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#1 Reaperbryan

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Posted 27 April 2007 - 10:07 AM

Discuss factions, builds, and how to crush your foes mightily in this thread!

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#2 ecs05norway

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Posted 27 April 2007 - 04:51 PM

Just a few notes based on a game played today: Your mortal units are going to be MUCH more fragile than your Undead. Dervishes and Herdsmen are going to be your mortal 'standard soldiers', and with 9 and 8 DV, respectively, and only 3 wounds, they're not going to hold up against heavy infantry like Templar Knights. They're light infantry - use 'em that way. Gang up on your opponents, get in behind them if you can, and be prepared to sacrifice them.

Honestly, these guys came off the worst of all our units in the update. They lost a lot of what made them special.

My best advice: Use 'em for cleanup behind the Cavalry or the Tomb Guard. Picking on already-wounded opponents who they may be able to get locked down and unable to adjust facing is their best venue. They don't have Backstab, but that's what you want to be doing with them.

Strategies: Start with a unit of Khadath or Nakhti and a line of Tomb Guard. They're rock-tough and even elves are going to have trouble shooting them on the way in - even a Soul Cannon has been shown to have problems with them, and a hit won't faze them much. Once they're ready, charge them in so that two base each opposing unit and make your melee attacks. Then activate the Dervish unit that's been following them, circle around behind the opponent's flanks with their Improved Charge and start peeling them from the flanks in.

Herdsmen should be used the same way. Fill them in behind the Tomb Guards on the initial charge, support their attacks... leaving spaces between them to let the TG's out. Then withdraw the Tomb Guards, have the Herdsmen get stuck in, and finish off the targets.
-- "Here is the price of freedom: Your every drop of courage, ounce of pain, pint of blood. Paid in advance." -- Andromeda

#3 jdripley

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Posted 27 April 2007 - 08:14 PM

Here's a 1500/1501 list I've been playing around with in my head and finally comitted to paper now that the cards have solidified. The basic idea is to epitomize the Storm Lord's ferocity in battle against his enemies. His forces rise from the desert sands in a bewildering display of destruction, attacking when and where the advantage can be assured. Speed, magic, and rock solid troops are what this list is all about! Here it is:

Troop 1:
Neb'Nesew Nepet (Cure2, 3 and 4, Part Death's River, Felling of the Firstborn), 3x Tomb Guards, 3x Ammat Devourers, 3x Awakened Mummies

Troop 2:
Anwar, 2x Khamsin Raiders, 2x Khamsin Heavy Lancers

Troop 3:
Giant Scorpion

Troop 4:
Sokar's Mighty Avatar


Ok so I added "Mighty" to the name of the avatar, but I think that any victorious Nefsokar player has the right to declare it law that Mighty be added to the name whenever the Avatar of their patron is refered to!

As you can see, speed is present in the list - the mounted troop can move and strike anywhere it wishes with impunity (more or less). The Scorpion is immune to everything (more or less) until he engages. With Parting Death's River, Neb can deliver his mummies and golems wherever he wants (more or less) and the Avatar is quick on his feet with Improved Charge and I plan on holding it in reserve to be the hammer to Neb's troop's anvil. Likewise the Cavalry's job is to guard Anwar as he skirts the enemy and puts random arrows in here and there, before riding in like hell-made-of-sand to crush any counter attack on the main body.

I think Neb's spells give him some good power, lots of utility, and grants the list some flexibility of movement that no other force in Taltos can match.
Jim Ripley

#4 jdripley

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 05:34 PM

Anybody used the new Khamsin cavalry? I have Anwar already and I have a pair of Raiders and Lancers in the mail, so I was wondering if there were any tricks and helpful advice to be had.
Jim Ripley

#5 ecs05norway

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 07:16 PM

Haven't tried it yet, but I've been considering it.

Assuming Cavalry don't eat double slots...

Senet Net'Merew (Magical Weapon, Magical Armor)
Atifa (Blessing x2, Part Death's River, Hold)
6x Khamsin Heavy Lancers

Anwar
2x Khamsin Raiders
2x Khamsin Mounted Archers

Tariq (3x Cure 1, Blessing)
2x Khamsin Herdsmen
1x Khamsin Ranger

Giant Scorpion

1500 even. Tariq's unit exists solely to tag along behind Senet's and snipe, cast Cure on her and her Lancers, and clean up wounded enemies on the flanks.
-- "Here is the price of freedom: Your every drop of courage, ounce of pain, pint of blood. Paid in advance." -- Andromeda

#6 jdripley

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 07:27 PM

Looks like a nasty list!

"Guys on horses" type models taking up two slots in a troop was tied to the Cavalry SA which is no longer in the game, so no, guys on horses no longer take up two slots.

I like the idea of including an infantry troop. All Cavalry is really appealing to me as well.. but it makes sense to include some cheape models. A few posts ago you talked about using them as mop-up after the cavalry gets in there and messes them up. I think that idea has lots of merit - using Raider and their fast speed to keep out of extended battles so that the enemy can't get ahold of you and shake you to pieces. Hit, then run! Hit, then run! It sure would be a different fighting style, and it's one I am looking forward to employing.

I'm gonna have to buy more cavalry :D
Jim Ripley

#7 ecs05norway

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 07:32 PM

Yeah.

Considering dropping a Raider or the Scorpion for more Herdsmen, actually. Anwar's troop is mostly to act as snipers, not to get into melee...

Hm.

Drop a Raider and the Scorpion, add a Lesser Avatar, increase Tariq's troop by two Herdsmen, and give Anwar some armor.
-- "Here is the price of freedom: Your every drop of courage, ounce of pain, pint of blood. Paid in advance." -- Andromeda

#8 Storminator

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Posted 01 May 2007 - 07:03 AM

I've seen small Anwar troops start the game by getting based by double moving cavalry. A few Herdsmen (or Dervishes) standing in front of the KMAs would make a nice cheap screen.

If the KMAs and Anwar are planning on moving and shooting each turn, the infantry can continue to double move and keep up, and the Khamsins have pretty good Dis if you have to shoot into melee. You'll also have LOS over your infantry.

PS

Rolling bad is NOT a counter-strategy for rolling good!

Black Lightning #MA003


#9 ecs05norway

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Posted 01 May 2007 - 07:49 AM

I've seen small Anwar troops start the game by getting based by double moving cavalry. A few Herdsmen (or Dervishes) standing in front of the KMAs would make a nice cheap screen.


Ok, you must be playing on a much smaller table than we are, if the enemy's starting out that close to you....

If the KMAs and Anwar are planning on moving and shooting each turn, the infantry can continue to double move and keep up, and the Khamsins have pretty good Dis if you have to shoot into melee. You'll also have LOS over your infantry.


Not with the new LOS rules, you won't.

But yeah, that's a decent strategy for an army like this (and a good reason to go with my redesign with added Herdsmen... heck, might even drop the Avatar...)
-- "Here is the price of freedom: Your every drop of courage, ounce of pain, pint of blood. Paid in advance." -- Andromeda

#10 Storminator

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Posted 01 May 2007 - 09:14 AM

I've seen small Anwar troops start the game by getting based by double moving cavalry. A few Herdsmen (or Dervishes) standing in front of the KMAs would make a nice cheap screen.


Ok, you must be playing on a much smaller table than we are, if the enemy's starting out that close to you....


Standard deployment zones are 24" apart. 12" move + 12" move +4" charge = in B2B.

If the KMAs and Anwar are planning on moving and shooting each turn, the infantry can continue to double move and keep up, and the Khamsins have pretty good Dis if you have to shoot into melee. You'll also have LOS over your infantry.


Not with the new LOS rules, you won't.


If I use the "Eye Level" LOS corridor, it completely works. In fact, I've seen valid eye level LOS corridors drawn between the head and the swordarm of some minis, i.e. right thru the middle of a mini. We generally refer to the new LOS rules as "you always have LOS."

But yeah, that's a decent strategy for an army like this (and a good reason to go with my redesign with added Herdsmen... heck, might even drop the Avatar...)


While I didn't state it as such, I was essentially agreeing with you. I think the Dervishes are a valid option too, since they are much better now.

PS

Rolling bad is NOT a counter-strategy for rolling good!

Black Lightning #MA003


#11 ecs05norway

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Posted 01 May 2007 - 09:36 AM

I've seen small Anwar troops start the game by getting based by double moving cavalry. A few Herdsmen (or Dervishes) standing in front of the KMAs would make a nice cheap screen.


Ok, you must be playing on a much smaller table than we are, if the enemy's starting out that close to you....


Standard deployment zones are 24" apart. 12" move + 12" move +4" charge = in B2B.


Hmmm. We almost never play that way... we usually start about twice that far apart.

If the KMAs and Anwar are planning on moving and shooting each turn, the infantry can continue to double move and keep up, and the Khamsins have pretty good Dis if you have to shoot into melee. You'll also have LOS over your infantry.


Not with the new LOS rules, you won't.


If I use the "Eye Level" LOS corridor, it completely works. In fact, I've seen valid eye level LOS corridors drawn between the head and the swordarm of some minis, i.e. right thru the middle of a mini. We generally refer to the new LOS rules as "you always have LOS."


Except that the corridor has to be a half-inch wide, even if you go at eye-level. So drawing between head and swordarm is a blocked LOS, unless they're more than half an inch apart.

Local opinion of the new LOS rules: Unless there is absolutely nothing else on the board, you never have LOS.

But yeah, that's a decent strategy for an army like this (and a good reason to go with my redesign with added Herdsmen... heck, might even drop the Avatar...)


While I didn't state it as such, I was essentially agreeing with you. I think the Dervishes are a valid option too, since they are much better now.


Yeah... although I find the Dervishes aren't nearly as useful, comparatively speaking, as they used to be. Once upon a time, a 2-attack grunt with a 9 defense was something a little fragile, but special. Now, they're kind of mediocre in comparison to other grunts around them.
-- "Here is the price of freedom: Your every drop of courage, ounce of pain, pint of blood. Paid in advance." -- Andromeda

#12 Storminator

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Posted 01 May 2007 - 09:52 AM

Hmmm. We almost never play that way... we usually start about twice that far apart.


We use 4x4 tables, usually. Sometimes we'll play larger, but usually only in 3+ player games.

Except that the corridor has to be a half-inch wide, even if you go at eye-level. So drawing between head and swordarm is a blocked LOS, unless they're more than half an inch apart.

Local opinion of the new LOS rules: Unless there is absolutely nothing else on the board, you never have LOS.


Right. There's a half inch gap between the head and the sword arm of the Skeletal Warrior, i.e. LOS right thru the model.

Given that the base is never a factor in Eye Level LOS, and you can always move off a tiny bit and avoid the upright part of a model, I can't see how LOS gets blocked that often. Look at cavalry models; if one cavalry model is behind another, there's a pretty good chance the head of the rider is visible over the rear of the other horse -- LOS!

Yeah... although I find the Dervishes aren't nearly as useful, comparatively speaking, as they used to be. Once upon a time, a 2-attack grunt with a 9 defense was something a little fragile, but special. Now, they're kind of mediocre in comparison to other grunts around them.


Except they're 3 attack Warmaster models.

PS

Rolling bad is NOT a counter-strategy for rolling good!

Black Lightning #MA003


#13 jdripley

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Posted 02 May 2007 - 11:28 AM

Here's a 750 themed list that I've entitled "Night at the Museum." The inspiration is obviously the movie that came out recently by the same name... What would it be like if the ancient Egyptian exhibit woke up??? This list is made up entirely of statue constructs!

---Ammat (Sokar's Presence), Reborn, Thoth (+1CP, Blessing, Divine Vigor, Cure3 w/Canopic Jar, Cure1), 3x Ammat Devourers, 2x Anubis Guards
---Lesser Avatar

Should be a pretty rough and tumble fighting company! You could play around with who gets Sokar's Presence... Ammat, Thoth and the Lesser Avatar are all capable of carrying it. There's pros and cons to each having it as well.
Jim Ripley

#14 Ranzadule

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Posted 11 May 2007 - 12:14 PM

How does delayment work now? It had a damage track specification. Does anything change?
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#15 Stubbdog

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Posted 11 May 2007 - 12:40 PM

unfortunately, until the KJ says otherwise, about the only thing that can keep you from getting delayed right now, is if you have a tactician in your troop. All other factors are no longer viable.




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