Crowley

Getting to know each other, October edition

633 posts in this topic

How about politicians? :rolleyes:

 

Liches, if done right. I mean, it's someone who voluntarily cursed themselves just for power. Like, Voldemort level of cursing oneself. That's not a person you want to have tea and cakes with. 

 

Aside from that that I can't really think of different monsters. It'd be great to see some of the classics done in a truly horrifying way though.

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Stephen King came up with an idea, the Monster Tarot, where each monster is an iconic "type."

The Universal boatload starts us off: The Vampire, the Created (Frankenstein), the Mummy, and the Werewolf. To round off the Universal boxed set, we'll add the Creature, although its movies were made LONG after the iconic first three (The Wolf Man premiered the same weekend that Pearl Harbor got bombed, nine years after the circus got started). 

As far as icons go, King adds The Ghost (tucked in there because, c'mon, ghost stories have been around forever) and the Zombie, raised by voodoo magic to serve an evil magician.

So if I wuz gonna add on other horrors that have become iconic... well, I'd start with the Inexorable Killer, since Halloween movies and Michael Myers are STILL being made, and mighod, the seventies and eighties were festooned with Halloween ripoffs, notably the Friday the 13th movies, which achieved a certain inertia of their own. The Inexorable Killer's trademarks are that he seldom if ever speaks, he can be defeated, but never for long, he seldom runs, preferring to walk, and he usually wears a mask and carries a big knife. As a bow to FT13, the killer may or may not be undead... or a robot.

I dunno about Freddy Krueger and Nightmare On Elm Street. He'd either be just a subcategory of Ghost, or a category of his own: the Dream Demon. I tend toward the former, as while Krueger was very successful, he didn't spawn a lot of imitators. He's popular, but not iconic. I'd think Freddy deserves his own Minor Arcana card, but not one of the big ones.

The Hungry Dead are a subcategory of Zombie, but I think they've been around long enough and spawned enough film and literature that they deserve a card of their own.

The Mad Scientist is often found near The Created, but he doesn't always have a monster to torment. Nowadays, he's more into viruses and genetic experiments.

The Devil has been around long enough. Call it The Demon, and you can add succubi and Cenobites to the mix.

The Named Thing is often a subcategory of Ghost, but there are a BUNCH of them... Bloody Mary, Candyman, Beetlejuice... who can be summoned with mirrors and repeating their names. Perhaps a minor arcana card?

The Cryptid covers everything from Bigfoot to the flesh eating troglodytes of The Descent, and arguably includes The Creature From The Black Lagoon.

The Witch has to go in there. And I don't care, I thought Hansel And Gretel, Witch Hunters was hilarious goofy fun.

The Thing With Two Faces starts with Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde, and covers a lot of ground.

 

The Mad starts with Renfield and ends with The Joker, perhaps. It also includes the cultists you'll see for...

The Eldritch is a catchall term for the entire Cthulhu Mythos, anything that comes through a portal to ravage our world...

The Thing From Beyond The Stars is the sciencey equivalent, anything from Alien Xenomorphs to garden variety invaders to The Blob.

Am I leaving anything out? Sure I am...

EDIT:

13 minutes ago, Argentee said:

Feed and it’s sequels by Mira Grant. I love the world building. 

 

Mira Grant's zombie novels are WAY better than the average, and the Feed trilogy is essentially a political thriller set in a world where zombies are real.

And Cyradis is right, The Fey deserve their own Tarot card, even though the only movie I can think of that addresses them is the Leprechaun series.

Edited by Dr.Bedlam
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People nowadays thing fairies were sweet, baby loving creatures. Well, they loved babies, but not in the same way mommies love them. Fey are either utterly indifferent to mortals, or we're their play things. Roll the dice and find out. Fey are terrifying.

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Movies regarding the fey, what about Pan's Labyrinth or Hellboy II?

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3 minutes ago, Loim said:

Movies regarding the fey, what about Pan's Labyrinth or Hellboy II?

 

I hadn't thought of those as horror movies, per se, but you make a fine point.

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Again, Lost Girl involved fey a lot. They had the succubi incorporated into fey instead of demons, as were were-creatures and vampires. 

 

Pan's Labyrinth is a good example for sure. 

 

Arguably, Labyrinth. Bowie was a very fairy-like goblin. Not horror, but kinda twisted for kids. 

 

 

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If you are including Fey... which way is that being played out?  As the sidhe and the wild hunt?  The courts of the seasons?  

Again, the hard part is humanizing them.  At first appearance they generally appear as beautiful creatures.  As stories progress, they typically have different moralities than humans which often ends in horror for the humans.  Attempting to humanize fae / fey creatures is a study in beauty and in otherworldliness.  Things we all want, but don't necessarily sympathize with.  Only when things go bad do we begin to empathize... but not usually with the fey.

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4 hours ago, Crowley said:

Question for Thursday, October 12th:

Dracula, the werewolf, the mummy (among others) are all iconic monsters. What monster deserves to be added to that rarefied pantheon? Is there one that needs to be kicked back down into the crypt?

 

Clowns man.

 

Seriously though, I actually agree fey, but I think the problem with them becoming iconic is that they represent such a wide array of "monsters" not all of which are necessarily evil, etc. In terms of a new monster to add to the iconic roll call maybe dragons. I mean they are already fairly iconic BUT you don't see a whole lot of movies/TV with them due to a) hard to portray them well and b) hard to portray them well and keep the costs relatively low. I suppose we could also add in Satan himself what with the likes of Devil's Advocate, Supernatural and now Lucifer, all of which are great. 

 

I do think zombies and vampires are getting a bit played out at the moment though. That doesn't mean that there are not good examples out there and still being made but c'mon we've got a generation of teen aged girls who think vampires sparkle now for cryin out loud! That said, Bram Stoker's Dracula with Gary Oldman and (surprisingly) Keanu will long be near the top of my all time faves. It pretty much landed at just the right time for me both in terms of story and providing nice . . . ummmm . . . scenery for a hormonal 15 year old kid in the days before the Intarwebz. :p 

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Not sure we WANNA humanize or sympathize with the Fey.

It's like vampires. Vampires were once considered hideous inhuman corpse horrors who stalked the living for blood. Some cultures even plugged 'em into Hungry Dead or Hungry Ghost territory. Only after baking at 350 for a couple centuries in the warmth of Western culture do we get the kind that sparkle and fall in love. Even as late as Christopher Lee Hammer movies, Dracula was a hideous unhuman THING driven by a lust for blood; he was just good at faking human behavior and charm for short periods in order to get close to his prey. Christopher Lee's Dracula was NOT a sympathetic character, and he had only the semblance of humanity.

Seems like Fey are pretty similar, particularly as portrayed in Pan's Labyrinth.

 

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53 minutes ago, Grayfax said:

A well done werewolf, say the Van Helsing werewolf is almost as good as a World of Darkness war form, but still not as scary.  I can't think of a single werewolf that actually lives up to the World of Darkness werewolves, which is sad to me.  

 

It says something that even vampires find WoD werewolves scary.

 

(A thoughtful post overall, thanks.)

 

 

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And Garg kinda ninja'd me with certain thoughts.

Another card to consider is the Driven, an ordinary person driven to monstrousness as a result of the evil that men do; an otherwise sympathetic character who goes off the deep end and becomes a monster. There are several angsty teenagers who fit this archetype, notably Carrie, but the character D-FENS from the movie Falling Down could qualify; he starts the movie just wanting to attend his little girl's birthday party, and by the end of the movie, he's armed like Rambo, has killed several and spread much chaos, and is the subject of an LAPD manhunt.

I also agree that clowns belong in there somewhere, although all the horror clowns I can think of actually fit into other categories; in It, Pennywise is an avatar of an Eldritch Abomination. In Killer Klowns From Outer Space, they're Things From Beyond The Stars. In a few other movies, they range from The Mad to Inexorable Killers. But the image of the Evil Clown is indeed what I'd call iconic...

Edited by Dr.Bedlam
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32 minutes ago, Dr.Bedlam said:

Another card to consider is the Driven, an ordinary person driven to monstrousness as a result of the evil that men do; an otherwise sympathetic character who goes off the deep end and becomes a monster. There are several angsty teenagers who fit this archetype, notably Carrie, but the character D-FENS from the movie Falling Down could qualify; he starts the movie just wanting to attend his little girl's birthday party, and by the end of the movie, he's armed like Rambo, has killed several and spread much chaos, and is the subject of an LAPD manhunt.

 

Maybe it's just me, but I never saw Carrie as the monster.  Granted, it's been decades since I've seen the movie or read the book; but I always viewed it as a tragic tale, or maybe a cautionary tale about religious nutjob parents.

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22 minutes ago, VitM said:

 

Maybe it's just me, but I never saw Carrie as the monster.  Granted, it's been decades since I've seen the movie or read the book; but I always viewed it as a tragic tale, or maybe a cautionary tale about religious nutjob parents.

 

I would respectfully disagree.

Very FEW characters in Carrie are sympathetic; Sue Snell and her boyfriend and the guidance counselor are the only people in the book who sympathize with poor Carrie White. Carrie's mom and most of the population of the high school are monsters at worst, and indifferent at best. And Carrie's sympathetic because she's innocent, confused, abused, tortured, and acted out upon.

And then, at the very pinnacle of her happiness, she gets crapt upon again. And she snaps. And in the book, she STARTS by slaughtering most of her high school (as in the movie) and finishes by blasting a goodly portion of the TOWN.

It is true we sympathize with her; we are aware of her pain and her reasons. But frying a high school prom still makes you a monster, no? And Carrie's MOM is indeed a monster, albeit a monster with the best of intentions. She still tortures and abuses Carrie to the point where Carrie kills her.

That's why I named this particular card "The Driven." Because Carrie's none too stable at the BEGINNING of the story, and by the end, she is driven to act in monstrous ways.

D-FENS is a similar character, albeit without the telekinesis, and Falling Down is arguably a horror movie; dunno about YOU, but the idea of a psychotic heavily armed businessman bursting into the McDonalds where I'm having lunch and screaming and jabbering and waving an automatic weapon around because his hamburger doesn't look like the one in the picture, to me, IS a horror scenario, particularly if I'm there with the kids. And all he wanted at the beginning of the movie was to see his little girl for her birthday.

In the course of the movie, we discover he's lost his job, he has anger control issues, and his wife has a restraining order on him. We sympathize, though, because he's having a really, REALLY rotten day. But, again, this does not excuse his actions, even though many of his victims were complete jerks; the people in the restaurant certainly don't deserve what happens. And the key point to The Driven is that they don't realize what they have become... or if they do, it's much too late.

D-FENS: "I'M the bad guy?"

Edited by Dr.Bedlam
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5 hours ago, Crowley said:

Question for Thursday, October 12th:

Dracula, the Werewolf, the Mummy (among others) are all iconic monsters. What monster deserves to be added to that rarefied pantheon? Is there one that needs to be kicked back down into the crypt?

 

Cthulhu :ph34r:

 

Also:

whatshisname, whathisname, whatshisname ... never say it three times. 

 

They all need to be kicked back down into the crypt ...except maybe the wolf. 

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Funny thing? Whole reason Cthulhu got popular was because he was a departure from the other traditional ghosties and spookies... he was something different.

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