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Mckenna35

Collection of Mysterious Miniature Models of Pirates Busts

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1 hour ago, kristof65 said:

Here's what they say on the KS comment:
 

 

 

That’s not how trademark works. That’s not how copyright works.

 

This doesn’t just look sketchy. It is sketchy. I wouldn’t touch this project with a ten-foot belaying pin.

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2 minutes ago, Pingo said:

 

That’s not how trademark works. That’s not how copyright works.

 

This doesn’t just look sketchy. It is sketchy. I wouldn’t touch this project with a ten-foot belaying pin.

Neither would I.

 

But I would like to see the ship from which we're sourcing 10-foot belaying pins.::D:

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I was trying to figure out how a belaying pin fit into climbing, and then was all "ohhhh, ship thing" 

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There is something a bit ironic about this literally being pirate themed. 

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6 minutes ago, Cyradis said:

There is something a bit ironic about this literally being pirate themed. 

 

Yeah, I was thinking that earlier!

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Disney doesn't have to convince the UK trademark office.. they just have to threaten kickstarter..

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Agreed, I think it's going to be really easily taken down from kickstarter. I just think in the longterm and overall for the company, they just picked a fight that they're not only not going to win, but I imagine they're probably going to get entirely crushed. I think it mostly depends on how grumpy it makes the mouse. I think if they'd just put up the kickstarter, it'd be as simple as having kickstarter pull it and a C&D letter to stop them from selling them through other avenues. Nice try, better luck next time. But registering them, that's a completely different intent and that's what makes me think this is likely to push further than a C&D.

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3 hours ago, kristof65 said:

Here's what they say on the KS comment:

 

Somebody needs a lawyer that has even a vague clue about how the Bern Convention actually works.

 

2 hours ago, Gadgetman! said:

All of them registered in August and September. It was probably handled by a clerk who doesn't care about Disneyed Pirates, so didn't recognise the blatant pirating going on. 

Of course, now that it is registered there, it means that The Mouse have yet another place to attack them. 

 

Oh yeah, this one is going to burn.    

 

Copyright clerks are not responsible for checking everything against everything else. The registration of a derivative work does not actually provide any protection against the original copyright holder.

 

Problems that I see (note that I'm not an IP lawyer anywhere, so don't use this to make any decisions, but it's my understanding):

  • Copyright: Admittedly derivative works of copyrighted photos. That these are 3D rather than 2D works does not make them fair use, as they are not "transformative" to my eyes. Existence of these knockoffs would affect the market for licensed derivative works.
  • Trademark: High probability of confusion in the marketplace, obviously trading on the reputation of the movie. Slam dunk trademark violation. Note that, unlike copyright violations, when the holder finds out about such a violation, it is required to vigorously contest violations to maintain trademarks.
  • Right of Publicity: In some places, actors (and others) have a legal right to control how their images are used to make money. I make no comment on whether that should be the case (I have an opinion), but it's the way the law works there. Slam dunk again.

This one will die a horrible death before delivery. With luck, it will die a horrible death before the money is collected from the suckers backers.

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If the sculptors were hired and not the ones running this, I hope they got their money. There's a lot of sculpting hours there, though a free lance artist should also know enough to say "No" to this sort of contract.

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Question - how is fan art at ComicCons much different than this, legally? There are artists selling prints of their fandom art which often has extremely close likenesses to actors and/or characters. I can see that this is stomping over PotC and that it didn't get proper permissions, but I'm unclear on what the rules are that fandom artists use (or conversely, ignore). 

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Just now, Cyradis said:

Question - how is fan art at ComicCons much different than this, legally? There are artists selling prints of their fandom art which often has extremely close likenesses to actors and/or characters. I can see that this is stomping over PotC and that it didn't get proper permissions, but I'm unclear on what the rules are that fandom artists use (or conversely, ignore). 

 

Many of them are ignoring exactly the same issues as here. The biggest difference is that they're usually not advertising to millions of people and leaving the advertisement visible for months (including fulfillment time). There's not usually time for the IP owners to find out and complain before the convention is gone.

 

Plus, small artists are usually lawsuit proof (too poor to be worth suing for damages) and the amounts are generally quite small, both in numbers of prints and dollar value of product.

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2 minutes ago, Cyradis said:

Question - how is fan art at ComicCons much different than this, legally? There are artists selling prints of their fandom art which often has extremely close likenesses to actors and/or characters. I can see that this is stomping over PotC and that it didn't get proper permissions, but I'm unclear on what the rules are that fandom artists use (or conversely, ignore). 

Here's an article written by an IP lawyer on that exact subject: https://www.bleedingcool.com/2016/06/10/artists-alley-art-theft-and-copyright-law-a-lawyer-speaks-to-bleeding-cool/ (Just a heads up, there are a lot of ads on this page.)

 

TLDR version is it's not legal, artists shouldn't do it and fans shouldn't buy it.

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58 minutes ago, Doug Sundseth said:

Problems that I see (note that I'm not an IP lawyer anywhere, so don't use this to make any decisions, but it's my understanding):

  • Copyright: Admittedly derivative works of copyrighted photos. That these are 3D rather than 2D works does not make them fair use, as they are not "transformative" to my eyes. Existence of these knockoffs would affect the market for licensed derivative works.

 

See the 1992 Rogers v. Koons case. 

 

Jeff Koons lost, hard, after he copied a postcard photographer’s work in sculpture form without permission. He made all kinds of excuses, but the judge said no dice.

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14 minutes ago, Guindyloo said:

Here's an article written by an IP lawyer on that exact subject: https://www.bleedingcool.com/2016/06/10/artists-alley-art-theft-and-copyright-law-a-lawyer-speaks-to-bleeding-cool/ (Just a heads up, there are a lot of ads on this page.)

 

TLDR version is it's not legal, artists shouldn't do it and fans shouldn't buy it.

 

I'm not much impressed by the embedded outrage in that article. I consider the copyright clause's wording to cover the issue: "To promote the progress of science and useful arts, by securing for limited times to authors and inventors the exclusive right to their respective writings and discoveries". Passing off the work of others as your own is offensive, but the rest is an economic balancing issue, not a moral one.

 

I'll also say that he understates the availability of fair use defenses. Though to be fair, most people, as he notes, vastly overestimate what uses are fair. (Example: Parody is generally fair use; satire is not. Many or most pieces passed off as parody fair use are actually satirical. Know the difference before you enter into that swamp.)

 

Those things excepted, his statement of the law looks like what I've seen elsewhere.

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Just now, Doug Sundseth said:

I'm not much impressed by the embedded outrage in that article. I consider the copyright clause's wording to cover the issue: "To promote the progress of science and useful arts, by securing for limited times to authors and inventors the exclusive right to their respective writings and discoveries". Passing off the work of others as your own is offensive, but the rest is an economic balancing issue, not a moral one.

To be honest, Doug, I just scanned the article to get the major bullet points. I can't set up adblock on my work computer so I find most articles pretty unreadable these days with how many ads they've jam-packed into everything. I have ADD and when all that nonsense is flashing at me and paragraphs are literally moving to make room for more ads, I just can't even.

 

That being said, I know you don't like a moral argument, but some people find them more compelling than others and when you're writing an article that is partially asking people not to buy things they love based on the pop culture they love, I can understand going in that direction. But like I said, I didn't read the entire thing so I can't reasonably defend that issue. I'll take your word that it was too heavily handed.

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