Don't Panic!

[Spike]

Gosh am I the only kid who ever played "paper scissors rock" with the special "dynamite" rule?

 

When do we get artillery?

[All-Terrain Monkey]

Mages aren't enough for you Spike?

 

Well, knowing you, yeah, you probably want something kablooier .

[Akela]

kablooier

 

I love English.

[Reaperbryan]

kablooier

 

I love English.

That was English?

[Storminator]

kablooier

 

I love English.

I prefer verbing words to adjectivizing them.

 

PS

[gwawl]

Another point - a lot of are looking at this as if you can only have 1 troop of archers period.

 

Us Reven get 2 - Skeeters as adepts and Bull Orc Archers as adepts. So I have 2 troops of shooty goodness, whereas even when the Beastriders are out, I have only 1 troop of Cavalry goodness.

I notice that the people defending the rules change for archers tend to play Reven. is that because you had insider info on how the elves faction would be screwed in the new rules or do you just like the look of archer models that could not possibly fire their tiny bows with their four foot arms?

[spiritual_exorcist]

2) It seems to me Reaper wants to make warlord a melee game. All archers are adepts, and the only cavalry we have seen (Necro Deathriders) are also adepts.

I personally am in favor of this, as I find the melee stuff more exciting. Watching all my troops get mowed down by archers before I get to roll a single die is NOT exciting. Getting into the thick of things and being able to roll attacks whether or not I'm the one who did the attacking (defensive strikes) IS exciting. 

 

The whole reason I have chosen Warlord over many many other systems was because of it's flexability. Because I could make a melee force, or an archer heavy one, or a combined arms force. Now, both a combined arms force (I can no longer include archers along with grunts in more than one troop), and an archer heavy force are things of the past.

 

It's easy for Reaper to say, "Just wait for your faction books", I recall Reaper also saying that they were going to make sure forces created using the Main rule book army lists would continue to be competative even once the faction books had been released; I no longer see this as being the case. Now if I'm an elf player who wants to play a shooty style game I'll have to buy the faction book, and buy more models.

 

Limiting the number of archers a player can field seems so so very artificial, and removes a part of the game that I thought game Warlord alot of character. If the points costs are correct, what difference does it make whether you field an a melee heavy, archery heavy, or combined arms force. In the end the points costs should validate themselves if they have been playtested correctly, and all types of forces should be competitive. I feel this is especially true when you look at the high cost of all long range archery units, Vale archers might be great at what they do, but they cost 44 points, and if you get into melee with them they are going to die in droves; they can easily be countered by a large number of means.

 

If Reaper decided they wanted this to be a melee emphasis game, maybe they should have let us know in the beginning, before many people developed, paid for, and painted, missile heavy forces they can no longer use in their same capacity.

 

This game should be about tactics, and in turning all archers into adepts and giving the game a melee emphasis I think Reaper removed a huge component of the game.

[efkelley]

The simple answer is to play mercenaries. All archers! All the time! Veni, Vidi, Kablooikie.

[Ranzadule]

Actually, Reven are fully capable of doing exactly what the elves used to do. What they lack in Marksman they make up for in toughness. An Orc army with 10 archers in one unit and 6 skeeters and a few warriors in the other alon with some leaders and possibly counter magic will pwn as badly as the Elves used to.

 

Crusaders now have a huge advantage. Their near invulnerability to missiles is increased due to fewer shots against them.

[Qwyksilver]

Skeeters have Marksmen

[Ranzadule]

I know that but my point was that all elves have it.

[Storminator]

Actually, Reven are fully capable of doing exactly what the elves used to do. What they lack in Marksman they make up for in toughness. An Orc army with 10 archers in one unit and 6 skeeters and a few warriors in the other alon with some leaders and possibly counter magic will pwn as badly as the Elves used to.

But you're forgetting one thing. Orc archers are weak!

 

We call them Pointers. "Melee fighters, go that way!" fires arrows in direction of enemy.

 

And seriously, if you're going all archery with Reven you're giving up the best models the orcs have, the Bull Orc Fighter. I know if my Reven foes put together an all archery force I'd be thanking my lucky stars before I killed them.

 

PS

[Storminator]

Looking over the elves, I can put together a force that has archery in 4 troops. One troop with the Vale archers, a second troop led by Selwyn with Caerwynn (or Niriodel), and a pair of centaurs. That's a pretty shooty army list.

 

Selwyn

Niriodel

4 Deathseekers

 

Meridh

5 Vale archers

 

Centaur

 

Centaur

 

Total 685 points

 

Some room left over for spells and upgrades

 

That's not too bad. It's not 18 archers, but it's not too bad.

 

PS

[Qwyksilver]

9 Elves with Marksmen are worth 18 Bull Orc Archers for the number of attacks. I can't get that in one troop. Lets also look at costs. I'll include Skeeters too since they have Marksmen.

 

Elves: 9x44 = 396

Orcs: 18x30 = 540

Skeeters: 9x64 = 576

 

An all Reven archer troop is suicide. It also requires at least a 1500 point game given your parameters.

 

Okay, and let's look at the all Reven archery list. You have to use Narg since he is the only leader with elite capability other than Varaug.

 

Narg - 108

Yagun Oog - 68

Spells and Equipment - To be useful, around 200

9 Bull Orc Archers - 270

 

Total troop 1 - 646

 

 

Kharg - 34

6 Skeeters - 384

3 Bull Orc Warriors - 66

 

Total troop 2a - 484

 

This is a horrible application of points and army strengths. I wouldn't expect to make it into a 3rd activation. If I wanted to make this even remotely successful, I would need to add a third troop, melee grunt heavy. I'd be looking at just a smidge under 2000 points after I actually gave some equipment to my leaders.

 

 

I'd have to say the hunters are pretty nasty too with Enrage and 2 attacks

[Ranzadule]

You would want Yagun surrounded by Skeeters so his dispel will save your expensive, non-tough-having troops not the orc archers, that would be a waste.

 

That may very well be unnecessary anyway and taking cheap leaders with 9 or 10 orc arcerhs and 6 skeeters and 5 or so orcs will be an army that will most certainly be able to be "elf-like" except that the orcs can warcry and don't have as many shots as elves. This force will chew up an elf force as the elves will never be able to keep up weith the orcish missiles.