The 25% Merc rule

[wildbill]

I didn't put this on the other thread, because I didn't feel that this question was a playbalance issue. If I'm wrong, I apologize and please feel free to move it appropiately.

 

I got asked by my Crusader player a very valid question that I ruled in his opponent's favor. But...I'm not sure it is the right call.

 

So, here goes.

 

As I stated in the "Playbalance & Mercenaries" post, he has started taking 25% Lupines with his Crusaders. No problem. Doesn't bother me or anyone else playing here in Tulsa. But, he wanted to know about absorbing those Lupines into his normal Crusader units.

 

Example: He takes Artemis the sgt with his Lupines. She gets killed. He has various other Crusader leaders with open slots in their ranks. A Crusader leader runs up and merges a Lupine or three into his ranks. A second Crusader leader grabs another Lupine or three. Is this even allowed? Assuming it is, does this now make the Lupine able to offer Mercy?

 

I ruled that you could do not do this during the game, but promised to ask the question on the boards. I know I am confused!

 

Wild Bill

[Emmel Eitch]

Example: He takes Artemis the sgt with his Lupines. She gets killed. He has various other Crusader leaders with open slots in their ranks. A Crusader leader runs up and merges a Lupine or three into his ranks. A second Crusader leader grabs another Lupine or three. Is this even allowed? Assuming it is, does this now make the Lupine able to offer Mercy?

 

I ruled that you could do not do this during the game, but promised to ask the question on the boards. I know I am confused!

 

Wild Bill

Thats a good question. My initial reaction would be to say, no you cannot regroup mercs into main troops.

[Castlebuilder]

I don't think that I would have any problem with the regrouping, but just because a merc joins a Crusader troop he should not gain their special abilities.

 

And another point - Don't the rules state that when the first troop absorbs all they can, the excess Lupines should be removed from the game? I don't think the 2nd troop would be able to run over and absorb the rest.

 

Castlebuilder

[Qwyksilver]

And another point - Don't the rules state that when the first troop absorbs all they can, the excess Lupines should be removed from the game? I don't think the 2nd troop would be able to run over and absorb the rest.

 

Castlebuilder

 

Correct. When you absorb a troop, you absorb all the troop that can fit into your leader's max troop size, and the remainder, if there are any, are forced to retreat, awarding points to your opponent. You can't split a trashed troop amongst 2+ remaining troops.

 

[MOD] This is more of a Rules Discussion question. I am going to shift it over to the appropriate Forum [/MOD]

[wildbill]

That was my bad for not catching that part in the rulebook. I'll be sure and pinpoint the exact page and wording and point that out. That may end that particular tactic. Thanks Castlebuilder and Qwyksilver!

 

Hopefully EE and company can figure out for sure about regrouping into faction units. I am going to drive using the answer "NO" until told otherwise.

 

Wild Bill

[Qwyksilver]

Page 60 in the 2nd printing Core Rulebook under The Troop Being Absorbed

 

Someone else can type it if they want. It's too early for me and I haven't had enough coffee yet.

[ElementsWarden]

Since the Merc 25% rule stats that they must be led by a merc., then I would rule that only a merc. could lead them.

[Gus Landt]

I think a lot of hassle could be avoided by just saying that the mercs cannot be absorbed into a non-merc troop.

[Qwyksilver]

Any Merc* not in Cohesion, at any time, is forced to retreat.

 

Let's make Cohesion really useful and mean something

 

 

 

 

*Obviously we're talking about Mercs in an otherwise Faction Pure, non Freelance army here.

[Brushmaster]

Any Merc* not in Cohesion, at any time, is forced to retreat.

 

Let's make Cohesion really useful and mean something

 

 

 

 

*Obviously we're talking about Mercs in an otherwise Faction Pure, non Freelance army here.

Or at least take an automatic shaken token and then the shock/beast models some sort of target to use their abilities .

[ElementsWarden]

Any Merc* not in Cohesion, at any time, is forced to retreat.

 

Let's make Cohesion really useful and mean something

 

 

 

 

*Obviously we're talking about Mercs in an otherwise Faction Pure, non Freelance army here.

Or at least take an automatic shaken token and then the shock/beast models some sort of target to use their abilities .

 

These options would further complicate the rules which I believe is against the RAGE concept.

 

If you play freelance can you mix and match the leaders and troop factions? I just looked it up and it doesn't matter so... why would it matter if it is not a freelance company?

[spiritual_exorcist]

Because from a game balance point of view by taking units of Merc in their own units seperate from your other units you are being allowed to retain your faction abilities for your non-Merc troops. Allowing them to incorporate into other units goes against this sort of notion.

 

What loyalty would a Merc have to a commander that wasn't his? I dunno, I suppose some might say, I'll join that guy because I'm more likely to survive, but other might turn around and tell the Faction leader trying to incorporate him to stuff it.

[Hellsgate]

leader makes a disiplin check??? -1 for every 2 models being absorbed???

[Lawgiver]

Any Merc* not in Cohesion, at any time, is forced to retreat.

 

Let's make Cohesion really useful and mean something

 

 

 

 

*Obviously we're talking about Mercs in an otherwise Faction Pure, non Freelance army here.

Brilliant idea Qwyk. You got my vote on that change.

[cristomeyers]

I agree. I think that enforcing Qwyk's idea would go a long way towards keeping Mercs from becoming a no-brainer. I know that I would think twice before replacing my Rangers with a unit that can be completly annihilated with a well-placed arrow or suicide run on the leader.

 

As for non-Mercs assimilating Mercs, for me the simple answer is no, they shouldn't be able to do it. The Mercs would owe their loyalty to their leader, not the army that contracted them. This is especially true when you consider that the contract would be with the now-dead leader and it becomes a real possiblity that they may not get paid if their leader is gone.

 

However, a more complicated answer for me would be that it would depend on alignment. A Good aligned army would probably have a more respectful attitude and want to protect the harried mercs from total slaughter just because it's the "right thing to do", but an Evil aligned army would probably be more "survival of the fittest."