Denelspire

[spiritual_exorcist]

Lord Ironraven is a decent Captain, with the ecxeption of his 'Big' ability which makes him a fire magnet for spells and ranged attacks. For 108 points you get a pretty heft character statistics wise, and there arn't many characters in the game that utilise the 'First Strike' ability, so he is fairly unique, and powerful, in that regard. In order to utilise this ability however you need to try and ensure you initiate base-to-base contact rather than your opponenet.

 

Halbarad is by far the best model you have, his only flaw is his glaringly low DV, almost everyone I know puts greater magic armor on him for another 30 points, just to give him a fighting chance of survival on the board. Holy is an excellent ability when playing against any Evil models, as it forces such models to make a discipline check to come into base-to-base with you. I typically load him up with 2-3 bandage spells (which is much more useful when playing Templar Warriors rather than Unforgiven), and 1 utility spell (Speed, BLess, or Part), and a Hold spell (or sometimes Holy Light vs. undead).

Halbarad is on par with IronRaven as a melee bruiser, but be careful, he doesn't have Tough/X so when he goes down he is down for good.

 

The Unforgiven are more problematic, truth be told they don't hold up all that well as a stand alont grunt in small games. Their biggest problem is their low DV, and lack of toughness/X which means they are extremely fragile. They are fairly fast, big with IronRaven and Halbarad being much slower you'll end up with them out all by their lonesome attacking the enemy. There have been several discussions related to Unforgiven, one of the most recent ones is here: http://www.reapermini.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=18027

 

Ultimately I think you'll find them more useful as your army growns you include Warriors and Ironspines in a combined Troop with the Unforgiven to support eachother.

[Brushmaster]

Halbarad is by far the best model you have, his only flaw is his glaringly low DV, almost everyone I know puts greater magic armor on him for another 30 points, just to give him a fighting chance of survival on the board.

Except me , I never ! I prefer to give him a Knight body guard for the same points .

[Stubbdog]

750 point roster:

 

 

Troop 1:

 

Sir Danel Cavalry Cptn 99

Sir Damen Cavalry Hero 213

2x Hvy Cavalry 134

------------------------------

4 models 456 pnts

 

 

Troop 2:

 

Sir Malcolm Sgt 36

2x Templar Knights 54

6x Templar Unforgiven 168

1x Templar Ironspine (musician) 36

--------------------------------

10 models 294 pnts

 

 

 

Total:

-------------------------------

14 models 750 pnts

2 cards

 

 

Summary:

--------------------------

The musician along with the Unforgive innate Runner/2 allows the ground crew to do a relatively decent job of keeping up with the first troop.

 

The incredible speed of the first group allows them to get across the board before enemy ranged attacks can be made effectively. And then with the warmaster hero and troop-wide first strike abilities when they gets there helps to mow down any blockades when he gets there.

[Arbiter10]

Kengar, allow me to share my thoughts in response to your question.

 

1. First of all, I really see the Starter Box as something to whet your appetite for the game and to get a feel for how it all works. There really isn't enough variety in the two troops that you are given to allow you to develop much strategy for typical games. Normally, you would not field a lone troop that consisted primarily of nine breakers.

 

2. Related to #1, I would suggest proxying the minis that came in the box as the basic bread-and-butter grunt for each side -- Templar Knights for the Crusaders, Skeletal Warriors for the Necros. (That is, use the models you have, but use the stats for the other models.) As I hinted at above, one of the main strengths of Warlord is the ability to have "combined arms" in each troop; fielding nine of one soldier model in a single troop is usually less effective than having at least two types of soldier models. Having nine warriors instead of breakers will still be stifling in terms of strategy, but as warriors typically form the backbone of an army more than breakers, so this will probably be more beneficial in terms of developing tactics/strategy.

 

3. This is not a suggestion for the two armies you have available per se, but something that I think will be useful in a broader sense: read the rules several times, including spells and special abilities. Then, play a few games and look over them again. Repeat. The more experience you have understanding the rules on paper and seeing how the game actually plays, the more of an intuitive grasp you will have over how things work, and you will develop into a better strategist/tactician. For example, in my own experience, it was a minor relevation to me when I realized that Templar Knights and Ironspines, with their respective Trencher and Reach abilities, were designed to work hand-in-hand with each other. It could be that I’m a bit slow, but I didn’t realize how these two abilities complemented each other until I read over them a few times and looked at the army lists to see what abilities different models have.

 

4. This may seem obvious, but in order to become a better player, it is necessary to know about every faction in the game, not only the one(s) you like to play. Or, at the very least, know about all of the ones that you normally play against. Different opposing factions will likely require slight adjustments in how you build your army in order to make your army more effective against them. This will only become more true as the factions are fleshed out with new models and abilities. For example, the Crusader’s Celestial Lion is a great solo for mercying enemies, but loses effectiveness when fighting undead because they cannot be mercied. Against undead forces, the Hound of Judgement or Guardian Beast would be better choices for solos with their Judgement ability.

 

5. If you are playing a friendly game and make a tactical blunder, stop for a minute and analyze what you did wrong and try to figure out what you could have done differently to prevent that mistake. Likewise, if your opponent pulls off a brilliant maneuver, figure out if there was a way that you could have countered it. I have done this myself with friends, and we have all found it to be very helpful in developing gameplay strategies. Alternatively, you could do a “post-game show” and analyze some of the crucial moments of the game, but I find it to be more effective to stop right then and there and analyze things while events are still fresh in your mind.

 

6. In my experience, unique leaders and elites have their unique status for good reason: point-wise, they are some of the most useful, effective, and fun models to use. Particularly for leaders, consider taking unique leaders first before taking non-unique ones.

 

7. When choosing magic-users and leaders that have the ability to take elites, remember that you pay for Spell Capacity and elite slots regardless of whether or not you use them. If you are not going to use most of the available Spell Capacity and elite slots, consider carefully whether it's worth spending the points for a given model or if you may be better off buying a less expensive one that can fill a similar role.

 

 

As a side note, remember that you can proxy anything in order to get a feel for how different models work in order to determine if you like the way they play or not. I hope you find these suggestions helpful. Happy gaming!

[Evilbob]

This post is aimed at those (like myself) who are not brilliant tactitians.

 

Do not summon the Guardian Beast to far away from some support troops. Try getting your grunts up in to close combat and then bring him in.

If you take to long to get him back up He will die. Spectacularly. He will then become un-stunned and then die again. Rinse, repeat. Until someone remembers to coup de grace. Then he's just toast.

Dunno why this wasn't painfully obvious before I did it, but it is now.

[Kengar]

So, if I'm starting with the 600 points of Crusaders in the "vs. Necropolis" box (Lord Ironraven, Halabarad, and 9 Unforgiven), what do people recommend to build this core up to 750? 1000? 1500? I own Broderick (which I bought for an RPG), but no other Crusader minis.

[Storminator]

So, if I'm starting with the 600 points of Crusaders in the "vs. Necropolis" box (Lord Ironraven, Halabarad, and 9 Unforgiven), what do people recommend to build this core up to 750? 1000? 1500? I own Broderick (which I bought for an RPG), but no other Crusader minis.

 

Get Knights, and lots of 'em.

 

You might want to go right for the faction box, since there are no duplicates. You'll get Gerard, Valandil, and a stack of Knights. That will take you up to 1350 points, but you won't have a lot of variety to your lists.

 

A cheap sgt is also a good investment, as are the solos.

 

PS

[Kengar]

So, if I'm starting with the 600 points of Crusaders in the "vs. Necropolis" box (Lord Ironraven, Halabarad, and 9 Unforgiven), what do people recommend to build this core up to 750? 1000? 1500? I own Broderick (which I bought for an RPG), but no other Crusader minis.

 

Get Knights, and lots of 'em.

 

You might want to go right for the faction box, since there are no duplicates. You'll get Gerard, Valandil, and a stack of Knights. That will take you up to 1350 points, but you won't have a lot of variety to your lists.

 

A cheap sgt is also a good investment, as are the solos.

 

PS

 

"Solo"= Lion, Guardian Beast, Angel, etc.? How about archers? I would think some firepower would be useful. Forgive my ignorance. My box set with rule book is still crawling its way through the holiday shipping quagmire.

[Storminator]

So, if I'm starting with the 600 points of Crusaders in the "vs. Necropolis" box (Lord Ironraven, Halabarad, and 9 Unforgiven), what do people recommend to build this core up to 750? 1000? 1500? I own Broderick (which I bought for an RPG), but no other Crusader minis.

 

Get Knights, and lots of 'em.

 

You might want to go right for the faction box, since there are no duplicates. You'll get Gerard, Valandil, and a stack of Knights. That will take you up to 1350 points, but you won't have a lot of variety to your lists.

 

A cheap sgt is also a good investment, as are the solos.

 

PS

 

"Solo"= Lion, Guardian Beast, Angel, etc.? How about archers? I would think some firepower would be useful. Forgive my ignorance. My box set with rule book is still crawling its way through the holiday shipping quagmire.

 

 

You've got the solos right. People have various opinions about each one, but they are all pretty effective, so really it's about the points you want to spend (lion 84 points, Hound ~150 points, Guardian Beast ~185 points, Angel 282 points + spells).

 

Ivy Crown Archers are fairly weak, and fairly expensive (range 24", RAV 1, possibly 2 attacks, 42 points). If you've got to have ranged and you want to keep Mercy you'll want some of them, but don't get too many. I've never seen more than 3 fielded effectively. So that's a single blister. If you're willing to break faction, get either Bull Orc Archers (range 30, RAV 2, 30 points), elf Vale Archers (range 30, RAV 3, possibly 2 attacks, 44 points; downside DV 7), or crossbowmen (merc or dwarf) (range 18, RAV 3, 22 or 23 points).

 

If it were me, I'd get the starter box, a blister of IC archers, and either Conlan or Malcolm for a cheap sgt. There are a lot more things I would add later, but that's where I'd start.

 

PS

[Castlebuilder]

"Solo"= Lion, Guardian Beast, Angel, etc.? How about archers? I would think some firepower would be useful. Forgive my ignorance. My box set with rule book is still crawling its way through the holiday shipping quagmire.

I haven't played the newer solos yet, but they look impressive. I've given up on I.C. Archers and started using two Celestial Lions when I can. (Those may soon be replaced by the Guardian Beast.) The Guardian Angel is actually worth the huge number of points, but probably not until you get into larger games.

 

I agree with the other guys that lots of knights are the way to go. The Knights great defense and bandage spells normally offset any archery advantage the enemy has. Once I started playing seriously I expanded my Knights considerably. I like to add a couple Ironspine to my units of Knights too. (Between 1:2 and 1:3 ratio) Unforgiven are fast and hit hard, but they are vulnerable to archers. I think my favorite Captain is Sir Brannor. His Clerical ability is great for keeping bandages handy. The new Hospitalers also look like they will be must have additions to the Crusader army. Valandal is great if you bump up his casting power. Ian is even cheaper if you can get along without Firestorms and Dispel. I also use Halbarad, but only in larger games where I can choose him and a mage. A unit of War Dogs or a small troop of Cavalry would probably be worth considering too. I know those are a lot of suggestions, but the Crusaders have lots of options avialable. Your choices will depend on the style you want to play.

 

I guess my suggestion would be to add a solo of your choice, a mage, and hospitalers for starters. Gerard will be too expensive for smaller point battles, so you will also want a Sergeant or two once your Knights arrive. From there you could expand to a cavalry troop. Always keep in mind that you want to build your army so that each troop can support the others. Crusader armies are small in numbers, and a troop that gets itself isolated is in real trouble.

 

Castlebuilder

[Kelcore]

Storminator and Castlebuilder already offered alot of good stuff on a lot of the basic Crusader units. I'll toss in my hat with Castlebuilder's as far as the Ivy Crown Archers go: They're ok. Don't go whole hog with 'em. But don't totally dismiss them either. I'd also like to say that Battle Nuns might not be a bad idea if you like fast moving, 2 #MA/Tough-2 units. They are pricey, though.

 

As far as new units go:

 

Hospitaliers- They're a must. They're currently my new favorites (I couldn't use them for crap in Beta testing, but now that they're out, I've been having alot of good experiences with them). Just taking a couple of these beauties will free up points for cleric spells other than Bandage and Cure. Just make sure to keep 'em covered. They're the unit that practically begs: "Put arrows here".

 

Guardian Beast & Hound of Judgement: Poeerhouses. Pure and simple. High DV. High MAV. Lots of #MA's and cool special abilities. The fact that they can be Summoned is a great boon, especially in the deployment phase. I always find it handy when my opponent arranges all his minis 1st. Having their data cards in reserve until they're summoned helps with that.

 

Justicars- These guys were my favorite in Beta. I still like 'em bunches. 2DT tough-guys. Good armor (no deflect though, don't get cocky around archers). Still, the 2 DT's, coupled w/ Tough/2, combined w/ Hospitaliers=annoying to your opponent.

 

War Dogs- Haven't had alot of luck with 'em. But they are very cool. And distract is freakin' awesome. Next time I field 'em, I'll have to field them in larger numbers. Lord Baasen likes to fill them with arrows and then set them on fire with his Mages before they can do much damage.

 

Lions Lancers and Ivy Crown Light Lancers- These are the units that totally make up for the Crusaders generally poor long-range capability. Lions Lancers have a better chance of withstanding the plinking of the more impressive archery units (Elves, Dwarf and Overlord Crossbowmen). Light Lancers have a much lower DV but can make it across the board before you can blink. Regardless, both Units make the lives of archers miserable.

 

Lady Kristianna- If you face the Necropolis, particularly the Crypt Legion, on a regular basis- TAKE HER. Seriously. Load her up with Greater Magic Armor, and make gratuitous use of her innate ability to cast Holy Burst. Watch with glee as your fallen/wounded models get back up/get healed whilst all the undead things around you fall down.

 

That's about it for now, I'm sure I'll think of more later.

[Kengar]

What about Broderick? Is he any good? How does he compare with the other captains? I only ask because I already own the model. Also, I see that Sgt. Acacia has a bow. Is she good to take with the archers? Or is that too many points to tie up in weak ranged attacks?

[Storminator]

What about Broderick? Is he any good? How does he compare with the other captains? I only ask because I already own the model. Also, I see that Sgt. Acacia has a bow. Is she good to take with the archers? Or is that too many points to tie up in weak ranged attacks?

 

Can't comment about Acacia, but Broderick is fine. He's an ordinary captain, very similar to Arzaphan, Andras, Javolith, Chai-uut, Fulumbar etc. Your basic run of the mill non-unique captain. While nothing special, he certainly has a place in your army. MAV 4 is pretty nice.

 

Let me say this about Kelcore and Castlebuilder's advice: I would start smaller. Justicars and cavalry and wardogs and battle nuns and large numbers of solos are great, but get yourself some knights and a cheap sgt (any of them are good really, including Sister Majeda) first.

 

Also, there really aren't any bad models in the Crusader force, except possibly the Ivy Crown Archers (which still have their place). You almost can't go wrong.

 

PS

[Kelcore]

What about Broderick? Is he any good? How does he compare with the other captains? I only ask because I already own the model. Also, I see that Sgt. Acacia has a bow. Is she good to take with the archers? Or is that too many points to tie up in weak ranged attacks?

 

Broderick is pretty good. And cool in that he's a non-unique model. Though I prefer Brannor to him.

 

Accacia is pretty cool in that she has the Blazer SA and can lead the ICA's in an indirect volley. But she's very, verry pricey. As are the ICA's. Combine the two, and you're kind of putting all your eggs in one basket. At least for smaller games.

 

Oh! One thing I left out in my earlier post (speaking of Ivy Crowns)- Ivy Crown Skirmishers. They're pretty cheap, decent melee labor. Sure, they cost as much as Ironspines, but they're also Tough. That comes in handy.

 

What about Broderick? Is he any good? How does he compare with the other captains? I only ask because I already own the model. Also, I see that Sgt. Acacia has a bow. Is she good to take with the archers? Or is that too many points to tie up in weak ranged attacks?

 

Can't comment about Acacia, but Broderick is fine. He's an ordinary captain, very similar to Arzaphan, Andras, Javolith, Chai-uut, Fulumbar etc. Your basic run of the mill non-unique captain. While nothing special, he certainly has a place in your army. MAV 4 is pretty nice.

 

Let me say this about Kelcore and Castlebuilder's advice: I would start smaller. Justicars and cavalry and wardogs and battle nuns and large numbers of solos are great, but get yourself some knights and a cheap sgt (any of them are good really, including Sister Majeda) first.

 

Also, there really aren't any bad models in the Crusader force, except possibly the Ivy Crown Archers (which still have their place). You almost can't go wrong.

 

PS

 

Pete's absolutely right- Both Castlbuilder and myself are giving advice for future consideration. Building a foundation from the Warlord starter box and the Crusader starter box would be a fantastic way to go.

[Kengar]

Quick question on points. When I add up the units listed in the Warlord starter box: Ironraven (108), Halbarad (89), and 9 Unforgiven (28 per), I come up with 449, not 600. What am I missing?