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Star Wars: What's going on? (SPOILERS)

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9 hours ago, Erifnogard said:

I can ignore the open bomb bay not suffocating everybody since they have those force fields on all the hanger doors anyway but ignoring the lack of gravity just took me out of the  moment. 

I actually just read that the bombs used a magnetic system to "find" the target. So I guess they're more of a mine than a bomb. If they were magnetic they certainly could have shown this better on screen, I only know because of extra material. Extra material should enhance the experience not explain every oversight.

1 hour ago, Lord of the Dish Pit said:

Disney seems to have no clue as to how to tell a story in three parts.

I completely agree. Why even have Smoke in the second movie if he doesn't really do anything. We spent so much time wondering who he was and we don't even get a decent fight from him before he dies? That takes a lot from the character, you can't set him up to be a replacement version of the Emperor without a satisfying conclusion. 

1 hour ago, Lord of the Dish Pit said:

They spent quite a bit of money to acquire star wars and so one would think that a valuable franchise like this would be handled with a great deal more care, rather than let thier directors sabotoge each other. At the very least that there would be an overarching outline as to what the overall story of this trilogy was to be.

I'm with you on this. Why spend so much money on a franchise if you're going to release such a disjointed triliogy. That's what these three movies are supposed to be a trilogy, but no matter how they do the final movie one of them is going to be the odd man out. 

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I ended up seeing it twice in a 3 day span. The fist time (opening night, 3D, IMAX, reserve seating) I did not like it. The second time (regular showing, regular seating, matinee) I liked it a little better as I was able to just relax and enjoy it and not be so critical.

 

What I liked:

* I liked Rose. She was the only real "heart" of the movie. I liked her sadness and joy and her view of the world... like the Racing beasts and the corrupt rich...

* I liked the special effects. The new bombers were cool.

* Both Duel scenes. Kylo and Rey vs Snoke, Luke vs Kylo. Not story wise, but from a cool scene wise.

 

What I didn't like:

* The squad attacking the big bad thing and all but one dying but mission accomplished... The first time it was fine... I mean it is in practically every starwars movie.... but it was done multiple times in this one. I feel like they could have built tension in another way.

* The Odd love triangles they are trying to set up. It feels forced. Rey, Rose, Finn, Kylo, and Poe... do they all have to be in love with each other or multiple people to have a compelling character arc? I was kind of rooting for Kylo/Rey... don't know why...

* The whole interaction between Po and The admiral... when you are down to 200 people and facing imminent death, you cant share a plan with a trusted member before a mutiny attempt is made?

* The Luke Island scenes... While I do like Cranky Luke.. The set up was way too long. I agree that Yoda being in it was weird... I think they could have kept him in it and had more impact on the story... Like when Ben appeared on Dagobah while Luke was training.

* Deaths.... I get that the tragic deaths make the story more meaningful, but they would show a cool character... one that you wanted to get to know, then kill them without a second glance... Roses sister, the Bomber captain, and the female fighter pilot who died in the hanger.

* Comedy. A little goes a long way. Some parts were enjoyable.... but they used the Puffins too much... and the initial "I'm on hold for ...." this was pretty bad... I laughed... but that seemed really out of place... I just cant picture call waiting, or anyone being dumb enough to fall for that.

* Force use. The Snoke scene had some cool force use before battle... and Kylo used the force to snuff Snoke, but why didn't Rey or Kylo use the force in battling the Red Guard... If the guard was immune to force powers, they could have shown them try and it not work.... but not using the force seemed off in such a pitched battle.

 

So: looks like I did not like a lot... But overall I will say that I did "like" the movie. It is not my favorite, but unlike what others have said it did "feel" like a starwars movie with all of the flaws that come with that. Incidentally my favorite Starwars movie is still Rogue One... and that is more because I liked the characters and felt their story.... Here I like Rey, Rose, Finn and yes even Kylo... Not a fan of Poe... Sorry for the long post... at home sick in bed...

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I apparently disagree from most. I found The Last Jedi to be my favorite Star Wars movie thus far. Then again, I only recently watched the originals through for the first time (and have only gotten the cliff notes for the prequels), so I had much different expectations from most people.

 

I will admit, the story telling seemed a bit choppy, but I think that served a purpose. The movie in general felt more like an opera than before, with separate "acts". Each part led into the next, albeit in unexpected ways. 

 

I actually loved seeing Rey's abilities. Her being "no one" I think is important, just like her discussion with Kylo. This may be biased by the extended universe as explained to me, but I think she is the last part of the force's attempt to balance itself. In the end, I'm hoping that both Rey and Kylo become Gray Knights - original Jedi. Luke's point was that the Jedi order was WRONG. If you treat it as a part of the series as a whole, instead of only a member of the trilogy, you can see a bit more of a break down of "What is the force, why can people access it, what is balance". Rey didn't need the Jedi's teachings because she has an innate sense of balance. She lets some of the dark side of the force in, along with the light. Kylo lets in some of the light side, along with the dark.

 

I don't think Rey is a Jedi, and Kylo is blatantly not a Sith. This is important, and I think the final movie will tie these ideas together, in the end.

 

 

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14 minutes ago, Paradoxical Mouse said:

I apparently disagree from most. I found The Last Jedi to be my favorite Star Wars movie thus far. Then again, I only recently watched the originals through for the first time (and have only gotten the cliff notes for the prequels), so I had much different expectations from most people.

 

I will admit, the story telling seemed a bit choppy, but I think that served a purpose. The movie in general felt more like an opera than before, with separate "acts". Each part led into the next, albeit in unexpected ways. 

 

I actually loved seeing Rey's abilities. Her being "no one" I think is important, just like her discussion with Kylo. This may be biased by the extended universe as explained to me, but I think she is the last part of the force's attempt to balance itself. In the end, I'm hoping that both Rey and Kylo become Gray Knights - original Jedi. Luke's point was that the Jedi order was WRONG. If you treat it as a part of the series as a whole, instead of only a member of the trilogy, you can see a bit more of a break down of "What is the force, why can people access it, what is balance". Rey didn't need the Jedi's teachings because she has an innate sense of balance. She lets some of the dark side of the force in, along with the light. Kylo lets in some of the light side, along with the dark.

 

I don't think Rey is a Jedi, and Kylo is blatantly not a Sith. This is important, and I think the final movie will tie these ideas together, in the end.

 

 

 

I loved it too. You’re not alone.

 

I saw the film with someone well acquainted with all of Campbell’s theories about heroes’ journies and with someone else with an encyclopedic knowledge of modern tropes, and both of them were delighted that they could not predict where the film was going. 

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2 hours ago, Pingo said:

 

I loved it too. You’re not alone.

 

 

Me too.  I just haven't decided if I liked it more than Empire Strikes Back, which has been my favorite so far. 

 

Something I've noticed as a trend ever since Episode 1 was released - people complaining that the latest movie "wasn't Star Wars" or that "it wasn't very good." IMO, if you really want to criticize Star Wars, the original movies aren't that good either. They can just as easily be nitpicked apart as the newer movies. I think a lot of older fans forget that, because all they're remembering is the awe of the special effects, and that everything about Jedi and the Force was shiny and new back then. 

Just remember - all of these sentences are valid in one way or another:

- the Best thing to happen to Star Wars was George Lucas

- the Worst thing to happen to Star Wars was George Lucas

- the Best thing to happen to Star Wars was Disney

- the Worst thing to happen to Star Wars was Disney

- the Best things to happen to Star Wars are its fans

- the Worst things to happen to Star Wars are its fans

 

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I saw it yesterday for the first time and I really liked it.

Yes there were a few things that didn't quite add up or could have used more background, but that's true of the original three movies too.

Overall it was what I was expecting from a Star Wars movie.

 

If I had one disappointment it would be that as the middle movie of a trilogy, it didn't end with as strong a cliffhanger as The Empire Strikes Back did. Which is too bad cause I think they had several opportunities to do so.

 

Oh, and it was totally worth it to splurge and spend the extra $$$ for 3D and to lie back in one of those reclining motion chairs. 

 

During the battle scenes it was like being in a ride at Disneyland. ::D:

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Just saw it today. Here are my initial thinkings from my tired, post-grocery shopping brain.

 

Rey's parentage is still an unknown. Kylo doesn't really know who her parents are any more than Rey does. He's gaslighting her, trying to trick and control her. Kylo is vain, possibly narcissistic, and an broccoli. (Really, you need to steam iron your black suit?)

 

The Porg and Crystal Fox things (I loved those), and human-face horse critters all reminded me of... Pokemon. Now you'll see it, too.

 

The link between Kylo and Rey... it is strong, which leads me to believe they are as related as Luke and Leia. This was, to me, kinda lame. It seems they wanted more interaction between the characters to create tension between them, and used this sudden, mysterious link to do it. There were better ways.

 

I was not the only one in my group to notice the kid at the end. The broom moved to his hand, he didn't grab it. The stuff he swept moved just before the broom hit it. Young child is strong in the force.

 

Forced love connections: Hated them all. They can go away.

 

Phasma: she fell through a fireball. It is possible to see her again with a huge vendetta against Finn. After all, Vader survived a volcano. Remember, unless you see a verifiable body on a slab, they aren't dead.

 

Luke: I predicted the hologram as soon as he appeared. Something seemed off. His "death" was more him accepting he is part of the force, finally realizing it instead of rejecting it, and discovering what Kenobi had said so long ago... he is far more powerful after death. This is not the last we'll see of Luke.

 

The extra long OJ Simpson spacechase. This was... facepalming. "Aaaah they're chasing us!!!"

 

Ending: It was done poorly. It would be good for the final movie of the trilogy, to show there never really is an end, but in part II of III? Yeeeeahno.

 

Yes, there were many things that were problematic with the plot (the whole Finn/Rose mission) and I would have loved to see more of Holdo. I love Laura Dern and wished we had seen more of her character's capabilities. Poe's taunting at the beginning I found hilarious. He was buying time and pissing Gen. Hux off. This seems to be Poe's special ability. The mutiny was uncalled for. Much of the movie could have been rewritten to be better.

 

Overall I did like it, but some of the movie seemed to be filler for "what's happening with the others while Luke and Rey do stuff." As a DM, this was definitely more worthy of "Luke & Rey, you and I will have to get together on another day before [Main Game Session Day] to work out what happens on the island so you will be ready to come in during the main plot on [Main Game Session Day].

Edited by Aryanun
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I'm basically ambivalent in regards to this movie. I think that the biggest thing that stuck out in my mind was seeing the crystal foxes & thinking @Glitterwolf's spawn were in the movie. :lol: 

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11 hours ago, Aryanun said:

The link between Kylo and Rey... it is strong, which leads me to believe they are as related as Luke and Leia. This was, to me, kinda lame. It seems they wanted more interaction between the characters to create tension between them, and used this sudden, mysterious link to do it. There were better ways.

 

Forced love connections: Hated them all. They can go away.

 

 

Well there was not "really" a connection between Rey and Kylo. Snoke set it up. He was responsible for connecting the two. I question why he wanted too, but that is why. I don't think Rey and Kylo have any other connection... but hey maybe? I hope its not something super lame like Padme actually had triplets and the third one was secreted away even more secretly than Luke and Leia...

 

And yes... the forced love connections. I think the movies would be better if they had a single love interest develop over the span of the movies, not forced in one and then reforced with other people the next... Or rather not being needed at all. I guess Billie Lourd (Carrie Fisher's daughter) will now be a big role in the 3rd movie. Wonder if she will be a love interest for Poe, Finn or Rey or all 3?

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13 hours ago, Aryanun said:

I was not the only one in my group to notice the kid at the end. The broom moved to his hand, he didn't grab it. The stuff he swept moved just before the broom hit it. Young child is strong in the force.

We noticed this as well.

 

My theory is that we're moving away from Jedi/Sith and...democratizing The Force.  I'm honestly not sure I would be ready for that.

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I'm just waitin' to see when they send in Boba Fett.

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3 hours ago, strawhat said:

We noticed this as well.

 

My theory is that we're moving away from Jedi/Sith and...democratizing The Force.  I'm honestly not sure I would be ready for that.

 

The Clone wars animated series showed how Jedi would search out force sensitive children to recruit, and there was an elisode were Dooku and Ventress were doing the same. The younglings that Annakin killed revenge of the Sith were most likely recruited in that manner. 

 

I took that scene to mean that there are still force sensitive people in the universe despite not being found and trained. Luke said that he would not be the last Jedi, so I believe it to show that the spark of hope has returned and Rey will now find and restart the Jedi order. We also see the old Jedi texts on the Milenium Falcon showing that Rey smuggled them out before Luke burned the tree. The Jedi will be reborn. 

 

Edit: Donnie Yen’s character in Rogue One was also force sensitive and had he been born earlier when the Jedi were active, or found by the Jedi as s child he may have become a Jedi. 

Edited by Smokestack
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22 minutes ago, Smokestack said:

We also see the old Jedi texts on the Milenium Falcon showing that Rey smuggled them out before Luke burned the tree. The Jedi will be reborn. 

Well, I admit that I completely missed that!

 

That could also partially explain Yoda's mirth...

 

I honestly hope that the Jedi remain.  I know that there would always be Force-sensitives around doing basically what Anakin (and presumably Rey) were doing using low-level force powers to see a fraction of a second into the future and "feeling" their way through situations (like repairing or salvaging ships, or even bulls-eyeing wamp rats in a T-16).  Given how much trouble Luke had grabbing his saber on Hoth I'm guessing that it's not easy to do without training, so it seems like a pretty nifty thing for a stable hand to accomplish.

 

And I'd miss the lightsabers if the Jedi completely collapsed.::):

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11 minutes ago, strawhat said:

Well, I admit that I completely missed that!

 

That could also partially explain Yoda's mirth...

 

Given how much trouble Luke had grabbing his saber on Hoth I'm guessing that it's not easy to do without training, so it seems like a pretty nifty thing for a stable hand to accomplish.

 

And I'd miss the lightsabers if the Jedi completely collapsed.::):

 

I missed the texts the first viewing. We see them when Finn is storing stuff before they take off.

 

Yeah, Rey does not have much training and is s bad broccoli. And as well as she does vs a fully trained Kylo in Force awakens... yeah seems like they are down playing training and upping the power curve... or the force really did awaken... :)

 

yeah I would miss light sabers too...

 

 

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1 hour ago, Smokestack said:

 

The Clone wars animated series showed how Jedi would search out force sensitive children to recruit, and there was an elisode were Dooku and Ventress were doing the same. The younglings that Annakin killed revenge of the Sith were most likely recruited in that manner. 

 

I took that scene to mean that there are still force sensitive people in the universe despite not being found and trained. Luke said that he would not be the last Jedi, so I believe it to show that the spark of hope has returned and Rey will now find and restart the Jedi order. We also see the old Jedi texts on the Milenium Falcon showing that Rey smuggled them out before Luke burned the tree. The Jedi will be reborn. 

 

Edit: Donnie Yen’s character in Rogue One was also force sensitive and had he been born earlier when the Jedi were active, or found by the Jedi as s child he may have become a Jedi. 

Or killed by Vader as a youngling.

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