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Gus Landt

Army Faction Special Abilities Public Beta

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:shrug: You obviously think elves are useless. I obviously disagree.

 

PS

 

No, I would prefer the FA was faction wide and not soley archer based. I thinks elves are great. I'm probably playing them in a tournament this week. I think their archery is great, easily the best in the game. Do I think it is powerful enough to base the entire faction around it? No. Is it as important as their speed? maybe, I say probably not.

 

I guess when I see the elves dominate with archery I'll believe its hype. I can recall that when Millerthyme started playing with Eowad and the Scrye shot pieplate. He could really rip into an army in no time. I think he beat a Lupine army twice in the time my game went three turns. I don't see any dominance in the new archery. If I play dwarfs, I never even bother paying attention to where archers are.

 

I think you are going to see more and more elf player gravitate to more soldier and caster based builds. We have two maybe three elf players in our tournament so they'll get a good test.

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:shrug: You obviously think elves are useless. I obviously disagree.

 

PS

 

No, I would prefer the FA was faction wide and not soley archer based. I thinks elves are great. I'm probably playing them in a tournament this week. I think their archery is great, easily the best in the game. Do I think it is powerful enough to base the entire faction around it? No. Is it as important as their speed? maybe, I say probably not.

There are factions and sublists based around speed, defensive melee, offensive melee, defensive ranged, superiour healing, offensive magic and defensive magic. The elves happen to be the faction that get a huge boost in Offensive Range. If the faction gets a FA in one of the other categories, it will probably come in the form of a sublist. I don't really see the elven Default bread and butter changing after 3 years.

 

I guess when I see the elves dominate with archery I'll believe its hype. I can recall that when Millerthyme started playing with Eowad and the Scrye shot pieplate. He could really rip into an army in no time. I think he beat a Lupine army twice in the time my game went three turns. I don't see any dominance in the new archery. If I play dwarfs, I never even bother paying attention to where archers are.

The revamp was centered around balancing the game.

Remember that Archery was overpowered and multiple track adepts were considered underpowered.(Especially ones with low DV)

 

I think you are going to see more and more elf player gravitate to more soldier and caster based builds. We have two maybe three elf players in our tournament so they'll get a good test.

I think you are right and I think it's a GOOD thing. Even melee centered armies will take a chunk of magic or range, so why shouldn't a ranged army do the same?

 

If elven players use 33% archers, 33% magic, 33% melee, I don't see how this hurts the faction. I think it's what was originally intended.

 

From the games I've mentioned Eric's(MillerThyme) break down has been about 50% archer, 50% melee and he's been kicking butt and taking names. Is that fewer archers than he would take before, yes. Do I still feel like that's a crap ton of archers, Yes.

 

I think when your army turns into a one trick pony it's obvious that something is wrong, and the Elves with their Current FA, are far from that.

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OK, I really messed up the wording of 'Shadowy'. The intent is that when elves are in any cover, they treat that cover as Heavy Cover when being attacked by ranged attacks. I'll get the wording updated.

:angry: SNAFU!

I should have known that it was wishfull thinking with that wording.

Oh well I still stand by what I have said and it seems most people agree with me.

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OK, I really messed up the wording of 'Shadowy'. The intent is that when elves are in any cover, they treat that cover as Heavy Cover when being attacked by ranged attacks. I'll get the wording updated.

 

In that case, I will repeat my comment that the elves lost the "shoot into melee" aspect of sure shot as well as having to pay for the movement bonuses, without gaining anything in return.

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The re-roll is a better ability by far from what I've seen in the game, they lost the ability to shoot into melee and through pin-holes, and gained the re-roll.

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The re-roll is a better ability by far from what I've seen in the game, they lost the ability to shoot into melee and through pin-holes, and gained the re-roll.

 

re-roll is nice, but when your melee guys are average hitters with low to average DVs (which tend to be taken out with defensive strikes) shooting in melee was a great boon to the elves. base the enemy with your melee but don't attack (they tend to die that way) shoot them free from b2b and repeat.

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The re-roll is a better ability by far from what I've seen in the game, they lost the ability to shoot into melee and through pin-holes, and gained the re-roll.

 

re-roll is nice, but when your melee guys are average hitters with low to average DVs (which tend to be taken out with defensive strikes) shooting in melee was a great boon to the elves. base the enemy with your melee but don't attack (they tend to die that way) shoot them free from b2b and repeat.

 

I suppose you could adapt the tactic somewhat...requires greater coordination though. Have a mixed troops of warriors and archers; send the warriors into contact, shoot, and use their other action to remove the shaken token. Not nearly as effective as the old sure shot, but if you really need to slow someone down...

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The re-roll is a better ability by far from what I've seen in the game, they lost the ability to shoot into melee and through pin-holes, and gained the re-roll.

 

re-roll is nice, but when your melee guys are average hitters with low to average DVs (which tend to be taken out with defensive strikes) shooting in melee was a great boon to the elves. base the enemy with your melee but don't attack (they tend to die that way) shoot them free from b2b and repeat.

 

I think the elves would be about perfect if they had the old Shadowy and either the pinhole shooting or everyone was fearless in regard to being shot at you could call it DAUNTLESS. Speed without terrain and shooting into melee are what the elves were about, IMO.

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I think the elves would be about perfect if they had the old Shadowy and either the pinhole shooting or everyone was fearless in regard to being shot at you could call it DAUNTLESS. Speed without terrain and shooting into melee are what the elves were about, IMO.

The Elves still have the shooting into melee ability; it's just that it is the Dark Elves (Darkspawn) that have it instead of the pansy Elves. :rolleyes:

 

Rich

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The re-roll is a better ability by far from what I've seen in the game, they lost the ability to shoot into melee and through pin-holes, and gained the re-roll.

 

re-roll is nice, but when your melee guys are average hitters with low to average DVs (which tend to be taken out with defensive strikes) shooting in melee was a great boon to the elves. base the enemy with your melee but don't attack (they tend to die that way) shoot them free from b2b and repeat.

 

I think the elves would be about perfect if they had the old Shadowy and either the pinhole shooting or everyone was fearless in regard to being shot at you could call it DAUNTLESS. Speed without terrain and shooting into melee are what the elves were about, IMO.

 

See, and that would in my opinoin take it from playable now to slightly broken.

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the Dark Elves (Darkspawn) that have it instead of the pansy Elves.

 

Rich

Yay for Fearless Fodder! Now if only all the new datacards for the Darkspawn had Fearless too. <_<

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I think the elves would be about perfect if they had the old Shadowy and either the pinhole shooting or everyone was fearless in regard to being shot at you could call it DAUNTLESS. Speed without terrain and shooting into melee are what the elves were about, IMO.

 

I like this Idea alot so heres my two cents

 

Dauntless: Warriors of the vale been trained to fight in perfect coordination. As a result the following models ignore discipline checks for ranged attacks in melee All leaders and elites, Royal guard, vale warriors, longthorns and vale swordsmen.

 

Elven eyes: The elves have the keenest sight in all of talos and can therefore ignore the half inch LOS corridor opting instead to fire when any LOS can be established. Normal cover rules apply.

 

I would love to have either one of these both would be too much though.

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I think the elves would be about perfect if they had the old Shadowy and either the pinhole shooting or everyone was fearless in regard to being shot at you could call it DAUNTLESS. Speed without terrain and shooting into melee are what the elves were about, IMO.

 

I like this Idea alot so heres my two cents

 

Dauntless: Warriors of the vale been trained to fight in perfect coordination. As a result the following models ignore discipline checks for ranged attacks in melee All leaders and elites, Royal guard, vale warriors, longthorns and vale swordsmen.

 

Elven eyes: The elves have the keenest sight in all of talos and can therefore ignore the half inch LOS corridor opting instead to fire when any LOS can be established. Normal cover rules apply.

 

I would love to have either one of these both would be too much though.

Would you give up Sure Shot for this?

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I think the elves would be about perfect if they had the old Shadowy and either the pinhole shooting or everyone was fearless in regard to being shot at you could call it DAUNTLESS. Speed without terrain and shooting into melee are what the elves were about, IMO.

 

I like this Idea alot so heres my two cents

 

Dauntless: Warriors of the vale been trained to fight in perfect coordination. As a result the following models ignore discipline checks for ranged attacks in melee All leaders and elites, Royal guard, vale warriors, longthorns and vale swordsmen.

 

Elven eyes: The elves have the keenest sight in all of talos and can therefore ignore the half inch LOS corridor opting instead to fire when any LOS can be established. Normal cover rules apply.

 

I would love to have either one of these both would be too much though.

Would you give up Sure Shot for this?

 

I would, but I ill very seldom use vale archers, unless I am fighting an equally shooty army like Razig or maybe Hanged. I like Eowad, Caerowyn, Selwyn, the Sniper and the dragon, but they are going to hit much more often because of super RAVs. But people with Vale archers need Sure shot.

 

Both elf armies that played tonight lost. One had 12 range models and mine had 2. At the end of my game I had one Royal guardsman and the Sniper, and my opponent Duke Gerard and a caster and a Justicar. He had 125 more points than me. It was 1500 game and I faced an army of pretty much just Lion Lancers and Justicars and a guardian Beast. My army was build around 7 cats and 7 centaur warriors but just as the game was starting I had to change my list because the store did not have cavalry bases to base my proxies. I ended up not accounting for one of the four centaurs I had to cut with the 7 cats so I was actually about 1425 and not 1500. So even with an off the cuff broken melee army that was missing 75 points. I still managed to fight he Army of Justice to pretty much a deadlock. So, don't under estimate elf melee, IMO they should share in the FA love a little.

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I think the elves would be about perfect if they had the old Shadowy and either the pinhole shooting or everyone was fearless in regard to being shot at you could call it DAUNTLESS. Speed without terrain and shooting into melee are what the elves were about, IMO.

 

I like this Idea alot so heres my two cents

 

Dauntless: Warriors of the vale been trained to fight in perfect coordination. As a result the following models ignore discipline checks for ranged attacks in melee All leaders and elites, Royal guard, vale warriors, longthorns and vale swordsmen.

 

Elven eyes: The elves have the keenest sight in all of talos and can therefore ignore the half inch LOS corridor opting instead to fire when any LOS can be established. Normal cover rules apply.

 

I would love to have either one of these both would be too much though.

Would you give up Sure Shot for this?

 

I would, but I ill very seldom use vale archers, unless I am fighting an equally shooty army like Razig or maybe Hanged. I like Eowad, Caerowyn, Selwyn, the Sniper and the dragon, but they are going to hit much more often because of super RAVs. But people with Vale archers need Sure shot.

 

Both elf armies that played tonight lost. One had 12 range models and mine had 2. At the end of my game I had one Royal guardsman and the Sniper, and my opponent Duke Gerard and a caster and a Justicar. He had 125 more points than me. It was 1500 game and I faced an army of pretty much just Lion Lancers and Justicars and a guardian Beast. My army was build around 7 cats and 7 centaur warriors but just as the game was starting I had to change my list because the store did not have cavalry bases to base my proxies. I ended up not accounting for one of the four centaurs I had to cut with the 7 cats so I was actually about 1425 and not 1500. So even with an off the cuff broken melee army that was missing 75 points. I still managed to fight he Army of Justice to pretty much a deadlock. So, don't under estimate elf melee, IMO they should share in the FA love a little.

 

The only reason my elven army lost was because it was tournament based. If it was standard game play I would've wiped out my opponents Merc army the next round. If this happened, I would have had 358 points left of the board with no healing where he had successfully used his two Cure 3's and two Cure 2's.

edited:

In the end, I had 5 models with a sum of 2 points of damage (Selwynns, 2 Rangers (1 point on one), Vale Warrior(1 point), Mossbeard) where the Merc had 4 models with a sum of 9 points of damage (Lupin Rager (4 points), Crossbowman Muscian, Sigurd (2points), Callindra (3 points)). With that being said I'd rather have the Sure Shot.

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