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rgtriplec

The buzz about Reaper

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@Kristof65--I'm not one of those people playing what the rest of the herd is. The two local game shops are filled with Warmachine. That's the biggest thing going here. Not for me.

 

The Chronopia and Warzone players I regularly bring together will travel pretty far for games with no support, and this crew hardly constitutes even a fraction of the wargaming population. These games survive with models that were sculpted ten years ago, and are an acquired taste. Some are great sculpts which hold up, others are poor but when painted do the job nicely. When combined with the fluff (thirty some pages for Chronopia) and the intuitive mechanics and rules, these games have a very hardcore following. I get all three of my criteria with this game.

 

I was hoping with Warlord that for once, I would be involved in a larger community of gamers, albeit not GW sized, but at least something after Chronopia and Warzone's IP's were pulled from Excelsior. If the game was meeting all of my criteria, I would be running Warlord events no matter how small and against all odds.

 

We have about six players for Warlord that can be gathered for an event. We plan on making a go of it at Abington games to help bring in some customers for Bob, and see if Warlord will maybe see some growth. Despite my observations about Warlord, I occasionally enjoy a game, and I do want to see Reaper improve on it.

 

My earlier post about a more rigorous update for the changes would be a place to start.

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The examples you list fo novels are from much much larger companies with much more resources at their disposal. You need to realize that reaper isn't all that huge of a comapny with hundreds of people and printing presses at their disposal. Almost everyone at reaper is called upon to do double duties, so along with their usual tasks, they sometimes have to spend time casting or doing something else. They also have to send to an outside source for publication where as wizards can probably take care of that in house. But again, there is a ton of fluff and what not available online - do a searhc through older posts - plus check out some of the files on reapergames.com

 

I never proposed Reaper go into the printing business. I proposed they work with a fantasy publisher who would publish the books. Reaper would just be a filter to gleen the best manuscripts and send only the best to the publisher. Also they could run the search as a contest and hook up with one, two or ten of the dozens of web sites dedicated to nothing but writing contests for advertising it. As a contest they could also charge for entry and offer prizes... not T-shirts or key chains but something a budding novelist would be interested in like an opportunity to pitch to the publisher, writing software etcetera. There are several contests where the winners are published. One is a novel that is written or Labor Day Weekend... I believe it's called the Three Day Novel and is promoted on Amazon.com among other sites.

 

As for Reaper staff being busy. I understand that; which is why I suggested that they let the forums read the novel samples and from that concensus read only the best and send the ones Reaper liked best to the publisher.

 

As for searching the forums for old fluff posts, that is not an answer I think most wanting fluff would think was very sufficient.

 

I seriously doubt if the companies I named print their own novels.

 

I don't want to misrepresent myself and was simply regurgitating what I noticed on other boards. I like Warlord have only minor problems with the rules or engine. I love the minis. I like that they have all of the cookie cutter factions, more originality and unique factions can come later. As for fluff it's nice but not needed for me to enjoy the game but I will say the most intigueing part of Warhammer to me is the fluff, the minis - especially the plastic are horrid and the game is too large for my liking... too large as in regiment vs company.

 

As far as a lack of resourses to expand into a line that is already in production seems strange. The minis would cost nothing extra unless Reaper no longer plans to make the DHL line. If they do then how is it an extra expence?

 

As for making stats cards for the DHL and betatesting. I've played games long enough to know that once a system is implemented the rigorous beta testing becomes less and less the more things are released. New abilities, spells and the like are beta tested. Basic stats are a template, like the ones in the rulebook so creating a stat card is relitively simple.

 

I might be a conspiracy theorist or the Devil's advocate but it's reasonable to think that the reason for not using the DHL line is probably that they have sold 10,000,000 blisters and they would make no money from offering free data cards for minis that are already on my shelf. But they are a business and if they think that is best for business that is their choice to make. But by making the rumored "Popcrn Books" with new figs stats, new factions, special abilities, rules updates etcetera adding a couple new troops from DHL would be little work and appreciated by the players. It would also expand the game the way many want it expanded at little cost. How hard would it be to write stats for the two boxes of Dragonspire pirates and the Garrity angel box? But if their stats were a bonus in a popcorn book they would sell some of the minis and in the pirates case they would probably sell a few more Hanged men.

 

Implementing the DHL line into Warlord could be done in a way similar to the way GW approached Mordhiem. Mordhiem has stats and no models as does GW Historical.

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Mengu - that is a very good summary of miniature games - both for playing and non-playing.

 

The only thing I would add is that a respected vocal minority can greatly influence what games are/aren't played in a given locality. If the well-loved game store owner and his friend are playing game X but bad-mouthing game Y, then more players will be drawn to game X and away from game Y, with your aforementioned avalanche effect.

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Heyas -

 

Wizards, being a subsidary of Hasbro - I am pretty sure handles novels in house through their own press (wizards of the coast publishing) as well as Mirrorstone and possibly some others. This includes Magic the Gathering, AD&D,

 

Games Workshop has Black Library which is a company they own - and which are now being distributed through broader channels (for some reason I want to say Del Ray, but I don't think that is right) Anyways, they are popping up in Barnes and Nobels, Boarders and I even found them at this tiny little independant bookstore on the beach we go to every year.

 

I don't know about the other series - I was thinking Dragonlance which is Wizards again.

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No one was bad mouthing Warlord at Roudtable Games here in PA. The game just wasn't catching or even competing with Warmachine. From the store email I recieved, they're clearing out all their Warlord at a discount.

 

Fantasy is a tough sell these days in the States. Most people are playing 40K, or Warmachine in this region.

 

I helped our local Black Lightning rep run some of these demos at the store, but when the game doesn't grab you, and no one is biting, so to speak, it deflates one's interest greatly.

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I figured I would chime in. Let me say that while I am no Fan Boy, I love Reaper. They put out some of the best generic and affordable fantasy minis around. The thing is they are generic which is great for fantasy minis (you can use them in any game) but when you create a game based on those minis you cannot be generic.

 

What I hate about Warlord is it focuses too much on larger armies (most of which are mooks/grunts). The thing is, Reaper is known for making great CHARACTER models. The grunts are what kill the game for me. Had they created a Chainmail like mini game (the 2nd Chainmail) or Mordheim character based game based on having tons of characters they might do better.

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With each post I read in this thread, it sparks me to want to either make a "hear hear!" or a "heck no!" response. I have started and stopped my response about 10 times as I have wanted to address each an d every little thing that different people have said on here.

 

Then I come to my senses.

 

Just like in the game of Warlord itself... Change one little aspect of a game (point count, race, swap a 400 point model for 40 ten point models, terrain, scenario, objectives, competition level, etc....) and everything from the outcome to the enjoyment level during changes.... I feel the same way about everything being discussed here.

 

I can argue that I like the color red while someone else likes things that are square shapes. Apples and potatoes. Dogs and watermelons. Point is, that they can all be valid and reletive arguements even though they may not match up at all.

 

Its obvious that this thread would not have started or continued if it werent for the fact that all participants have at least some sort of yearning feeling for Reaper's products and a want for its success in the marketplace, so that we can continue to have these types of conversations.

 

I am not a fluff guy at all (at least not without pictures to go with it), but I enjoy reading them anyway when available. I am not a great gamer, but I will spend hours analyzing the perfect army to field against an unknown opponent for an unknown task or scenario. I am possibly one of the slowest painters on the Earth, but I still come check this board and others 3-4 times a day in hopes of seeing some new cool paintjob to inspire another unfinished one from me.

 

Keep painting, keep playing, keep coming up with new suggestions as to how this game, this company, this board of friendship and conversation can grow and inspire and fill our lives a little more.

 

Thank you.

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What I hate about Warlord is it focuses too much on larger armies (most of which are mooks/grunts). The thing is, Reaper is known for making great CHARACTER models. The grunts are what kill the game for me. Had they created a Chainmail like mini game (the 2nd Chainmail) or Mordheim character based game based on having tons of characters they might do better.

 

This reminds me of my first reaction to the game as well. I was trying to make an army that consisted of 9 models or so. I thought that was a daunting task to paint those 9 models to begin with. I would have a Warlord, a cleric, a mage, 5 or so warriors/archers, and a solo. I would load them all up with the best spells and equipment (including the warriors), grabbed a standard and a musician, and thought I was ready to play. It didn't take me very long to realize this was not the intent of the game, when after a game or two, my "band of heroes" got slaughtered by a horde of grunt warriors with Sergeants.

 

However I did get over that gut reaction, and painted about 3500 points worth of stuff since then...

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Implementing the DHL line into Warlord could be done in a way similar to the way GW approached Mordhiem. Mordhiem has stats and no models as does GW Historical.

 

Mordheim has a whole range of models to support it. Look in the store, in the specialist range of models under "Mordheim"

 

GW historical can use anything, however - which is nice. Its also one of GW's better games. :) Most of the specialist games, and one-offs are really fantastic games.

 

Also for stats - the generic stat cards that come with warlord are fantastic for making your own stats for models - so you can take the pirates of the dragonspire, chose a baseline stat card and then allocate the points for special abilities and wargear. You can also use "Counts as" rules - ie, make a bunch of living pirates using the Razig List, or the Mercenary list.

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Also for stats - the generic stat cards that come with warlord are fantastic for making your own stats for models - so you can take the pirates of the dragonspire, chose a baseline stat card and then allocate the points for special abilities and wargear. You can also use "Counts as" rules - ie, make a bunch of living pirates using the Razig List, or the Mercenary list.

 

That just got me to wondering - maybe a good product for Reaper to make would be some DHL Data Card sets, in the Warlord style, along with a small background piece about the models selected and available only for sale, not download. Not officially recognized in tournaments, that way they don't have to be extensively playtested, but good for expanding the Warlord game and it's background to appeal to the more casual gamer. Maybe publish them as V1.0 or V1.1 stats (since the current datacards are 1.2) to differentiate them - if they play out well, and get good feedback, they could be upgraded to 1.2 (or whatever the current version is).

 

Kind of like what Magic:TG does for it's official tournaments - only cards from the latest sets are usuable (which invalidates my entire collection of Revised and Ice Age!)

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Out of curiosity - why sale and not download.

 

I think it would be fairly easy to come up with a template that stats and a picture of the model could be placed in, and then posted on-line - with very low production costs that could be available for players to download and use if they wish. They'd totally be unofficial, but would be a fun little something that players could toss into their games.

 

I think players should also understand that these stats may not have been fully playtested and are just being thrown out there - so there could be stats for models that are totally broken. A little background piece could also be available, and could fill in as a bit of fluff for the world.

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Personally, I would much rather see Reaper keep putting out minis and get to the fluff later. Everyone's pretty much in agreement that most of the miniatures they put out are going to sell whether or not the buyers are playing Warlord with them. A deeper background would help a lot, but I'd rather see Reaper finish the model line first.

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no.. I never wanna see reaper finish the model line if it means an end to DHL. :(

 

I'd cry. :(

 

DHL moderns and sci fi would make it all better, however - but I'd still like my fantasy fix. :)

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oh no no no, I never meant that. I just meant that given a choice, I'd rather see more models than fluff for Warlord. I too would be sobbing if DHL came to an end.

 

I agree, though, some modern and sci-fi in Dark Heaven would help a lot. Why stop with just DnD and other fantasy? There's still a very large Shadowrun market that as far as I know, only Aberrant Games has tried to tap into with Rezolution, and they're more about their game (which, granted, is great) than making general purpose minis.

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Out of curiosity - why sale and not download.

Based on other threads here, it appeared the Reaper couldn't/wouldn't devote the resources to doing datacards for DHL. So I didn't presume to go there.

 

I figured it was more likely to happen if it was a product they could offer for sale.

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