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vongarr

Advertising and player strength

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it didn't seem to be selling very well.
when I asked at my FLGS here in the DC area, they seemed kind of down on the game

Somehow, I think that's the problem -- it isn't selling well because your FLGS sales reps (who should be trying to make games sell, instead of discouraging you (and their reason for discouraging is not "we played it and hated it" - oh, no! It's because nobody buys it in that store)) suggest it's a weak game. Well, that's very circular logic . . .

 

Perhaps Sales would improve if they'd actually try - oh, I don't know . . . NOT BASHING IT.

 

It's simple really, customers who are curious about a game will usually buy it if you support their interest - they won't buy it if you tell them bad things.

 

Low sales in that FLGS means they aren't promoting it themselves properly, as your example suggests.

 

I suggest offering to demo Warlord for the Store's sales staff after hours. If you can sell them on the game, they can sell their customers on it. After that . . .

 

Incidentally -- any BL who can demo to store employees should do so. In this manner, you can have a ready made team in place to promote Warlord when you can't be at the FLGS. (I know, you live at the FLGS, but sometimes you have to leave, right?)

 

 

 

If sales of Warlord are far higher than what was initially expected (As has been suggested by Reaper employees who frequent this board) why arn't we seeing some of the unexpected revenue being poured into even a small scale advertising campaign?

@Spiritual - We have been using the revenue to increase our release schedule of figures. Last year at this time we were shipping 2-4 Warlord models per month. Now we are releasing 4-6. We are also funding the development of the remaining 7 faction books, starter boxes (art ain't free) and funneling that Revenue into CAV and other RAGE products still in development. Reaper has always used revenue from today's sales to pay for tomorrow's new items, and the books and models are part of that. And the revenue from those pays for the next generation of products, you see? Believe me, I'd love to run ads in every trade Mag. But we have essentially 3 choices.

1)Redistribute revenue from current sales to future items

2)Redistribute revenue from curent sales to advertising (which does take funds away from the development of future products until the advertising pays off - which can take some time)

3) raise proces and do both.

 

Obviously, we'd rather not do #3 because that would hurt overall sales as much as it might help them. #2 has advantages, but advertising is tricky and unpredictable. It is uncertain whether that revenue would ever be returned to us - and if it wasn't we'd be sacrificing a lot of products to have funded the risky venture.

Option 1, then, produces the most direct return on the investment, and the growing product line, combined with support form our BL team, helps raise awareness - when you see the books int eh catalog, you know there's soemthing there that DHL doesn't have.

 

As always, feel free to disagree.

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What Warlord needs is celebrity endorsements.

 

Ok, here's the plan :devil:

 

We send several celebrities Warlord T-shirts, hats, thongs, and what nots. Then hopefully they'll wear.

 

I'll start the list of celebrity:

 

Jessica Alba

Jessica Biel

Allison Mack

Avril Lavenge

Jessica Simpson

Michelle Gellar

Jennifer Aniston

Countey Cox

Jennifer Love Hewitt

 

I like this idea

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Steve brought up a valid point regarding advertising (of the in-print sort).

 

Even now, Reaper has a pretty nice share of space in Harbinger magazine, though that zeen is targeted toward a relatively narrow audience of painters and sculptors.

 

The other major gamers' magazines out there are...

 

White Dwarf? Um... I don't think they'd be keen on selling Reaper a full-page ad.

 

Dragon? (ditto)

 

Beyond those, I don't think the number of ad-exposures would be worth the hassle.

 

The best way to promote the game is to play it.. ALOT..and whenever possible in front of onlookers who will see how much fun you're having and ask you about the game.

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I only just got interested in the game myself (with a little luck, my Crusdars v. Necropolis box will arrive today), but when I asked at my FLGS here in the DC area, they seemed kind of down on the game. Neither of the guys at the counter had played it, but it didn't seem to be selling very well. (Though I think the individual figs were getting picked up for RPG use a bit).

 

I wonder if it has to do with being deep in the heart of GW country?

 

This is pretty common in alot Gaming shops, an owner or staff member has neither read the rules nor played the game yet they make disparaging comments about it due to a lack of sales. Very poor business practice actually, not only in putting a negative spin on stock you are trying to sell, but in not being informed about various products in your mechandise line.

 

I'm very happy to hear that Reaper is advertising in Dragon, I've not picked one up in several years.

 

If sales of Warlord are far higher than what was initially expected (As has been suggested by Reaper employees who frequent this board) why arn't we seeing some of the unexpected revenue being poured into even a small scale advertising campaign?

 

@Spiritual - We have been using the revenue to increase our release schedule of figures. Last year at this time we were shipping 2-4 Warlord models per month. Now we are releasing 4-6. We are also funding the development of the remaining 7 faction books, starter boxes (art ain't free) and funneling that Revenue into CAV and other RAGE products still in development. Reaper has always used revenue from today's sales to pay for tomorrow's new items, and the books and models are part of that. And the revenue from those pays for the next generation of products, you see? Believe me, I'd love to run ads in every trade Mag. But we have essentially 3 choices.

1)Redistribute revenue from current sales to future items

2)Redistribute revenue from curent sales to advertising (which does take funds away from the development of future products until the advertising pays off - which can take some time)

3) raise proces and do both.

 

Obviously, we'd rather not do #3 because that would hurt overall sales as much as it might help them. #2 has advantages, but advertising is tricky and unpredictable. It is uncertain whether that revenue would ever be returned to us - and if it wasn't we'd be sacrificing a lot of products to have funded the risky venture.

Option 1, then, produces the most direct return on the investment, and the growing product line, combined with support form our BL team, helps raise awareness - when you see the books int eh catalog, you know there's soemthing there that DHL doesn't have.

 

As always, feel free to disagree.

 

Thank you for providing this information, as always I have nothing but praise for you guys with respect to how you keep your loyal fan base up to date. This is a question you didn't have to answer, and I very much appreciate your response.

 

As always, my biggest concern, whether it be with negative or positive feedback I give here on the board, is helping to promote the great game and product you guys have in your hands. I'm sure it seems like I am very critical here on the boards, but keep in mind that I am an extremely dedicated fan.

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I suggest offering to demo Warlord for the Store's sales staff after hours. If you can sell them on the game, they can sell their customers on it. After that . . .

 

Incidentally -- any BL who can demo to store employees should do so. In this manner, you can have a ready made team in place to promote Warlord when you can't be at the FLGS. (I know, you live at the FLGS, but sometimes you have to leave, right?)

 

Well, the guys there know me (I've been shopping there since before a couple of them were even born) so I think they don't tend to try a hard sell with me. On the other hand, one of them is pretty much "the GW guy" for the store, and the other one isn't much into minis (that I can tell). The owner and I get along fairly well, though. If I can get some factions painted up and get comfortable with the rules, I may look into trying to run a demo. I have to play the silly game first, though! ::):

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when I asked at my FLGS here in the DC area, they seemed kind of down on the game

Somehow, I think that's the problem -- it isn't selling well because your FLGS sales reps (who should be trying to make games sell, instead of discouraging you (and their reason for discouraging is not "we played it and hated it" - oh, no! It's because nobody buys it in that store)) suggest it's a weak game. Well, that's very circular logic . . .

You think it's bad that a store owner doesn't support the game? My Warlord layout at a recent convention was next to a game run by the boss at one of the national distributors. We got to talk a bit, and he admitted to me that his sales reps don't push Warlord because they don't think it's a good seller! Yet he acknowledged that none of them have played the game. This was supported when just after the Con I started running demos at another game store. The sales rep actually talked the store owner out of carrying as much Warlord stuff as he wanted to order.

 

I have to give my FLGS credit, when I first asked about Warlord demos, I was politely told that the shop was pretty much a GW shop. I was, however, told that I was welcome to try. After about a year, GW sales have dropped significantly off due to the popularity of Warlord and Warmachine.

 

Castlebuilder

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...GW sales have dropped significantly off due to the popularity of Warlord and Warmachine.

 

 

I wish I could say the same thing with my store! GW sales HAVE dropped, but they dropped quicker than GW raised their prices!! :lol:

 

While we do have a pseudo-decent following for Warlord, Starship Troopers and Flames of War have exploded. We will always have the card gamers that do nothing else. Plus, most of us like to play the various nifty board games that are for sale. So, we're guilty of play the next coolest board game instead of playing Warlord every once in a while. I know! Boo! Hiss!! Yeah yeah yeah. :devil:

 

My problem now is everybody that is a regular to the store has seen us play Warlord. They are either interested and go "Sorry. We're broke." or go "That game looks stupid. Let's go play ____.". We don't have too many new people entering the store. :down:

 

Wild Bill :blues:

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There is a new flgs opening near school and the owner has asked me to do some demos for people who are mildly interested since I'm the only one who seems die hard about it. So I think I'm finially going to sign up for Black Lighting when school starts up again.

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So Squishy you could not get Hastur Hobbies to to register as a RAGE store huh?? Too bad that is a cool store. I am going to work on a store up in Idaho Falls (I will bug them until they do it mwhahahahaha.....)

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Having seen what Ad space in trade mags run (not gaming mags, but I'm sure its similar) I don't blame Reaper for not doing alot in these. It is expensive and If it doesn't work you're sunk.

 

 

I love my FLGS. Freefall ran a couple of demos here a while back (has it been a year and a half?), and then ran some demos at the local con last May. )Thats how I got sucked into the BL.) Since he's and I are good friends with the owner he loves letting me do demos down there. He even decided that it was a good idea for him to open New Years Day so I can have a tourney.

 

Previously the game sold, but now we have some dedicated players.

And when school starts back up in the pre-spring I'm going to go canvas the campus for those freshman gamers.

 

Now besides being good buds with the owner I have some advantages.

We have both CAV and Warlord posters up. No GW posters. Lots of Mechwarrior posters. And a giant map of Waterdeep. And these are spread around so you really see everything.

Our FLGS sells alot of RPG stuff so the big wall is almost entirely books. with a nice 'smallish' Reaper section. A big paint rack and a rack of both DHL and Warlord minis. He keeps a fairly good selection so people can impulse buy. But he will special order ANYTHING. So guys will pick up a blister of archers and then order the box set.

Apparently this town used to be GW heavy but they jerked the comic store around too much so a while back she sold off all her GW stuff for like 60%+off. My FLGS never really carried it because of the cost. He'll special order it but anymore there isn't a demand.

 

One of our constant players --the one with the elves of doom-- is moving to Idaho in about a month. He's contemplating finding a place to do demos down there so he doesn't have to drive 6 or so hours to come up here and play. So its spreading.

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So Squishy you could not get Hastur Hobbies to to register as a RAGE store huh?? Too bad that is a cool store. I am going to work on a store up in Idaho Falls (I will bug them until they do it mwhahahahaha.....)

I just need to keep reminding them, but I've been busy lately and haven't had a chance recently.

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Tried to find players here in Austin, emailed everyone registered within 50 miles of me, tried to find games at three LGSes, and nothing. So the dorfs go on the "to be painted whenever" shelf and for xmas I gave myself 3000 points of Warmachine.

 

loyd

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All I have to say is, Give demos to friends. I dragged a freind of mine to a Demo Mengu was doing. I wanted said friend to just have an understanding of the game so I could have him play at a Con I'm helping running a game at.

 

Much to my suprise he's now trying to decide which army to collect.

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