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#1 Cade

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Posted 05 September 2003 - 07:42 AM

How do you paint sheer/semi-transparent clothing?

Would you paint nylons in a different manner?

Somewhere I saw a mini of a vampire lady wearing a semi-transparent black dress.  The effect made it look like a thin black nylon.  It looked very nice, but I'm not quite sure how to do that.


#2 Enchantra

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Posted 05 September 2003 - 08:02 AM

OK, there are several ways probably to do this.

When I want to make things look sheer, I base coat in the desired color and then sponge paint over it gently in different tints of the same color.  Now obviously this means you still would not see "skin."  

For seeing skin, honestly how I THINK it might be done is that you paint a basecoat of the color like above, then you paint in the images of legs/arms/whatever.  Then go over this with washes and layering and drybrushing to achieve the effect like there might be some kind of diaphanous fabric over her appendages.

That is my take on things.  Vaitalla will be able to help you better I think.   :D

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#3 katieo

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Posted 05 September 2003 - 09:43 AM

There's an article on cmon, try this link...
http://www.coolminiornot.com/go.php?....vels=99

Basically, where skin would touch the fabric, mix in skintone.  Where skin doesn't touch, use just the fabric colors.

The vampire in Anne's showcase painted by Jennifer Haley is a nice example if you haven't already seen it.  Look at where on the dress she mixes in the flesh color.
http://www.reapermini.com/fantasy/albums/s...nnafront_jh.jpg


#4 Aryanun

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Posted 05 September 2003 - 10:27 AM

I think that's the mini that Cade13 is talking about.

Paintrix, looks like a question just for you !! I'm sure you get this question a lot.

I'm actually curious as to your technique, as you do it quite well. I've been wanting to do that with Neferu, but seeing as I'm just now finishing her up, I decided to forego that and just try to finish one. I'll get another Neferu for later, when I'm more comfortable with painting again.

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#5 Cade

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Posted 05 September 2003 - 12:42 PM

Actually, the mini I was looking at was at the following site:
Tiny Wars

I can't link directly to the mini.  Go Image Gallery, select Dark Heavens, and look the same Reaper vampire lady.

Jennifer's vampire's outfit appear sheer.  The other miniature looks more to me like a nylon or certain similar types of lingerie, where much more skin shows through but the fabric still looks black.  Hard to explain...

I was interested in how to paint both.  Perhaps they are done the same and only my eyes are playing tricks on me, photo quality issue, or just because they are different colors.  I can imagine a mini that has both panty hose and a sheer dress.  I would think that there would be similarities in their painting, but the overall look should be slightly different.


#6 Aryanun

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Posted 05 September 2003 - 01:27 PM

Actually, I think Paintrix's is better. Then again, an awesome paintjob all around makes all the difference.

The principles are the same for both, but Paintrix could probably explain it much better than I could since I've never done it.

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"Hulk bash Iron Man face!" --- my son, Thomas, at seeing Iron Man #19

"If I had any dignity, that would have been humiliating" --- Adam Savage from Mythbusters

#7 Cade

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Posted 05 September 2003 - 01:45 PM

Actually, I think Paintrix's is better. Then again, an awesome paintjob all around makes all the difference.

I agree, Paintrix's mini is beautiful.  However, they each have a different look, at least in my eye.  I would like to know how to achieve both the sheer look in Paintrix's mini and a more transparent appearance that some nylons might have.

The question is, how do you differentiate to two from a technical painting standpoint and how do you successfully paint the even more transparent look while still maintaining the image and color of the clothing?


#8 katieo

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Posted 05 September 2003 - 03:19 PM

So you're looking at the difference between translucent hanging fabric and clingy spandex-like fabric?  Looks like it is -where- the fleshy color is placed.  This is actually rather cool, I'm going to have to find some hapless mini to try this on. :)

http://www.tinywars.com/gallery....ess.htm
On the tinywars vampire, the places where the strong fabric color was put is in all the crevases, look at the muscles on her stomach.  Or her breasts, see how there's flesh color mixed in underneath where a clingy outfit would cling?  Flesh color to the outside, fabric to the inside.

http://www.reapermini.com/fantasy/albums/s...nnafront_jh.jpg
For hanging fabric, most of the strong fabric color would go in areas underneath.  Lots of skin color mixed in on the upper area of her stomach, and lots of fabric color on the undersides of her breasts.  Flesh color to the top, fabric to the bottom.  Notice how much further down past the knees before the flesh color is added compared to the other one.


#9 Aryanun

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Posted 05 September 2003 - 04:07 PM

Until I looked at both figures side by side, I had never noticed....


Paintrix, did you sculpt those gloves on? Those, too, are sheer and very well done.

The first time I saw this mini, unpainted, I didn't like it at all, but it's proof that with an excellent paint job any mini can look good.

Maybe I'll try stripping Guen eventially and redo her. She might actually look good in a sheer gown.

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"Hulk bash Iron Man face!" --- my son, Thomas, at seeing Iron Man #19

"If I had any dignity, that would have been humiliating" --- Adam Savage from Mythbusters

#10 Vaitalla

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Posted 09 September 2003 - 09:36 AM

I'll reply for Jen, the ends of the gloves opposite the fingers are sculpted on, then painted as though they were all one piece with the lower arms and hands.  Smooooth sculpting, but then our Ms. Haley is good at that...  :;):

--Anne

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#11 ixminis

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Posted 10 September 2003 - 05:09 PM

Greetings all... I'll answer for the Jehenna in the black dress.  The picture was taken with a Sony Mavica & somehow made the mini look about as good as it'll ever look.  

I highly encourage ya to try out WHATEVER you think *may* work for transparency and/or sheerness on your mini.

Jehenna and Laurana were my first two attempts at transparency/sheerness.. can't remember which was first...  Laurana's link is at the end of this paragraph.  Warning... it's essentially a wet t-shirt:  Laurana with transparency

Anyway, IIRC, Jahenna was done all in flesh with successive layers of clothing added to her & Laurana was done in white with successive layers of flesh added on top...  Alot of wetblending... no extra paint additives OR layers of dullcote... Each figure was done in 3 or less hours... quickies...

While adding layers, the paint was as translucent as I could get it without breaking up the distribution of the pigment... I then used reference piccies from the web to identify the relative luminosity and potential locations for "clings"....

Hope this helps a bit...  Next time I do something sheer... I'll probably do this:

basecoat
Flesh built up to all highlights
dullcote
blend basecoat up to highlights with every other layer going over the flesh (maybe a little thinner, maybe not)

Mainly... it'll be another patient "eyeball it & adjust until it looks right" thing...

So... anyone tried it out yet?

MichaelG
Tinywars.com

p.s. Don't even *think* that my Jehenna is close to the one that Jen did.... Think of 'em this way... Mine was a "proof of concept" Jen's was downright Fantabulicious.... worlds apart.... worlds apart.... okee?

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#12 katieo

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Posted 11 September 2003 - 07:49 AM

So... anyone tried it out yet?


Not yet.  My pile of unpainted metal is sadly lacking women in tight clothes.  I was going to wait until October for my next giant order ( I want a copy of the new female dwarf wizard ) but I'm getting too close to the 50/50 ratio of painted to unpainted...

I also want to try painting lace...


#13 ixminis

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Posted 11 September 2003 - 05:12 PM

50/50 is a GREAT ratio!!! Last count... several years ago... I was at 6,000 figures.... and only 1,000 or maybe 1,500 were painted.... This year I've probably painted 300 or so minis, but alot of 'em were commissions and are long gone...  

Besides... I collect 'em cuz I *MAY* have fun painting 'em some day... not because I *HAVE TO* paint 'em someday... hee hee  

:-)

MichaelG

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#14 Dweller

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Posted 11 September 2003 - 09:07 PM

Last count... several years ago... I was at 6,000 figures.... and only 1,000 or maybe 1,500 were painted.

Wow. Can I ask over how many years did you collect 6000 figures and manage to paint 1000 to 1500?

I am on year 1 and have painted 5, have 5 in progress, 2 more primered standing by and probably 10-12 I havent touched yet.

They do add up fast but 6000!!!  :O

edited to add 2 that I have painted and stripped 3 or 4 times each.. just cant get layering skin down yet. I get better every time though :)


#15 ixminis

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Posted 11 September 2003 - 09:46 PM

Weeell, I'll give you the long answer first:

My first exposure to mini's was about 24 to 25 years ago... about the same time that TSR's "T1 Village of Hommlet" module was released... (Yes, I'm one of the suckers who waited something like 10-15 years for the sequel to THAT module)...

I think I painted 5-10 mini's for myself and some buddy's somewhere b/w "T1 Village of Hommlet" and "Q1 Lair of the Spider Queen" or something like that...  

I probably owned about 30-50 minis by then (see, I already had a bad painted to unpainted ratio hee hee)...  

- insert a loong loong time -

1990:  
I painted another 5-10 mini's for another AD&D campaign

1996ish
I started painting a sci-fi army: and got somewhere b/w 60 and 100 figures painted.  Got a fantasy army and painted about 120 figs for it...

1998ish
I think I aquired a big pile of 1/2-off mini's somewhere around here... I think I was picking up speed... something like 1500 - 2500 mini's owned...

2000ish to November 2002:
Got more, uh, regimented (pardon the pun) about how I painted:  probably got the remainder painted during this time.  Mind you... lotsa free time...  also seemed to keep buying mini's waaaay faster than I could paint 'em... Well... actually got married somewhere in there... Oh yeah, webmastered a website for a historical company in trade for mini's... oops... even MORE mini's!!!  Oooops!!!! bought out a buddies not-yet-painted mini's to help him out -> EVEN MORE MINI'S !!!!

November 2002 to present:
Started needing some extra money... started painting for one company (I'll give you three guesses)... started painting for commission.... started selling some of my painted historical stuff (which generated MORE commissions)....

Now the short story:The *heavy* / *serious* collecting has been going on for about 6 or 7 years... and the disciplined approach to increasing my "output" has been for 3 years... with a real big improvement since last November...


In Summary???
The bottom line is that I paint mini's to a few standards (that's the nice way of saying it).  I have a historical standard which is for... well, historicals... When you've got an army that ranges from 200-600 figures... you start to relax a bit on how "perfect" the mini will be.

Then, the rest of the painting levels are really based on the purpose of the mini... A friend wants a figure that is good, but not showcase quality... also called wargaming standard... that'll go from 2-4 hours...

5-8 hours will be pretty darn good, but still could have issues... not usually glaring... but issues...

9 and up and the figures will probably impress folks.... although it seems the more time I spend on the mini, the more I want it to be perfect & the more I'm not happy with it... go figure... eh?

Now I'm at the end of my post and wondering if I really answered your question... arg...

MichaelG

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