativity component. This is the equivalent of a conversion in the other divisions. Workmanship: This is really a key component for this division and the proposed change reflects that. Any type of non-painting effort is represented here. This is includes your ability to do conversions and/or scratch sculpt or at least be able to blend your entry in with the scene you have constructed. A missed mold line, poor assembly or a poorly executed conversion could easily drop you a while numeric value in the scoring. Painting Skill: Everything that was said about painting still applies in the Diorama Division but there is less emphasis. At this point workmanship and creativity components exceed the painting component (as currently proposed). There are a few other mediums that are often used in this category, like weathering powders, the application of those mediums falls into the painting component. While we don’t expect your abilities to be exactly equal in those areas you cannot count on your ability to paint alone to carry you over the top. Presentation: While not the most important component in the Armor/Ordnance Division it is another example of getting the little things right. A nice, well executed base will set the “scene” for your entry. It can be the simple or it can be more elaborate. I would save the effort on a really elaborate base for an entry in the Open or Diorama divisions. This component is one that a judge will often use when making that final decision between scores, a tie breaker as it were.
  6. Clever Crow did much the same thing with his entry, two or three pages of photographs underneath his entry. I don’t think we have ever discussed a good format amongst the judges before, something we should do I suppose. I think my favorite was a small 4x7 format photo book with both text and pictures. It was really easy to flip through.
  7. Heisler

    Vale Greg Stafford (1948 - 2018)

    That is just....devastating. I'm going to go pull out my RuneQuest stuff now.
  8. Glen's points are excellent but in the simplest of terms its all about the machine. So machine first, miniatures are there more for a representation of scale and presentation. Although since they fall into the presentation aspect of the judging they could downgrade your score if poorly done. In other words don't just slop some paint on the miniatures and throw them on the base, that will result in a lower score. This category is not for single miniatures or squads of troops. For instance at Reaper Con 2018 there was a single miniature entered in this category with a jet pack. Since the "vehicle" in this instance was the jetpack I made the decision, as the team captain, to move that miniature into painter. Troops can support the vehicle or weapon but we are judging the "Machine of War" not the troops although crewman will factor more heavily into the presentation of the piece. An artillery piece with a crew "presents" better than an artillery piece in isolation.
  9. Always better to ask the question than sit and wonder about it!
  10. Agreed, I would certainly consider most 3D printed kits to be more difficult to prep than most plastic kits and the same or more difficult than resin kits (many of the armor kits these days are mastered from 3D prints, like the ones from Mad Bob Miniatures). Its also a situation where if you have done your prep right I would never know it was a 3D print. Which means you would need to say something on the card that goes with each entry or provide some documentation, like in progress photos (much like an entry in the Open Division), to show what it took to make the kit ready for the competition.
  11. They would be judged the same as any other miniature. Complications arise with 3D printing due to resolution, I shouldn’t be able to see the layers through your paint work.
  12. This is the third in a series of four posts each concentrating on a different entry category. You can find information about the scoring system itself in the Painter Division post. From here forward I will just concentrate on how the component guidelines apply to the other three divisions Diorama Division The Diorama Division does not exist in the MMSI structure. At MMSI a diorama goes into the Open Division as it encompasses the same set of skills. I, however, felt the Open Division ignored or down played the story and what is a diorama without a story? This is the division that lets you show off the same skills that the Open Division does and wrap it around a story. Again if you have just a single entry then the judges can just go ahead and score your entry, no discussion is necessary. If you have multiple entries, then there will be a discussion between the judges on which entry they want to score. That conversation is typically the only conversation although these discussions tend to be longer than they might be in the Painter Division. However, when selecting the scoring entry the conversation is still based on “I can score this one higher than the others” or words to that affect, till they come to a decision just as it would be for the Painter Division. Let’s take a quick look at the scoring guidelines the judges use (which is published as part of the MSP Open rules. One cautionary note’ these particular scoring guidelines may change slightly): Difficulty: 10% Creativity: 20% Workmanship: 15% Painting Skill: 30% Presentation: 25% What does this mean for the Diorama Division? In this division we are really want to see all your hobby skills as well as your story telling ability. While the components remain the same the emphasis has obviously changed a great deal. Difficulty: This is a tough one for the Diorama category, since most dioramas are difficult to begin with. We reduced the emphasis here because we feel that you should not take a hit for a good story that is comparatively simple to tell. Creativity: Creativity steps up a bit here. While painting is still factor this is the portion that shows us the story you are telling. Now painting is combined with your ability to convert, sculpt and tell a story to your audience. The entrant’s imagination comes into play here, you are looking to tell a story to your viewers. You are striving for the audience to understand your story without commentary from you. It can be subtle or in your face but if you have to explain it then you have not succeeded. Workmanship: This remains a pretty straightforward component but in the Diorama Division there is a higher emphasis on it. It reflects how well constructed the entire piece is. Any type of non-painting effort is represented here. This is includes your ability to do conversions and/or scratch sculpt or at least be able to blend your miniatures in with the scene you have constructed. A missed mold line, poor assembly or a poorly executed conversion could easily drop you a while numeric value in the scoring. Painting Skill: Everything that was said about painting still applies in the Diorama Division but there is less emphasis. At this point workmanship and creativity components exceed the painting component. While we don’t expect your abilities to be exactly equal in those areas you cannot count on your ability to paint alone to carry you over the top. Presentation: There is more emphasis on the is component as well. You are building the entire entry, essentially from scratch, and the presentation of everything you do affects the story. From the miniatures to the setting, this is where it all comes together. How you present it can be the difference between gold and silver.
  13. Heisler

    Kristof65's next ReaperCon diorama WIP

    You have plenty of time to figure out the base. Working on the rest will give you time to let ideas gel. The only thing I would say at this point is go get some clay instead of play dough. It will help you visualize the area better, it can be roughly sculpted much easier and you can leave it out without it becoming a hardened mass.
  14. This is the second in a series of four posts each concentrating on a different entry category. You can find information about the scoring system itself in the Painter Division post. From here forward I will just concentrate on how the component guidelines apply to the other three divisions. Open Division The Open Division is far more of a freeform division than the Painter Division. Here is where you get to really strut your stuff with major conversions and scratch sculpts. If you have just a single entry then the judges can just go ahead and score your entry, no discussion is necessary. If you have multiple entries, then there will be a discussion between the judges on which entry they want to score. That conversation is typically the only conversation although these discussions tend to be longer than they might be in the Painter Division. However, when selecting the scoring entry the conversation is still based on “I can score this one higher than the others” or words to that affect, till they come to a decision just as it would be for the Painter Division. If multiple entries are visually very thematic the judges may decide to judge them together as a single entry. Let’s take a quick look at the scoring guidelines the judges use (which is published as part of the MSP Open rules): Difficulty: 15% Creativity: 10% Workmanship: 30% Painting Skill: 30% Presentation: 15% What does this mean for the Open Division? In this division we are really want to see all your skills. While the components remain the same the emphasis has obviously changed a great deal. Difficulty: This is far more intuitive than it is in the Painter Division. The level of difficulty depends entirely on the difficulty of the conversion, with a minor conversion being the least difficult with graduations on up from there with a complete scratch sculpt being the most difficult. Creativity: Creativity stays about the same as it does for Painter. Painting is still a factor here. Now painting is combined with your ability to convert and sculpt to reach your audience. The entrant’s imagination comes into play here, you are looking for impact on the audience. Are you straining the boundaries of believability or are you trying to evoke a specific emotion from your viewers? Have you achieved what you set out to do at the end? Workmanship: This remains a pretty straightforward component but in the Open Division there is a higher emphasis on it. It reflects how well constructed the entire piece is. Any type of non-painting effort is represented here. Again a well done conversion means that the judge can’t tell that anything has been converted. A scratch sculpt should be properly proportioned and well sculpted (no thumb prints!). A missed mold line, poor assembly or a poorly executed conversion could easily drop you a while numeric value in the scoring. This is a category that we really encourage documentation, show us what you did and how you did it. Painting Skill: Everything that was said about painting still applies in the Open Division but there is less emphasis. At this point workmanship and painting are equal. While we don’t expect your abilities to be exactly equal in both areas you cannot count on your ability to paint alone to carry you over the top. Presentation: There is more emphasis on the is component as well. If you are building the entire entry, essentially from scratch then the presentation of your entry is going to have a significant impact on how a viewer perceives your entry. Bring your entry to life!
  15. Breaking out the scoring or How your models are judged at the Reaper Con MSP Open This will be a series of four posts each concentrating on a different entry category. These scoring “rules” are based on the MMSI painting competition in Chicago and variants of this system are used on an international basis. Michael Proctor and I took a good hard look at the rules a number of years ago and introduced a few tweaks to the system to better represent what we, as judges, are looking for when scoring your entry at Reaper Con. The basis for all of these is still the MMSI rules and there is not a whole lot of difference between the emphasis of the components in each division. One thing to keep in mind is that manufacturer awards do not necessarily use the MSP Open system. Those winners are, typically, chosen by the manufacturer (including Reaper for the Sophies) or their representative on site using their own criteria. The scoring is quite simple. A judge assigns an entry one of five numerical values based on their opinion of what the entrant has earned for their entry: 0 – no award 1 – Certificate of Merit 2 – Bronze Medal 3 – Silver Medal 4 – Gold Medal The Reaper Con judging teams are made up of three judges (There are options to use 4 or 5 judges but regardless of how many judges are used only three scores are tallied). Each judge assigns one of these 5 values to each miniature assigned to their team. The three scores are tallied which gets a value somewhere between 0 and 12. That final tally gives a number that tells the team what award to give to the entrant for that entry. Judging is typically not done by committee, each judge assigns the score they feel the piece deserves and moves on to the next. Most discussion takes place around which piece to score when there are multiple entries. Judges do consult with each other when they have difficulty assigning a score to an entry. 0 – 1 No Award 2 – 4 Certificate of Merit 5 – 7 Bronze Medal 8 – 10 Silver Medal 11 – 12 Gold Medal That’s the basics, now let’s take a look at how a judge uses the five components to decide what score they are going to give you. Painter Division The Painter Division is for stock models, those that come straight from the package or are assembled as shown by the manufacturer (it can include minor conversions). The Painter Division is the largest category at the MSP Open, often encompassing hundreds of entries at each show. There is no limit to the number of entries that an individual can enter in this category. I personally would limit yourself to your three best, but if you intend to be considered for other manufacturer or theme awards then it would not be out of place to see six or more entries from an individual. If you have just a single entry then the judges can just go ahead and score your entry, no discussion is necessary. If you have multiple entries, then there will be a discussion between the judges on which entry they want to score. That conversation is typically the only conversation that needs to occur for any given entrant. When selecting the scoring entry the conversation is based on “I can score this one higher than the others” or words to that affect, till they come to a decision which is usually pretty quickly done. If the entries are visually very thematic the judges may decide to judge them together as a single entry. Let’s take a quick look at the scoring guidelines the judges use (which is published as part of the MSP Open rules): Difficulty: 5% Creativity: 10% Workmanship: 10% Painting Skill: 70% Presentation: 5% What does that really mean? In a nutshell we want to see how well you can paint! Did you really execute the different techniques to the best of your ability? Hence why painting skill is the predominant component that a judge is going to look at. Let’s look at a breakdown of those components and how they relate to a miniature in the Painters Division. Difficulty: This is definitely not an intuitive concept in the Painter Division. The judge is not looking at the techniques (including freehand) you used on the miniature. They are looking at how difficult is the miniature itself to paint. While how difficult a miniature is also subjective, subtle shading on flat or nearly flat surfaces are much more difficult to pull off than shading on a surface with more surface texture. Often difficulty is going to come into play when a judge is on the fence between two scores. Creativity: This component looks at use of color, color schemes and the use of freehand designs in other words things that aren’t part of the sculpt itself. This is also where painted effects first come into play, like OSL (Object Source Lighting). This is the component that really addresses your freedom of expression on your entry and how well you bring that across to the audience. Workmanship: This is a pretty straightforward component. It reflects how well you prepared your model for painting. Any type of non-painting effort is represented here. In the Painter division this includes finding the elusive mold line and eliminating it but it also includes assembling a multi piece miniatures or executing minor conversions. A well done conversion or well assembled miniature means that the judge can’t tell that anything has been converted or that it had multiple pieces. A missed mold line, poor assembly or a poorly executed conversion could easily drop you a while numeric value in the scoring. Painting Skill: This is the whole key to the Painter Division entry, how well you apply paint to the miniature. These is where you are evaluated on the techniques you used how well you executed them. Tying everything together is really important as well. Everything you do must come together as a whole composition. It is an area where judges need to be aware of everything that is going on and how it is fitting together. While this is the predominate component of the Painter Division it is also the most subjective. Judges must overcome their prejudices about which techniques they prefer. As an example there is nothing wrong with drybrushing as long as you executed it properly regardless of how the judge feels about that technique. Here is an example of how a judge needs to be aware of many different styles and techniques. Blending doesn’t always have to be a smooth transition from light to dark, there are multiple different types of blending, it is how well you executed the technique or style you opted for. Do you blend like Jen Haley or like Alfonso “Banshee” Giraldes? They both achieve marvelous blends but their techniques are markedly different in achieving those blends. Presentation: While not the most important component in the Painter Division it is another example of getting the little things right. A nice, well executed base will set the “scene” for your miniature. It can be the simple base that the miniature came on or with or it can be more elaborate, although I would save the effort on a really elaborate base for a miniature going into the Open or Diorama divisions. This component is another that one that a judge will often use when making that final decision between scores, a tie breaker as it were. If you made it through that wall of text, congratulations! Hopefully that helped explain away some of the magic behind the scoring in the Painter Division.
  16. Effective May 2015 the CMPA is moving to the 3rd Saturday of each month. We will be meeting at Total Escape Games in Broomfield CO. The address is: 6831 120th Ave, Broomfield, CO 80020 3rd Saturday Dates: 5/16, 6/20, 7/18, 8/15, 9/19, 10/17, 11/21, 12/19 and 1/16/2016 There is an event calendar on our website: http://cominipainters.com/ and on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ColoradoMiniaturePaintersAlliance
  17. Heisler

    So... who's ready for ReaperCon 2019?

    No idea, I was only told raw numbers not the breakdown.
  18. Heisler

    Reapercon Sophie

    The Sophie and other exclusive miniature bins are usually kept in the vault. I have never seen them for cast on demand in the factory before.
  19. Heisler

    First year thoughts

    I haven’t seen or heard any complaints at this point Ian!
  20. Heisler

    So... who's ready for ReaperCon 2019?

    Any dates after next year are pure speculation on my part. But jumping from 600 one year to 1000+ even when changing the date and the venue location is not an insignificant event.
  21. Heisler

    ReaperCon 2018 Review

    I do remember those. I was wondering where they came from!
  22. Heisler

    First year thoughts

    Just stepping in with a few more comments about the judging. No system is perfect, but the MSP Open style is a good compromise. The MSP Open is based on the Open judging rules developed by the MMSI Group in Chicago. The basic idea is that you are not competing against anyone else in the competition, you are being judged on the skills that you are showing off. The primary difference is, that as a judge, we are looking at all the good things you have done and making decisions based on those good things. We aren't focused on the flaws, although there are things that will immediately drop you down a medal level, like mold lines. Most painting competitions, in the US, are trophy oriented so that only the top three painters are given an award and judges are very focused on flaws and rarely give a painter any type of feedback on their entry. Trophy competitions are, almost, always anonymous to avoid favoritism. At Reaper Con we don't care who you are, famous miniature painter or not, we just care about how well you execute. That's usually why I recommend that you don't try out a new technique on a competition piece unless you are absolutely sure that you can pull it off. All the points people are bringing up are exactly why we use this particular model for the competition. The "rubric" as it were is published in the rules for each category. It serves as a rough guide for the judges. Michael and I spent a lot of time modifying both the description of the categories and what we want to emphasize within each category (which means the Kuro and I will be having a discussion again about dioramas! Story First!). There are a couple of places that we are different from MMSI as well. We like dioramas and felt they deserved their own category, at MMSI Dioramas fall into the Open section, which really makes sense when you think about it but Michael and I felt that it really did a disservice to dioramas. The general nature of the rubric is exactly why multiple judges score each piece. In theory their scores should balance each other out. At Reaper Con we use the minimum number of judges which is three but as MMSI and other shows they use teams as large as five. Here is the difference. With three judges all the scores are counted, with four judges the lowest score is tossed out and the three remaining scores are counted, with five judges the high and the low scores are tossed. We just don't have the number of judges (and not just anyone can be a judge either) so we opted for the three member format. Since we instituted the open format I would say that the judges are actually remarkably consistent in how they score things. We usually see a difference when a judge is taken out of their comfort zone and judge something like Ordnance, or Open. And actually when forming teams we really don't try to have a soft, hard and a neutral judge on a team. The main criteria is that we don't have two "hard" judges or two "soft" judges on a team. Those are the situations when scores can really be skewed especially in the three judge format. As far as a library of miniatures for the different levels, that is really impossible to do. I saw a suggestion, that I think is excellent, is just to go back and look at the entries from past contests, all of which can be viewed on the Reaper Con website. 2012 is the first year available for pictures but I think we actually started this style of judging in 2010. If we had examples of the various levels, you would not be able to take into account the very different styles of mini painting that are out there. I can tell you this though, the skill levels for the various medals will change slightly from year to year. Two factors impact that . First the skill level of the painters that enter push the bar higher for the different levels. Stuff that won gold back in 2012 might only be silver now. Again that is impacted by the skill levels, overall, of the painters entering the ReaperCon competition have increased every single year. The quality of the judges impacts those scores as well. We try to train a couple of new judges everyone (they start as apprentices) and work them into the rotation so they can get a hands on look and feel of what we do. But that means that those teams change every year, about the only thing that remains consistent in that regard are the team captains. You can usually count on your team being slightly different each year and that helps ensure that particular styles of painting become over whelming favorites to win gold medals. Sophie judging is a whole different animal, so anything I have said here pretty much goes out the window for the judging of Sophie's and manufacturer awards.
  23. Heisler

    ReaperCon 2018 Review

    And just out of sure curiosity which items were those?
×