Wren

Bones: The First Coat is the Difference

177 posts in this topic

I saw a few things that made reference to Testors Aerosol Enamel remaining tacky but I've actually had issues with all Testors flat enamles that I've painted on the figures remaining tacky. I saw that clear coat was reccomended. Just wondering if there would be a particular recommended type and brand.

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Just thought I'd chip in with my spray primer experiences:

 

  • Krylon Fusion Matte White - Still tacky after 24 hours. Going to leave it longer, but not hopeful.
  • Krylon Fusion Gloss Burgundy - Still tacky after 24 hours.
  • Krylon Paint + Primer Gloss White - Still tacky after 24 hours, did not bond. Was able to remove with toothbrush and no solvents.
  • Dupli-Color Sandable Gray Primer - Dried within minutes. Solid bond. Excellent painting surface and no real loss of detail. I can only assume the black and red are as good. Only complaint is the grey is pretty dark - about 75% black / 25% white.

My personal recommendation to anyone in North America is Duplicolor. My only problem is having difficulty finding the white one - the Canadian Tires near me only carry the Red/Grey/Black.

 

Tried Gesso too, but I haven't quite mastered the amount you put on... and for all it's cheap it seems to be a lot of work compared to spray.

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Gesso comes in two textures, a liquid and a .... goop. Proponents of the liquid say you can just scrub it on real thick and fast, and it shrinks. Which did you use?

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Hmm, I think liquid but it's pretty thick - somewhere close to white glue... it reminds me a lot of the poster paint we used to get in elementary school. Brand is Daler and Rowney.

 

Have tried slapping it on straight and it didn't shrink noticably, but I'm going to give it a shot diluted slightly with something like Future.

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A little more experience with washes on raw bones prepped with a simple sap and water scrub. I am apparently going blind, so i washed Mr Bones with 73202 Vallejo transparent acrylic wash (pale grey). It worked great to see missed flash and details.

 

I then decided i wanted to do the same with the ghost king but darker. I used the original GW Citadel Colour Black Ink. A week later it is still sticky. I am debating painting on top of it or trying to strip with Simple Green and starting over.

 

I may experiment with the Liquitex ink and dropper bottle of Army Painter Warpaints Quickshade i have.

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Try GLass and Tile Medium, tinted with a paint, not an Ink. I'm pretty sure those old-old Citadel Ink Washes are a proper ink and that means they will leach into or even blend into paints that go over them after theyve "dried".

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has anybody tried vallejo air brush thinner for thinning paints yet

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I HAVE but I don't have much to report. Didn't take notes, can't remember.

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The first gesso I tried with miniatures (not bones) was Liquitext white gesso. It was a little goopy and did not shrink and tighten like I heard gesso should. I returned that and got a bottle of Bob Ross gray gesso and that worked like a charm on normal plastic and metal minis.

 

The verdict is still out on using it with Bones...

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After my wife cleaned her Vampire box, I pulled out my new bottle of Liquitex white gesso. I mixed in a few drops of Adikolor antracite black and made a very nice light gray, which I slathered all over a few of her Bones. I can't see the 'shrinking' effect, but it really makes the details pop and I've got a good base to apply paint to. So far, I like the gesso as a primer coat.

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I used some GW Foundation paint (Charadon Granite) on the Bones version of the Well of Chaos last night. To my shame, I forgot to wash the mini first, but had no issues. I used the paint straight from the bottle, no thinning with water or anything else, despite what the GW website recommends. It covered well and today I tried to rub the paint off with my fingers with no effect. I then proceeded to bend and twist the top of the mini around most unkindly. The paint did not crack, flake for peal. It looks like we have another brand of paint that can be used for the first coat. I know Reaper MSPs are not as commonly available as GW paints are, so this might be helpful to some.

Edited by DocPiske
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I used some GW Foundation paint (Charadon Granite) on the Bones version of the Well of Chaos last night. To my shame, I forgot to wash the mini first, but had no issues. I used the paint straight from the bottle, no thinning with water or anything else, despite what the GW website recommends. It covered well and today I tried to rub the paint off with my fingers with no effect. I then proceeded to bend and twist the top of the mini around most unkindly. The paint did not crack, flake for peal. It looks like we have another brand of paint that can be used for the first coat. I know Reaper MSPs are not as commonly available as GW paints are, so this might be helpful to some.

GW's Foundation paints have (sadly) been OOP for about a year now. I used GW Foundation paints for the base colors on the first Bones minis I painted (before the KS), and they worked wonderfully, but now I've tried a bunch of others with poor results. Some of them bead up, but even the ones that start ok rub off too easily later.

 

I've tried at least 5 types over 3 generations of GW/Citadel, which painted ok but rubbed off; Army Painter black beaded up; several Vallejo Model and Game colors, which randomly showed either of those effects; and one of Reaper's Master Series, albeit an older, OOP color, which painted ok but rubbed off.

 

I started to notice the problem in the middle of painting up a model, and even went so far as to scrape off some problem edges and re-"prime" them with some Foundation paint, but this is the strangest part - some areas seem fine now, but others are still rubbing off.

 

The only thing I can think is the washing: I cleaned them all with a citrus/orange-cleaner/degreaser, followed by another good scrub in soapy water, which is the same thing I do with resin models. I can't think of why the other cleaner would have an effect, but I suppose it's possible - although it doesn't explain the weird variable results on the same model.

 

Any help? I do have a few bottles of other brands I can try, but my ratio of patience to frustration is going down quickly.

 

- H8

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Are you experiencing this and testing on a single figure, or this was a batch you prepared in the same way? All my testing was with Bones straight out of the blister and unwashed. For personal use, I have been washing the Bones with dish soap and have not experienced problems like you describe. There was a fellow who posted a thread having problems with one particular figure in his collection, but he has not confirmed whether he continued to have problems if he tested on a few others. There are a few tips and ideas in that thread you could read through, also. http://www.reapermini.com/forum/index.php?/topic/50633-working-with-rolf-the-bones-werewolf-sharing-some-lessons-learned-seeking-advice/

 

I believe there are some variations in the material mix so it's possible that an oddity will pop up here and there. If it's happening on a number of the figures, it might also be possible it relates to your cleaning method? Did you clean all of your figures that way or do you still have some that you haven't washed yet? If the latter, you could try cleaning one or two with just dish soap and see if it behaves differently, or even just try painting directly onto an unwashed one. If the former, you could try pouring some dish soap right on one of the figures and giving it a good scrub with a brush. If your citrus cleaner was anything like Goo Gone, it might take a bit of doing to get all of it off and maybe that film is interfering with the paint adhesiion?

 

Do you mount the mini on a holder when you paint? If you hold the figure directly when you paint, you're depositing your own skin oils on it that can sometimes interfere with paint, and you're also rubbing the paint before it has time to completely adhere. Acrylic paint is dry to the touch within seconds/minutes, but takes a bit longer than that to cure to full strength of adhesion.

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When I first got back into minis a few years back I read an article on the pros and cons of gesso. I picked up a huge bottle of Liquitex white gesso, oh 3 or so years ago now. I have never seriously used it for priming because I got started using the RMS brush ons. Last night I dug it out to give a test go. I mixed a little black in with the gesso (I prefer priming a light grey) and then gloppily glopped glops of it onto a Bones gobbo and a skeleton archer. I am pretty amazed at how much it shrunk. I can't see any discernible detail loss, in fact it has helped make some of them more visible. I am currently prepping a second test round to do the same. I will follow up with results.

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When I first got back into minis a few years back I read an article on the pros and cons of gesso. I picked up a huge bottle of Liquitex white gesso, oh 3 or so years ago now. I have never seriously used it for priming because I got started using the RMS brush ons. Last night I dug it out to give a test go. I mixed a little black in with the gesso (I prefer priming a light grey) and then gloppily glopped glops of it onto a Bones gobbo and a skeleton archer. I am pretty amazed at how much it shrunk. I can't see any discernible detail loss, in fact it has helped make some of them more visible. I am currently prepping a second test round to do the same. I will follow up with results.

 

I have never been convinced about the qualities of gesso for priming miniatures. People swear by it, but I have always been skeptical that something so thick will not fill in detail, even when it shrinks. I would love to see some before and after pictures of this.

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