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possible incompatibility with bones plastic and brush on sealer


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#1 Tyler T

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 01:10 AM

this is a re-post from the kick starter comments page.

hi everyone! So I may have noticed an odd side effect of bones plastic and reaper paints. while at the paint and take event at pax I painted up a few bones minis (and met the great reaper staff! good times!) I used reaper brush on sealer on these minis. I have a bones mini that I painted before pax and it's paint does not crack when bent, however the ones I used the sealer on have cracked and flaked when bent.

I think the sealer makes the paint more brittle. while i imagine its great on metal or resin minis it appears to be incompatible with bone plastics. i would love it of someone else could confirm this. This is important because the sealer is included in paint set number two and i imagine new painters would be rather put out if their paint starts to flake.


i want to say that the reaper paints appear to work really well with the plastic and that i think it's only the sealer giving me trouble.
other possible factors could be, the paint and take bones had more mold release on them.
the very short time the paint had to dry before the sealer was applied. maybe if the paint was allowed to cure fully the paint would not have become brittle?

#2 Adrift

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 01:16 AM

It is a great question. I don't let people bend my bones minis...in fact, they know I'd smack them with a baseball bat for doing so.
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#3 Orlando_the_Technicoloured

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 03:20 AM

Acrylic paints are naturally somewhat elastic when dry due to their chemical nature, so bending a painted figure may not cause cracking

It is possible the sealer is more rigid (I know some varnish are, but have not tried reaper sealer) and so will crack if bent, and in doing so crack the acrylic underneath

Probably something for reaper to check out

#4 smokingwreckage

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 03:27 AM

I would have thought a polyurethane or acrylic varnish would be fairly flexible.

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#5 Orlando_the_Technicoloured

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 03:29 AM

Most are, but is Reaper Sealer a varnish ?

not sure on that one

#6 badocter

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 05:07 AM

Similarly, my experience with the Army Painter quickshade is that it also is not as flexible as the paint, however, it can still be bent pretty far on bones before it cracks. In fairness, it cracks and flakes much easier on metal minis that have been bent even in the slightest, so bones plastic is still superior in this regard (at least with quickshade)

#7 Pingo

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 06:29 AM

Acrylic paints, mediums, and varnishes come in a wide variety of flexibilities, among other traits. I have a bucket of medium to add to acrylics to make them hard and strong on fiberglass; it's great for outdoor sculptures but would be catastrophic on canvas. One of the tradeoffs seems to be stickiness; more flexible paints tend to dry a little stickier than less flexible ones (but this is only my anecdotal observation).

It's possible Reaper's brush-on sealer is formulated for rigid surfaces, like metal, but is unsuitable for flexible surfaces, like Bones plastic.

I haven't got any to try, but I would be interested to hear people's experiments.

To test it without sacrificing Bones, I would suggest laying a film of it on aluminum foil, letting it dry thoroughly, and then flexing the foil.

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#8 Halberkill

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 07:36 AM

I would recommend Testor's Dullcoate as a final sealant. I've been using it on other painted PVC minis for a while and have not had any problems.

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#9 Wren

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 10:40 AM

I did a primer test a little while back, and I'm hoping to do a sealer test some time in the near future. I'll be testing Reaper brush-on, Dullcote, Future and a few combinations of those. Possibly 'Ard Coat. Unfortunately I don't have any Army Painter quickshade or other dip type stuff, and they're a little bit pricey, so I'm debating whether to acquire any to try, since it's not likely I'd use those in regular painting very often.
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#10 urloony

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 11:40 AM

It's possible Reaper's brush-on sealer is formulated for rigid surfaces, like metal, but is unsuitable for flexible surfaces, like Bones plastic.

This is probably the case. I know many people use and seem to get good results with lacquer based primers like Tamiya as well as lacquer top coats like testers on the Bones minis, but I avoid them for exactly the reason you stated above.

#11 Furongian

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Posted 03 October 2012 - 09:03 AM

I was under the impression that the acrylic medium used in Reaper Brush-on Sealer was the same used in all Master Series paints. I have no idea if this is actually true, it is just the assumption that was stuck in my head.

#12 psyberwolfe1

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Posted 03 October 2012 - 09:34 AM

I did a primer test a little while back, and I'm hoping to do a sealer test some time in the near future. I'll be testing Reaper brush-on, Dullcote, Future and a few combinations of those. Possibly 'Ard Coat. Unfortunately I don't have any Army Painter quickshade or other dip type stuff, and they're a little bit pricey, so I'm debating whether to acquire any to try, since it's not likely I'd use those in regular painting very often.


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Does anybody else find it odd, by the way, that the information age has led to language becoming an oblique and imprecise tool where even the most straightforward phrasing is pored over with chicken entrails and bone tossing to divine the true meaning?


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#13 Wren

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Posted 04 October 2012 - 07:44 AM

It'd be very nice to paint things at faster than a snail's pace, though. ;-> I have a friend who's doing his Descent set, I don't think he's using dip, but I'll ask him. Otherwise maybe I could mail out one of the ones I paint to someone who does dip for the sealer test?

#14 psyberwolfe1

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Posted 04 October 2012 - 08:07 AM

It'd be very nice to paint things at faster than a snail's pace, though. ;-> I have a friend who's doing his Descent set, I don't think he's using dip, but I'll ask him. Otherwise maybe I could mail out one of the ones I paint to someone who does dip for the sealer test?


Absolutely! As I've told you for years. Army painting is a different beast and there are a ton of tricks that translate well to Competition. Dipping isn't one of them but it does help develop your eye for perfect block painting because dipping is a one way trip.

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For other Wargame and miniature related stuff you can read my blog at http://tacticalrock.blogspot.com

 
 



Does anybody else find it odd, by the way, that the information age has led to language becoming an oblique and imprecise tool where even the most straightforward phrasing is pored over with chicken entrails and bone tossing to divine the true meaning?


... nobody remembers Slave Leia because, "Oh my gosh! What innovative use of bronze."

 
 
Meep.jpg


#15 Exwilly

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Posted 04 October 2012 - 11:14 AM

I did a primer test a little while back, and I'm hoping to do a sealer test some time in the near future. I'll be testing Reaper brush-on, Dullcote, Future and a few combinations of those. Possibly 'Ard Coat. Unfortunately I don't have any Army Painter quickshade or other dip type stuff, and they're a little bit pricey, so I'm debating whether to acquire any to try, since it's not likely I'd use those in regular painting very often.

they actually sell the dropper bottles for quickshade now. so if you dont want the dip one they have a dropper bottle to brush it on.
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