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Resisting the Siren's song


Nanite
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I just wish the 6mm Epic building sprues would go back into production. Those things were great, and workable enough that whole buildings could be constructed with a couple sprues and scratchbuilding.

 

That landing pad does seem quite overpriced though. The defense line falls into the same category, but it comes with a fairly large gun.

 

Oh and the Pound Sterling is dropping against the dollar again. If it hit parity, Forgeworld stuff becomes reasonable!

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Re: scratchbuilding. While throwing up a basic building isn't a problem, if you get more complex than that...

 

I had built a few M4 Sherman hull conversions a number of years ago. Even though the hull is all slabs for the most part, scratchbuilding complex shapes is IMHO a lot more difficult than a 4 sided building.

 

IMHO the defensive line walls are probably the weakest product they're offering. Not because it is extremely expensive, but why would any army choose to haul armor plate out into the field, setup walls, etc, when they can just dig a hole in the ground? If I ever incorporate trench work, THAT is something I would scratch-build. Some foamcore, sheet plastic base, and a bunch of wood dowels (and a lick of paint) and you got something more realistic...

 

Damon.

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Re: scratchbuilding. While throwing up a basic building isn't a problem, if you get more complex than that...

 

I had built a few M4 Sherman hull conversions a number of years ago. Even though the hull is all slabs for the most part, scratchbuilding complex shapes is IMHO a lot more difficult than a 4 sided building.

I agree. But how much complexity of shapes do you really need on a 4 x 8 battle field? And most people have had the education to do all that stuff, it's just they think it's too difficult to deal with, that high school math like Geometry doesn't have real applications.

 

Is it easy to build complex shapes, rather than squares and rectangles? No, not comparitively. Is it outside most people's abilities? I don't think so. But that's beside the point - you can build some pretty cool looking battlefields and buildings using nothing but combinations of squares and rectangles and a little bit of eyeballing things.

 

That's why I kept pointing at the landing pad. I made a couple a few years back for a scenario that were merely some packing tape cores, and foam core cut to shape, with some details added. Total cost of materials was a buck for the foam core*, the rest was recycled material. To do one like the GW one would require a piece of foam core, some deodorant containers and some thin plastic or card to do the detailing/blast shields with. I don't know a single gamer who can't handle that, though I do know plenty who don't think they can.

 

IMHO the defensive line walls are probably the weakest product they're offering. Not because it is extremely expensive, but why would any army choose to haul armor plate out into the field, setup walls, etc, when they can just dig a hole in the ground?

Does that mean I can bring my cordless drill and large drill bits to simulate digging in on the battlefield when we play on your table? :poke:

 

I agree with you - digging in makes more sense, but it's a problem simulating on the table-top battle field, which is probably GWs only justification for that product.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

*Yep, a buck for a 20" x 30" sheet of 3/16" foam core. Two to three times a year, Michael's puts it on sale for a buck a sheet. I think Hobby Lobby does too. Anyway, everytime it goes on sale, I restock. I typically have 20-30 sheets available to me at a time, so I see no need to pay more than a buck a sheet.

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*Yep, a buck for a 20" x 30" sheet of 3/16" foam core. Two to three times a year, Michael's puts it on sale for a buck a sheet. I think Hobby Lobby does too. Anyway, everytime it goes on sale, I restock. I typically have 20-30 sheets available to me at a time, so I see no need to pay more than a buck a sheet.

 

Pls give estimate cost for recycled material and man hours spent, paint cost etc. Also, ho rugged would you describe your landing pad as. I'm not trying to knock it, just want to get the most accurate cost comparison possible.....

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Pls give estimate cost for recycled material and man hours spent, paint cost etc. Also, ho rugged would you describe your landing pad as. I'm not trying to knock it, just want to get the most accurate cost comparison possible.....

My original landing pads (no longer in my possession, I gave all my terrain to a friend when I moved - oh, about ten years ago) were each built with single 3-4" diameter cardboard cylinders/cores glued to a flat piece of foam core cut in about a 10-12" circle. I was able to cut both "pads" out of a single sheet of foam core, with excess left over. One of the pads stood about 2" high, as it was based on a core from 2" packaging tape, the other was 4-5" high, and based on a core that actually came from some packaging foam, IIRC. Both cores were salvaged from the manufacturing plant I worked at at the time - the packaging guys on the line knew I was always looking for that kind of stuff, and kept it in a box for me that I'd periodically clean out.

 

All the detailing was done with pieces of card stock, and wire - shapes (like doors and hatches) were cut out and then glued on where I thought they looked good. The whole thing was then primed flat black, drybushed with grays, and details like pad number, safety zones, etc painted on. Total assembly time for both pads was probably less than an hour, painting probably about another 1-2 hours.

 

Cost is a little harder to estimate, particularly on the taller one. If you were buying all the materials raw, you'ld have the cost of the tape (plus the time to use it up) - that's generally around $4 a roll, the foam core at a $1 for a sheet (2 pads from a single sheet, so $0.50), plus a few sheets of cards stock and some misc pieces of wire - probably another $2 or so, for a total of about $6.50 - but keep in mind you get a full roll of tape for that cost, too. Realistically - I'd guess that outside of my labor, those pads would have cost about $2.50-3.00 each to build.

 

They were very simply built, and they were pretty sturdy. Nothing really could break on them, other than the foam core pad itself - there were no little fiddly bits that were fragile. The only real problem we had was that they had a tendancy to tip over if you put too many metal miniatures on one side. Since the majority of our groups terrain was built from foam core, they weren't any more fragile than anything else, and our terrain took some pretty heavy abuse. All of the foam core terrain I built for that group in the mid to late 90s is still in my friend's possession, and when I was visiting him this last March, that's the stuff we used - so I'd considered it pretty sturdy, when cared for by storing properly - it's been my experience that the majority of damage to terrain and miniatures comes during storage and transport than from actual use on the game table.

 

 

Now, of course, seeing GWs new landing pad, and making the statements I have, I'm inspired to scratchbuild another one for myself. This one will be on the same lines as GW one - with the blast shields on the side, and square w/ four corner pillars instead of round with a center pillar. My plan is to get four deodorant containers to use as the pillers, foam core as the landing pad, and thick card board from the back of legal pads to use as the blast shields on the side, with wire and cardstock provding the bulk of the details. My best estimate for this version will be about $10 in materials cost, plus 4-6 hours in assembly time, and another 2-3 hours painting

 

My key objective here is that other than the foam core, everything will be recycled materials from around the house, work or my bitz box and/or cheap materials that are available to as many people as possible. I do have one hold up though - my problem right now is I only have two deodorant containers in my materials box, which will be a hold up on the materials side, unless I think of something else suitably concrete pillar shaped.

 

Will mine look as 100% detailed/nice as the GW one? Probably not. Will it look pretty darn good on a battlefield with minis around it? In pictures? Yep.

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I'm just going to thow in my 2 cents and say that I HATE all the Imperal Gaurd plastics in the GW range.

 

I get the choice of:

 

A army of roid raging Rambos

 

A army of American Football players with laser guns.

 

 

Wait, what?

O_____o

 

I wish they would do one of the cooler Regiments in plastic. I would collect them if it wasn't for the fact there expensive, and I have to convert there metal figure's gear to what I want.

 

=/

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I think everyone on the Internet agrees with you Lucky. I'm still kinda puzzled that there was no real update for any of the armies when the new IG codex was released.

 

I heart my vostroyans though.

 

Hey, anyone have some of the old 'Gothic Ruins' sprues that used to come in almost every 40k boxed set that they would be willing to part with?

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Anyone in their right mind has those gothic ruins assembled and in use, nanite.

 

For what it's worth, I built a Tau-themed Bastion in about three hours using an overturned plant pot, hammerhead tank bits I had laying around, and some odd-shaped plastic containers I had saved in my terrain building box. It's very much inspired by the Tau Listening Posts from the Dawn of War: Dark Crusade Video Game, but everyone who has seen it has been raving.

 

I don't have access to the pictures here at work, but I'll try and post some later tonight. By The Time I replace certain hammerhead parts by getting them from The Warstore, It'll probably end up costing me about $15 to build each one, and I plan to do three.

 

I've got an idea for a Landing Pad, too, but that comes later and probably won't cost nearly as much.

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Anyone in their right mind has those gothic ruins assembled and in use, nanite.

 

Fortunately, I'm not in my right mind, nanite. I think I have some of them down in the basement. I'll check tonight.

 

I'm really looking for Wargods figs - mainly Anubi and Asar, but I have wish lists for probably a dozen different systems - 40k, DBA, Wargods, CAV, Warlord, Ogre, etc, etc. :rolleyes:

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but I have wish lists for probably a dozen different systems - 40k, DBA, Wargods, CAV, Warlord, Ogre, etc, etc. :rolleyes:

 

I used to be like that.

 

I have it trimmed to 40k, WFB, Heavy Gear, and Warmachine/ Hordes at the moment.

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but I have wish lists for probably a dozen different systems - 40k, DBA, Wargods, CAV, Warlord, Ogre, etc, etc. :rolleyes:

 

I used to be like that.

 

I have it trimmed to 40k, WFB, Heavy Gear, and Warmachine/ Hordes at the moment.

 

I figure, the more games I could play, the better the chances I have of actually getting to play. And it's not as though I'd be getting everything painted if I only played one system anyway. . . .

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pm sent, rich.

 

I've given up hope of playing anything but Monsterpocalypse. I've now got minis from all over the place though, and I have this odd habit of collecting armies even though I don't play. It's worse with 40k then anything else.

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Don't get me wrong, I know where you're coming from.

 

At My worst, I had Confrontation, VOID/Urban War, Celtos, 40k, WFB, Wargods, BFG, Epic 40k, Warmaster, CAV, Warlord, CBT, Heavy Gear, Flames of War, Warmachine, Starship Troopers and a bit of Warzone all in various stages of disarray. I'm much happier actually making progress on the stuff I've kept than not knowing where to begin on any of the ones I had.

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Don't get me wrong, I know where you're coming from.

 

At My worst, I had Confrontation, VOID/Urban War, Celtos, 40k, WFB, Wargods, BFG, Epic 40k, Warmaster, CAV, Warlord, CBT, Heavy Gear, Flames of War, Warmachine, Starship Troopers and a bit of Warzone all in various stages of disarray. I'm much happier actually making progress on the stuff I've kept than not knowing where to begin on any of the ones I had.

 

The sad thing is that I duplicate much of your list - 40k (Orks, IG, Marines and Tau, might add Chaos and Eldar in the next few months), Wargods (pretty much everything), BFG (though I haven't bought anything in some time, and only have a Chaos fleet right now), Warmaster (six or eight armies, I think), CAV (as much as possible), Warlord (ditto, getting back in), FoW (Russians, Germans and Brits - need Americans next), Warmachine/Hordes (all factions from both games), Warzone (mostly Bauhaus, Capital, Mishima and the undead, but I have some of the Tribes of Earth too). I still look for Chronopia stuff, plus Clan War, Ogre, etc.

 

I try to pick a game and work on it for a while. I don't make a whole lot of progress over the short period (like, say, a year), but give me half a decade or so, and you can really see results. :rolleyes:

 

 

(Actually, this month I am working on my Orks, my first DBA army, and some other stuff that I should be able to knock out. A lot of the stuff above mainly gathers dust, because there is little gaming in the area, but if I ever move, it might get hauled out again in a hurry.)

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