wdmartin

77279 Narthrax the White

82 posts in this topic

48 minutes ago, wdmartin said:

Question to the room: is it better to:

 

  1. Assemble the model
  2. Greenstuff the gaps
  3. Paint

 

or

 

  1. Paint
  2. Assemble
  3. Greenstuff
  4. Paint the greenstuff

 

?

 

Think about how hard it will be to get into the interior spaces, then assemble as far as you can before you start painting.

 

Painting is easiest if you can do all the adjacent bits of the same color in one swell foop; if you have to paint, then assemble/fill, then paint again, you can't do that. But it's just easier when it's possible, not some sort of a mandate. Sometimes other considerations make the total effort of assembling almost last a better choice.

 

TL;DR: It depends. ::D:

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... y'know, I'm only about half smart. If I'd been thinking, I would have suggested you look into nail decorating charms; they make tiny gemstones and the like for silly girls (like me, occasionally) to decorate their nails with. Tiny gemstones, weird coin-like things, teeny pearls .. all kinds of weird stuff. Some might work for what you want.

 

That's where the flakies I used on Opal's head came from.

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19 hours ago, wdmartin said:

@Sylverthorne I spent ages going through the packs of assorted gem stones at Michael's, and they were all either A) too big, or B) in a much larger quantity than I need.  I don't need 80 of these, or 120.  Or more like way more than that, since they didn't have any packs of mixed colors -- it was all one-color blister packs.

 

However, I have since learned that artbeads.com will sell you individual teeny swarovski crystals.  I may go that route, assuming I can't get any of the crystals off the bead I bought.

 

Question to the room: is it better to:

 

  1. Assemble the model
  2. Greenstuff the gaps
  3. Paint

 

or

 

  1. Paint
  2. Assemble
  3. Greenstuff
  4. Paint the greenstuff

 

?

 

I haven't done many large models, so I would be interested to hear opinions on this topic.

 

No particular progress since last update other than I spent a bunch of time hunting down mold lines.

 

On 3/26/2017 at 2:48 PM, knarthex said:

Oh, before I forget....

 

I think that I learned something here that I will be sure to use on the next dragons that I do....

 

I should have done the green stuffing of the wings first....

 

But you say, George, wouldn't that mean assembling first?

No, not really...

 

The head and fore leg I am not worried about, but I should have put 2 pins in each wing and fitted them in place.

Taken them out and put green stuff around the openings, and a liberal coating of vaseline on the wings, and pushed them together, and done the sculpting then...

Then when the putty cured, pulled the wings back out, scrubbed the vaseline off of everything, and then primed......

 

Now, after I assemble him, I am going to have to put the green stuff on top of the paint, and then try to match everything that I had done previously....

 

Something to think about when you start a dragon folks....

my 2 coppers...

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4 hours ago, knarthex said:

 

Taken them out and put green stuff around the openings, and a liberal coating of vaseline on the wings, and pushed them together, and done the sculpting then...

Then when the putty cured, pulled the wings back out, scrubbed the vaseline off of everything, and then primed......

 

Does the vaseline trick really work?  No adverse effects with the curing of the green stuff?  Wings pull out easily? 

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Back from Gen Con.

 

I did a few interesting things, and met a few people (briefly, at least).  One high point was showing my three most recent minis to a professional painter at the Privateer Press booth and getting some feedback -- he said my brushwork was clean, but I needed to improve on blacklining in areas with similar colors adjacent to one another, in order to help the eye differentiate between regions a bit more clearly.  I was grateful to get such concrete, actionable feedback.  Also, I was a bit surprised not to find a Reaper presence anywhere.  Maybe they were there and I just didn't know where to look?

 

It was ... a highly mixed experience.  Five out of my six planned events fell apart for one reason or another, leaving me scrambling to find other things to do for almost my entire stay.  I didn't bring any friends, and knew no one there, which I found isolating (and not in a good way).  All in all I'm not sure it was worth the expense.

 

Be that as it may, back to Narthrax!  I have the results of some experiments here.

 

narthrax-14.jpg.f12d3e0539ebadeb560941ced117592e.jpg

 

The Realistic Water I put into that base and then sprayed with Dullcote while it was still wet frosted up fine.  A bit too much, though -- the frost parts are too opaque to let you see the lettering underneath, which means they would also obscure buried treasures.  Also, as the Realistic Water continued to dry it shrank, causing the frosty coat to split into that jagged half-moon shape on the right.  While that is an interesting result in itself, I think it would be rather hard to use in a controlled way.

 

I also started slicing coins off my little greenstuff sausages.  I've finished the first one now, and sorted out all the slices that came out squashed, uneven width, too thin, or otherwise too deformed for use as coins.

 

The three shiny spheres there are silica gel, from a packet that was included in my copy of Near and Far as a desiccant.  I saw a mini once where a lady used them to make super-smooth bubbles on the surface of a lava flow.  I'm wondering if they would be visible within a thick bit of Realistic Water as "air bubbles".  It probably depends on whether the index of refraction differs between the two materials.

 

More science is called for!  These are the water-making materials at my disposal:

 

narthrax-15.jpg.3eefacfc449de8c32a09daddaca55c08.jpg

 

From left to right, Realistic Water, Water Effects, Water Texture, and some kind of weird glossy epoxy stuff.  I've never used any of them except the Realistic Water.  Oh, and the Distress Crackle Paint at the end is something I picked up for broken ice areas, based on a tutorial by MonkeySloth.

 

I also picked up some Mod Podge with the idea that I can use that to build up some of the terrain on the wood surface surrounding the base.  It's another thing I've never used.  So much to learn. O_O

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More stuff done.  It hardly feels like progress, though.

 

I took a reaper 3-inch base, put a sheet of wax paper over it, and blopped a bunch of that Distress Crackle Paint into it.  Here's the initial pour:

 

narthrax-16.jpg.8d738abcf6effb40c6d692dc228fadaa.jpg

 

And after 24 hours:

 

narthrax-17.jpg.606af5088f8718935c854f31f93c5330.jpg

 

48 hours:

 

narthrax-18.jpg.21a170256b503db84a3df6a33067a2ca.jpg

 

And finally, popped it all off and crunched it a bit for a bunch of crystal-like shards that I can stick in as bits of ice:

 

narthrax-19.jpg.07ad2a70e81892ebe99efc7d854fbe6a.jpg

 

I really need to figure out some what to sculpt some terrain on the areas around the base.  My efforts thus far have been unsatisfactory.  I tried out some Mod Podge on a standard medium size base:

 

narthrax-20.jpg.c86ff8d546a40d84402670c3d618f28e.jpg

 

I just sort of shlooped it on there, came back 20 minutes later and mashed it a bit, then let it dry.

 

narthrax-21.jpg.f3fc1bfde91c3aa17d8c4c028c95b8c9.jpg

 

MUCH too smooth.  I need it to be grainy and textured.  So next I tried some greenstuff, on another medium size base:

 

narthrax-22.jpg.3b7e8236b89cb180c817556e87c429f5.jpg

 

I mashed a rock into it a few times in hopes of leaving a nice rocky pattern on there, but it didn't really work very well.  Finally I poked a sculpting tool in it a bunch to make a little pond-like area.

 

Yeah, I wasn't impressed either.  I did sign up for a class on greenstuff at Gen Con, but it got canceled because the person who was supposed to run it got a job as a professor at an art school and had to go start the term.

 

So ... I'm not sure quite what to do about the terrain at this point.  I found monoRAIL's Narthrax base super inspiring for this project.  In that case, the terrain material was plaster.  But I've looked around, and nobody seems to want to sell me plaster of paris in any size less than a four pound bucket.  That's about 50 times what I actually need, and the remainder is either going to wind up taking up space in my closet forever or else getting tossed, which feels wasteful.  So I'm hesitant to buy it.  But I don't really know what else to do.

 

I've already got some sculpey, I guess I could use that, only I'm not sure that the wood base would survive being baked in the oven at 275 degrees for 15-20 minutes.  Hrm.  I'll have to think about it.  Any suggestions welcome.

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It occurs to me that I am a complete numbskull.  All this time I've been worrying about finding ways to make rough, stony terrain, when I had this stuff on the rarely-used shelf:

 

narthrax-23.jpg.956b0014a9ef2ddf53f78da7d9cfbd18.jpg

 

I'll just slather some of that on there.  Problem solved.

 

And thus I have proceeded.  Pins!

 

narthrax-24.jpg.d287996327dd1d7fdf21945c034b488f.jpg

 

Perch attachment!

 

narthrax-25.jpg.dddd95b16d5882eecbbe9d254eccb128.jpg

 

narthrax-26.jpg.159bece043b0ab921d6cec6c711eda1d.jpg

 

Sadly it's pretty heavily warped, which I discovered after the glue was in place.  The picture doesn't really do it justice -- it's almost a quarter of an inch gap on both sides in the middle of the perch.  I'm trying to decide whether to pop it off and boil it to unwarp it, or just plug it with greenstuff.

 

I also put some pins into Narthrax's tail and wings (not pictured).  @knarthex, your method of assembly seems interesting.  How do you get the vaseline out of the holes afterward?  Just scrubbing and q-tips or something?

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Don't worry about the gaps on the base.    Simply use your extra ground cover to block those.  It will help integrate the flat base part with the stones as well if you just start a bit thicker where the gap is and thin it out as you move towards the outer edge.

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Posted (edited)

On 8/21/2017 at 4:15 PM, wdmartin said:

Back from Gen Con.

 

I did a few interesting things, and met a few people (briefly, at least).  One high point was showing my three most recent minis to a professional painter at the Privateer Press booth and getting some feedback -- he said my brushwork was clean, but I needed to improve on blacklining in areas with similar colors adjacent to one another, in order to help the eye differentiate between regions a bit more clearly.  I was grateful to get such concrete, actionable feedback.  Also, I was a bit surprised not to find a Reaper presence anywhere.  Maybe they were there and I just didn't know where to look?

 

It was ... a highly mixed experience.  Five out of my six planned events fell apart for one reason or another, leaving me scrambling to find other things to do for almost my entire stay.  I didn't bring any friends, and knew no one there, which I found isolating (and not in a good way).  All in all I'm not sure it was worth the expense.

 

Be that as it may, back to Narthrax!  I have the results of some experiments here.

 

narthrax-14.jpg.f12d3e0539ebadeb560941ced117592e.jpg

 

The Realistic Water I put into that base and then sprayed with Dullcote while it was still wet frosted up fine.  A bit too much, though -- the frost parts are too opaque to let you see the lettering underneath, which means they would also obscure buried treasures.  Also, as the Realistic Water continued to dry it shrank, causing the frosty coat to split into that jagged half-moon shape on the right.  While that is an interesting result in itself, I think it would be rather hard to use in a controlled way.

 

I also started slicing coins off my little greenstuff sausages.  I've finished the first one now, and sorted out all the slices that came out squashed, uneven width, too thin, or otherwise too deformed for use as coins.

 

The three shiny spheres there are silica gel, from a packet that was included in my copy of Near and Far as a desiccant.  I saw a mini once where a lady used them to make super-smooth bubbles on the surface of a lava flow.  I'm wondering if they would be visible within a thick bit of Realistic Water as "air bubbles".  It probably depends on whether the index of refraction differs between the two materials.

 

More science is called for!  These are the water-making materials at my disposal:

 

narthrax-15.jpg.3eefacfc449de8c32a09daddaca55c08.jpg

 

From left to right, Realistic Water, Water Effects, Water Texture, and some kind of weird glossy epoxy stuff.  I've never used any of them except the Realistic Water.  Oh, and the Distress Crackle Paint at the end is something I picked up for broken ice areas, based on a tutorial by MonkeySloth.

 

I also picked up some Mod Podge with the idea that I can use that to build up some of the terrain on the wood surface surrounding the base.  It's another thing I've never used.  So much to learn. O_O

 

 

I've used realistic water and the wierd glossy epoxy stuff.  The wierd glossy epoxy stuff is amazing for standing water effects like pools in a swamp or such.  I highly recommend it.

Edited by edz16
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@robinh Thanks!   I did just that.

 

narthrax-27.jpg.42e6a7706a21bfe2b83b572f0440a40e.jpg

 

narthrax-28.jpg.8fcc92bb38697f3988094d8756704e43.jpg

 

narthrax-29.jpg.d59ca36cd9652e7c97ad55a0e3c8040d.jpg

 

This is the coarse pumice gel.  It's pretty thick on there, so I plan to let it dry for at least 24 hours before I go back and add fine pumice gel out to the edges in most places.  Then I'll let it dry again thoroughly before proceeding with the painting.

 

I'm not sure whether the pumice gel will need to be primed or if I can just start painting on it.  The base medium is an acrylic gel, but it's got pumice in it of course.

 

I've been thinking about colors for the base, and I want a blue-ish grey as the base.  Slate blue, or similar.  I'm thinking of starting with Blue Liner mixed with Stone Grey.

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I got impatient.  Also it occurred to me that it might be easier to blend the fine and coarse pumice together if I worked while they were both still wet and could be smooshed into one another.

 

narthrax-30.jpg.1b7a75fd5dc109731f56593764c2f9ea.jpg

 

narthrax-31.jpg.c92654458c6702839838b4f50c271198.jpg

 

NOW it gets to dry.

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Patience Grasshopper!  

 

 

Using the Liners would be the equivalent of priming.  Watch the pumice though it might suck up a lot of paint if not sealed first.

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What did you do to get your greenstuff cylinders so perfect to cut out coins?

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Posted (edited)

@edz16 -- nothing fancy.  I just rolled them back and forth on a smooth surface until they were smooth and about a millimeter across.

 

EDIT:  Oh, and it's important to hang them, up and down, so that the rolls don't deform themselves under their own weight as they cure.

Edited by wdmartin
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And it is fully dry!

 

narthrax-32.jpg.7ae2073fdfb9a07e523bd2229eae6e9d.jpg

 

narthrax-33.jpg.65034adfddfdaeab39b4255345cece85.jpg

 

And that means it's time for a color test on another base to see if my color plan will work.  So here's a Micro Arts Studio, base coated in 1:! Blue Liner/Stone Grey:

 

narthrax-34.jpg.3bdebb30822a7b36d2200fcafe8dcff0.jpg

 

And a single pass of dry-brushed Stone Grey.

 

narthrax-35.jpg.ab419d3cf4b30ce69be42f0af59754cd.jpg

 

Second pass of Stone Grey dry brushing.

 

narthrax-36.jpg.aa2a245689c0aba651519053ad75a576.jpg

 

A light dry brush of Aged Bone on the highest spots.

 

narthrax-37.jpg.29d53f2ba7e7580e1335d90fcaeff59a.jpg

 

And I brushed some Blue Liner -- heavily thinned with water -- into the deepest spots.  Liner is great for stuff like that.  Pity about odor.  The stuff is rather pungent.

 

narthrax-38.jpg.458d1cc46b3d7a8ce335d1f5e2199ec9.jpg

 

And a finished base, with a layer of Green Liner on the mossy bits.  I tried dry-brushing them with Meadow Green.  It's visible in the hand, but didn't photograph very well.

 

narthrax-39.jpg.aa70f6ff792947234151af483b27214f.jpg

 

narthrax-40.jpg.7fa9f236626ec9e3c066988cefe1e4d4.jpg

 

The lip around it is Walnut Brown.

 

I think that'll do.  Now, on to base coating the actual base!

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