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Dips and Washes


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#1 Bonejack

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Posted 27 July 2011 - 11:54 PM

Hi Everyone! I'm a long-time lurker now finally breaking my silence :)

I spent many hours last night in this very forum reading about dipping techniques and I feel pretty confident that I'm not duplicating information from another thread. I have a pretty straightforward question about dipping: How is a dip not just a wash?

I realize that the polyurethane stain products put a very tough protective coat on the miniatures, and I can see how that would be a desirable thing. But is this the main reason that dipping is seen as a beneficial timesaver? Are there shading characteristics of these stain products that differ significantly from a more conventional wash? If so, in what ways?

Thanks!

-BJ

#2 pae

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Posted 28 July 2011 - 09:02 AM

Well, the main difference that I can see is that a wash isn't applied over the entire mini.

I imagine dipping is significantly quicker.

Having said all of that, I've never been a 'dipper', but then again, I don't paint armies.

#3 Doug Sundseth

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Posted 28 July 2011 - 09:35 AM

The various dips have a very different viscosity and surface tension than the usual sort of wash. The result is that they usually give a smoother gradient when darkening figure recesses, they tint the high points a bit more than washes usually do, and they don't give you tide lines like washes will if you don't handle them correctly. They also don't require much skill to use correctly.

And, as you noted, polyurethane coatings provide quite a strong surface protection layer.
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#4 Bonejack

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Posted 28 July 2011 - 09:52 AM

Thanks Doug, that answers my questions perfectly!

-BJ

#5 Angorak

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Posted 28 July 2011 - 06:05 PM

I used to be opposed to the dip but have relaxed my opposition to it. After starting a 100pt Cygnar force i came to the realization that dipping the rank and file troops would speed the whole process up considerably.
I still hold the line on characters, solos and Warjacks. A big plus for the dip is the rock hard protective coating it adds..that there is a big plus for me. Even after the dip I go over the model with some highlights and clean up but the
net result is still a lot faster.
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#6 Sergeant_Crunch

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Posted 28 July 2011 - 07:45 PM

painted with a wash

Posted Image

painted using a polyurethane dip

Posted Image

And a side by side comparison

Posted Image

Same base colors, except I used ProPaint Slime Black (I think that's what it's called, don't have it handy ATM) and a medium toned poly stain. Dipping applied faster, but took longer to dry with more fumes. Also, on these I put them on a bit heavy and didn't thin it with anything. Next time I'll use some mineral spirits to thin the stain to help it flow better.

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#7 Foxden Racing

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Posted 08 August 2011 - 01:04 PM

If I'm looking at this right Sarge, there's another potential bonus to dipping vs washing: the inconsistent, swirling color. Did they come out that way, or is it camera tricks?

#8 Sergeant_Crunch

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Posted 08 August 2011 - 06:27 PM

If you mean the base, that's partially the polyurethane, but mostly the gel medium I use on bases. The dip really accentuated the basing.

I'm not so sure I'd want to get hit by a missile with a "dog brain" AI.
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#9 Foxden Racing

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 12:58 PM

Ah. I figured it to be the poly since the swirls are up the legs too.

#10 Sergeant_Crunch

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Posted 10 August 2011 - 10:50 PM

That's just me not getting all the excess off the legs. The poly was kinda thick due to the climate at the time of the painting. That and there were some casting imperfections that the dip seemed to bring out more than regular painting did. Using a poly dip will definitely bring out any irregularities in a flat or curved surface very quickly, intentionally or not.

I'm not so sure I'd want to get hit by a missile with a "dog brain" AI.
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#11 Foxden Racing

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 12:05 PM

Aha. Part of me wishes the wash was the same color as the dip for an apples-to-apples comparison. The wash looks to be a lot thinner both in color density and in texture, which leaves me wondering if dipping isn't to washing what carpet-bombing is to cruise missiles...trading finesse for speed of coverage. I imagine you can't dip repeatedly to use multiple colors, or even different colors in different areas...but in return you get once-and-done, nearly impervious coverage.

Or I could be off by a mile...I'm guessing based on what I'm seeing, not on personal experience.

#12 Eilif

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Posted 12 August 2011 - 10:23 AM

The inconsistent color is a feature of the dip, though it does get more pronounced the more you leave on.

I dip most everything now, and here's my list of dip features.

1)Very protective coat
2)A wash. Does most of what a wash does in terms of darkening recesses and tinting the overall paint job.
3)Pseudo Shade. The inconsistent nature of the dip brings out a shade like effect as it settles slightly unevenly over the miniature
4)Fake Hightlight. This is especially eveident when using lighter colors under the dip. The dip settles away from the edges and high points of the miniature and leaves them a bit lighter than the other surfaces. For this reason I always try to paint the base blocking under the dip with colors that are bit lighter than I would if doing traditional brush techniques.

Also, as I'm sure you're aware, the "dip" need not be dipped. I use a poly-stain product and I apply it with a brush and rather than shaking it off, I dab off excess with a brush as well.
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#13 Sergeant_Crunch

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Posted 13 August 2011 - 04:46 PM

For those bugs, there was a bit of color testing going on as well. I was trying to decide between a dark green, almost black, wash vs. the brown poly.

I'm not so sure I'd want to get hit by a missile with a "dog brain" AI.
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