Ceynuundra Aelvari - Elven High Command

[Yukimura]

Reading what he's written so far is what snapped me awake.

[Tsetsen Muur]

Another thing that can be done to save archers (this is a limited use tactic, once in a while useful but costing nothing in return). Put your archers at the edge of a heavy forest. You get heavy cover bonuses, and don't give up any bonuses because of sure shot. The most important thing to do is to know when to flee. Because of wood strider, you can back your way out of the woods at x1 move. Most every other model out there will either have to go around, or move like I do, without the morning's coffee.

 

The only problem is this requries you to fall back at earlier -- once your opposing force reaches (two times their movement + any charge bonuses, you have to flee). For bull orcs, for example, this would be 14-16 inches (move 5, bloodlust 2, with or without a banner).

 

I was able to do this once with death seeker / breaker force. They were hanging out in some woods, giving the Crusaders the unenviable choice of (1) going after the archers, not quite getting there and being flanked by Arnise's Errants, or (2), going after the melee types, using all their movement to get there, and giving up the first swing to Deathseekers.

 

Option 2 was probably the better choice, which the guy took.

[Yukimura]

I played another game vs Ugluks Reven last thursday, and interestingly, it went a helluva lot better. i still lost, but it wasnt such a crushing defeat.

 

My force was a little different this time, and it was allbased around the new tactics ive been working out, and the counter to what i knew he was bringing.

 

His force consisted of three troops

The first troops was led by Kiakara herself, and contained a handful of bullorcs, and lesser orcs, including two bull orc bowmen.

 

troop two contained two skeeters, a beastman, and a couple of bull orcs, one of which a sgt.

 

troop three was Gurm.

 

so, in response...

 

Troop #1

Vale Capt

Caerwynn (Greater Acc Up)

4 Vale Archers

 

Troop #2

Arnise (Greater Magic Armor)

3 Vale Warriors

2 Vale Long Thorns

 

my tactics at the outset were thus-

with ranger, i positioned my archers on the hill i was nearest - i took the high ground with (what i beleived at the time was) optimal approach vectors. afterwards, i positioned Troop 2 at the base of the hill in front of them - the only way to my archers was through them.

 

However, it was the terrain that ended up being my bane that day. there was much of it that not only could Ugluk move his forces from cover to cover, but if i were to position Caerwynn to take advantage of Blazer, it was a good chance his Skeeters or Bull Orcs would pick her off, and i ned her for other things - and considering he had Kiakara leading his forces, my Volley Fire plans were effectively nill.

 

So, it came down to this. he used cover to get close enough to me, and i couldnt do a thing about it. once close enough, he had Gurm begin to flank me (still using cover as a shield), and bracketed me with his two Archer units - Skeeters on the right, bull orcs on the left - i killed the skeeters, but not before they could pick off two of my Vale Archers.

next, his Bull Orcs begin fireing into me - i lost a Vale Archer, and the other completely missed. Caerwynn got wounded, and again, missed the bull orcs. i managed to drop one of them, but the last would be one of the only survivors of Ulguk's forces - he finished off my Vale Archers, and in the end, killed Caerwynn too.

 

Now, i had brought Caerwynn out for the specific reason of killing Kiakara - with a 5 RAV, i can double it with crit shot, and have an easy time hitting her 12 defense. this never came to pass however.

As well - both me and Ugluk had forgotten that Caerwynn (and his Skeeters) had Defensive Shot, and so that mistake killed her. too bad, the tactics are sound, just need the kinks worked out.

 

Toward the Endgame, Ugluk set upp all his melee forces into a charge line, readying to bullrush into my lines. instead of waiting for it, i said "the hell with it" and charged him first. i managed to drop three orcs in one turn, leaving only a few left.

Gurm finished his flanking and went right for my Vale Capt - he used both attacks and missed twice. much to my luke, that Vale Capt pulled his sword and struck with both attacks, severly injuring Gurm. that Capt would later kill Gurm and then CdG him.

 

after much bloody melee, my Capt died at Kiakara's hand, and all that ended up being left was Kiakara (wounded three times, but healed twice with Bandage), a bull orc archer, against an unwounded Arnise. the scene would be amazing to describe in writing (which i will later), but Arnise and Kiakara went toe to toe for more then five rounds, during that time Arnise went down twice, but made her touch checks (Chumbawumba anyone?).

 

however, the third time, Ugluk pulled his card before me, and had Kiakara CdG her.

 

I lost, but it was very close, and i was quite pleased with that at least.

 

I think im starting to learn how to play this game.

[lordoftheleaves]

Is it just me....or do vale warriors suck!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

They arent worth the points at all!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

If you can tell me what they are good for, i would appreciate it greatly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[ugluk69]

Ummmm food???

 

Vale guards taste good or so the orcs tell me.

 

Actually with tough/1 they are good to run interference with your foe. Sure they will die, but while they hold out shoot into the combat like crazy. Also they are cheap and as a Reven player I have underestimated them before and it has hurt me. If Yuki knocks down one of my guys he CdGs them cause its a sure kill.

 

Plus they are georgous minis IMHO

[Yukimura]

One thing about an Elven force in Warlord - you cant make any mistakes, cause you pay for it, big time.

[Qwyksilver]

Use your warriors to slow down the melee troops swarming your archers. With your ability to fire into melee and not effect your own troops, all you need is an extra round or two to do serious damage. Use your warriors to step up and engage too. Force your opponent to kill you, and waste actions doing it, or risk a shaken token by trying to break b2b.

 

Deathseekers are your hunting and killing bread and butter.

[Tsetsen Muur]

I believe that one of G.E.'s nasty warrior tricks is to charge into contact, but not attack. This will slow the rate of death of the warriors (the opfor is likely to have better results from the defensive strikes than we get from swinging, so why bother), and give the archers more time to do their job.

 

I can't claim credit for this trick, and look forward to trying next time I play against my friend's Crusaders.

[All-Terrain Monkey]

Heehee, my replies write themselves now .

 

Yep; at 19 points the Vale Warriors are very cheap grunts. With their DV and MAV on the lower end of the spectrum for your basic footsoldier you need to play smart with them. Never, ever, if you have any choice in the matter, go one on one with an opposing player's force. Double, triple, quadruple, etc-team them to boost your chances of taking down more of the enemy than them of you if you're doing straight melee.

 

Tsetsen was right though; I love tying up the enemy with my warriors and just not attacking with them. I don't concern myself with getting in more guys than theirs at all, but more importantly focus on my current placement of archers and possible avenues of fire, since Vale Archers really come into their points when they get to stand still.

 

And don't think of them as being crappy either; if a race has been along for as long as the Elves they probably have a reason for not encumbering their troopers with excesses of armor and gear like their cousins.

 

If you want melee punch Deathseekers are the answer (like Qwyk said); you just have to ensure they have protection and are able to get the first hit in, since they don't do well at all on defense.

 

Yukimura's right as well; Elves are a finesse force, a "glass cannon" if you will. Good offense all around, but not much defense to speak of. 'S why I like'm so much .

[Yukimura]

I need to get some Deathseekers.

 

With Vale Warriors, the Tough\1 is a draw - best thing to do is pair them with Long Thorns for concentrated force. a Bless works, but is kinda unrealistic.

 

Backup Warriors with Archers - the "Practice Makes Perfect" Trait and Sure Shot ability make it a must.

 

Honestly, with the Low DV of almost all Elven Units, yeah it takes alot of finesse, but unlike some units in other factions, Elven units are almost tailor made to function together like a well-oiled Machine. Long Thorns and Warriors on the front lines, with Breakers on the flanks, all backed up by pin-point archery-support.

 

So far, ive yet to make it work though

[Saint of Sinners]

Honestly, with the Low DV of almost all Elven Units, yeah it takes alot of finesse, but unlike some units in other factions, Elven units are almost tailor made to function together like a well-oiled Machine. Long Thorns and Warriors on the front lines, with Breakers on the flanks, all backed up by pin-point archery-support.

 

So far, ive yet to make it work though

Try going the other way, have yer warriors, longthorns, and breakers support yer archers.

 

And don't be afraid to cut and run with yer archers if yer opponent gets too close. Make those spindly legs work fer ya, elfboy. Speed is yer fighting company's second advantage (followed closely by magic). And remember unless its blocking terrain (or yer in a swamp) yer boys can run through it while yer opponent will have to struggle into it or go around. Contratary to popular opinion elves love heavy terrain fields.

[lordoftheleaves]

Has anyone heard of the general date when the Elves Army Book comes out?

[spiritual_exorcist]

I'd suggest end of 2006 possibly early 2007, along with Darkspawn and Reptus the Elves are slated to be one of the final 3 army books released (So that means you have to wait for at least 5 more books to come out before you can realistically expect to see it).

 

Just my opinion though.

[Tsetsen Muur]

While that's true, it seemed to me that the Necro models lead the book by about 3 months, so might start seeing new models mid 2006 to early 2007.

 

Just enough time for me to finish my currently-owned elves...and that steam tank.

[spiritual_exorcist]

Reaper may even see fit to release a few models for each of the last 3 faction books well ahead of their faction books just to keep everyone happy and excitided. But it's simply speculation on my part.