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DBlagg

New Elven Cards

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Ok, what I want to know is who at Reaper that's designing this thing is playing/likes the elves so much?

They have some of the best spells of anyone with the arcane stuff that can be used defensively???

Now, they get a SILVER DRAGON as a warlord???

That's a huge chump move, but the one that really puts it over the top is creating Larnach, Grey Elf Arch Mage.

Yes, he has fewer tracks, but he's a match for the Warlord liche Moandain in CP???

Someone is making demi-gods of the elves and I for one don't like/appreciate it at all and it needs to stop!

I fully expect Moandain to go up to a CP of 11 if you're going to give this elven captain of all things a CP of 9!

I'm sorry, but this is just about that last straw that finishes ticking me off and pushes me into selling out of Warlord.

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Elves have always excelled at Magic and Ranged Combat. This is nothing new. A couple major points to consider when you are comparing the Models is not just the difference of two DT, which is rather significant, but also the difference in DV, lower troop size and rapid CP degredation of the Grey Elf when looking at Moandain. Also, Grey Elf lacks Tough, Fearsome, Undead, Spy and Tactician.

 

The Witch Queen still remains the master of Magic with her CP 10. There are 9 Models with CP 8+

Two are with the Elves, two with Darkspawn.

 

It is not an attempt to belittle the Necropolis. Moandain is still an extremely potent spell caster. Yes there is an elf that is as good as him, for a track. By the time Moandain loses his CP 9, the Grey Elf is dead. Don't minimize this. I'd hate to see you quit because one of the new Elf models is a good caster, especially when the army is designed around potent magic.

 

Yes the Silver Dragon is totally crazy, but it also costs just under 300 points, which is pushing twice the average cost of other Warlords. He's on par with Rauthuros, Judas and Broodmaster and a few other Faction's big hitting solos, like the Hydra, Hill Giant, Guardian Angel, Grave Horror, etc.

 

The Elves are still very beatable. They just have some new models that everyone has to adapt to changes in strategy.

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To the dragon: yes, it's powerful, but consider: it costs 2 to 3 times as much as most other warlords, and is limited to using either it's casting or melee abilities at once. And there's always the lucky 10.

 

Magic: Elves are supposed to have extremely powerful magic. The increase in magic power of the elves may be partially to make up for the slight weakening of their ranged capabilities. Looking at Larnach: focus on the fact that he's an archmage, not a captain (he's got a tiny troop limit, by the way).

 

EDIT: Looks like Qwyk beat me.

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I wont try to argue the strengths of those models you listed. As I agree that they are very powerful. I will only argue that just about every facton has some similarly strong models in one way or another...

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I'm done trying to convince people that the datacards aren't balanced from faction to faction, model to model, when they haven't even given them a shot. If you want to bail on the game, send me your stuff.

 

I promise I'll take pictures of your faction models stomping all over some Elves when I face them. <_<

 

~v

Edited by Shakandara

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And one thing. If you really want to screw with an Elf player, carry around a few level 2 mages with nothing but Counterspells, and make that CP 9 into a CP 3!!!

 

Ian (37) + Counterspell (20)x4 = 117.

Compare that Mage nerfng bargain to any of those CP 8 magic juggernauts without even buying a single spell.

Edited by Qwyksilver

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And one thing. If you really want to screw with an Elf player, carry around a few level 2 mages with nothing but Counterspells, and make that CP 9 into a CP 3!!!

 

Ian (37) + Counterspell (20)x4 = 117.

Compare that Mage nerfng bargain to any of those CP 8 magic juggernauts without even buying a single spell.

 

On the topic of counterspells...is the counterspell automatic, rolled against a 10, or rolled against the casting mage's MD?

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I've played with both the Silver Dragon and the Grey Elf. The elf dies so easily it's not even worth discussing how powerless he is when he is being attacked. I wouldn't put more than 2 spells on him, since he is not likely to get them off. A few archers or some cavalry will take him down after he casts 1-2 spells. Moandain, thanks to his considerably better DV and damage tracks, will be able to get 3-4 spells off before he expires.

 

The power of a model is not dictated by it's rank, but by its point value. There are plenty of Adepts and Grunts that are better than sergeants and captains. For instance compare Kak'Urg an orc Captain to a Reptus Longstriker, which is a grunt, and you'll see what I mean.

 

The Silver Dragon is oodles of points, and is on par with everything else that's in the same point ballpark.

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The Silver Dragon is oodles of points, and is on par with everything else that's in the same point ballpark.

 

A good part of my problem with the whole thing is that IMO little to no thought was put into it.

A dragon with only 6 tracks, come on!

A dragon compared to the normal models would have at a minimum twice that many tracks.

Dragons are just nigh invincible, its just not realistic.

Sorry, but to me that's just stupid.

 

Yes, elves are supposed to be fairly strong mages, but come on, we're talking about an undead liche warlord here that should be stronger than any but the strongest elf mages. No way an elf captain mage should have that great of a CP. Not only that, they get the best spells too.

 

It seems like the elves excel at pretty much everything, as well as most of the other factions now being completed whereas factions like the Necros and Crusaders are being left in the dust. What bugs me most is with all these new cards, there's no way they've tested all the changes thoroughly. Wait until you get some min/max masters out there who've seen all the new stuff and can work with it some and I guarantee there will be some gaping holes with uber munchie armies created.

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excel at stuff is what elves do. until you get them into melee. then, well then they are usually dead.

 

my buddies and I are having a blast working our lists to take on the new elves, because we have an out of towner (who we like playing with) who plays elves, and its fun to guess what he'll build and be prepared for it. Sometimes it even works. but its FUN!!!

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Warlord is *not* D&D. Whatever expectations you might have about what things should or should not be like is not relevant to the Warlord game. To say that something isn't "realistic" in a fantasy wargame's stats is laughable, at best.

 

And, for the record, the Silver Dragon has 7 Tracks. "0" is still a track.

 

~v

Edited by Shakandara

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Yes, elves are supposed to be fairly strong mages, but come on, we're talking about an undead liche warlord here that should be stronger than any but the strongest elf mages. No way an elf captain mage should have that great of a CP. Not only that, they get the best spells too.

 

As I said earlier...this is an archmage who just happens to be a captain. You're getting too hung up on model roles. He could have been an elite, but then would overlap with Lysette; this way, the variety within the faction is maintained.

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The Silver Dragon is oodles of points, and is on par with everything else that's in the same point ballpark.

 

A good part of my problem with the whole thing is that IMO little to no thought was put into it.

A dragon with only 6 tracks, come on!

A dragon compared to the normal models would have at a minimum twice that many tracks.

Dragons are just nigh invincible, its just not realistic.

Sorry, but to me that's just stupid.

 

Yes, elves are supposed to be fairly strong mages, but come on, we're talking about an undead liche warlord here that should be stronger than any but the strongest elf mages. No way an elf captain mage should have that great of a CP. Not only that, they get the best spells too.

 

It seems like the elves excel at pretty much everything, as well as most of the other factions now being completed whereas factions like the Necros and Crusaders are being left in the dust. What bugs me most is with all these new cards, there's no way they've tested all the changes thoroughly. Wait until you get some min/max masters out there who've seen all the new stuff and can work with it some and I guarantee there will be some gaping holes with uber munchie armies created.

 

 

 

I beg to differ. Had you not noticed that judas can fly? He also has 7 damage tracks. Hardly the same vampire he used to be.

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Game balance: Have you even tried playing games where the dragon and/or mage was present?

 

Fluff: Well who's to say dragons aren't weaker than in D&D? Or maybe it's a young dragon?

 

You seem to be the only one with a problem.

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