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Help me sell my soul to Unspeakable Darkness (aka GW)


warlordgarou
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Okay, it's not that I dislike Warlord or CAV, but I'll admit that I have grown awfully tired of having to create a gaming group from scratch every time we move somewhere. So, since you can't swing a bag of polyhedrons without smacking a GW player alongside the head, I've decided to bite the bullet and pick up one of the core GW games. (Disclaimer - I enjoy their specialty games, but am largely ambivalent about the core GW rules. But the alternative is no or little miniature gaming for the next few years, so I'll take what I can get.)

 

Anyway, this leaves me looking for some recommendations. My playing style is somewhat eclectic - for Flames of War, I play a Soviet Strelkovy company (think horde army, low skill and perfectly ok with 50% casualties). For Warmachine, it's Cryx - light, fast, heavy on magic and with aluminum foil for army. Hordes, it's Trollbloods - a solid, heavy hitting army that aims for resilience. (With that said, I also have a Panzerkompanie, as well as all basic Warmachine and Hordes factions, and have played most of them.)

 

In previous editions of WFB, I played Undead (like, back in 3rd ed), and both Orks and Dwarves (in 5th? 6th? whichever came before the current one.) I played 40k back in the good ole days of Rogue Trader, and played Imperial Guard, Orks, Marines, and Tyranids. So I am at least passably familiar with the universe, though I note that it is somewhat more lighthearted than the days when the Guard had the Penal Battalions and Human Bombs.

 

So, my basic questions:

1) Is any army (read: race, not specific army list) considered especially beardy or underpowered?

2) Can anyone give me the basic point values of the various GW Battleforce and MegaForce boxes? Are they considered fairly decent starter sets?

 

I'm contacting a local player group, so if everyone there plays Orks or Space Marines, I'd probably choose something different, but I thought I would pick the collective brains of the Reaper forums. I'll also probably avoid Tyranids, since the 2nd ed rules for them let a bad taste in my mouth, and I don't want to start with something that has that kind of negative baggage.

 

(And yes, I plan on just buying on either a megaforce, battleforce or semi-random boxes enough for a small army, then trying Dr Faust's 21-day challenge.)

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In current rule sets the most underpowered (all hearsay) tends to be the Ork's followed by the Nids for 40k .. it's been said that the ork's at present are really only played to kill time and just have a good time with no expectation of victory.

 

Point values for the battleforce/megaforce ...

 

space marine megaforce i think will give you about a 1000pt army .. bare minimum of 800 points though if you take no heavy weapons/wargear and just use base models.

SM battle force is designed to give you a 500pt army ... but it has no command unit so you'll need to add that.

 

I can only assume the other mega/battle forces are set for the same thing ... 1000 for megaforce and 500 for battle force

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So, my basic questions:

1) Is any army (read: race, not specific army list) considered especially beardy or underpowered?

 

A good rule of thumb is that the older the codex/army book the more underpowered and the newer the codex/army book the more beardy.

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So, my basic questions:

1) Is any army (read: race, not specific army list) considered especially beardy or underpowered?

 

A good rule of thumb is that the older the codex/army book the more underpowered and the newer the codex/army book the more beardy.

Yeah, I know all about codex creep. It looks like Chaos is the most recent, but I didn't find a timeline of releases.

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I think that there are not so many 'broken' Codexes, more force selections. So, for example, while the Tyranids are not unchallenging, the 'Nidzilla' list is very powerful, the 'Fish of Fury' Mech Tau list is also popular, etc.

 

Chaos is the latest Codex out there, barely a few weeks old now. There looks to be a 'Daemon Codex' in the works, as there are pretty much no Daemons in the Chaos Marine Codex. Orks should have a new Codex shortly, and may even be the next one out.

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I too am playing more GW again. The player pool is great and the games are good enough and the 40K minis are nice. Blood Bowl is the best!!!!

 

I am also using my powers of the Purple Hand to steer some of them toward Warlord and CAV. We'll see how it goes...

 

In Warmachine, I play Cryx as my primary and Trollbloods as well and also won Best General at a GT with Undead. @WG, are u my evil twin, or am I the evil one?

 

Anywho, Empire is not doing well in GTs for Fantasy and are considered the friendly list, though the firing line is thought "beardy." Whatever. I hate the fact that they blame players and not playtestors and rule makers for poor balance. The Nid-zilla list is a little OP but not unbeatable. The Chaos boxed army for 40K looks solid and is available. Look for High Elves in October. They look pretty, especially the lion chariots. :wub:

 

Waitaminute!!!! I play Druchii..."We hates us the Hi elfs!!!!"

Edited by Ranzadule
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You might want to see if anyone in your area plays Flames of War as well, I know around here it has as large a following as the GW products do, if not bigger. It might not be your thing since it is WW2 based but it will keep you from the GW insanity lol.

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You might want to see if anyone in your area plays Flames of War as well, I know around here it has as large a following as the GW products do, if not bigger. It might not be your thing since it is WW2 based but it will keep you from the GW insanity lol.

Nope. In town, I have my choice of Heroclix or MWDA. If I travel about 25 miles, I can add GW stuff to the mix, as well as a lot more clix. There used to be a Warmachine group, but not anymore.

 

Part of it is also because I have been trying to take gaming stuff along when we visit the in-laws, but it's an extra 30 minutes (or more, with Chicago traffic) for me to get in a FoW game, whereas they have a GW store 5 minutes away. GW games are less than ideal, but much better than the current situation, which is no gaming, and it's still better than clix.

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If that's the case then I would almost try to start a new CAV group again than be limited to GW. Thats me though and I feel for your plight. Lots of other games out there too, its a pity that some folks that go down that GW alley cant seem to get out of the 'there is only GW' mentality.

 

Between GW or clix is like trying to pick the lesser of two evils... not sure there is a winner.

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The space marine company for Apocalypse is 450 retail and has 6 full tac squads, 2 full assault squads and 2 full devastator squads. Also includes a razorback and 8 rhinos as well as command squad.

 

I don't know the exact price of the individual components, but I think it's close to:

 

8 Rhinos = 240

1 Razorback = 35

1 Command Squad = 35

6 Tac squads = 210

2 Assault squads = 100

2 Devastator squads = 110

 

= 730 ish

 

You'd likely want to get some scouts, bikes, termies, Land Raiders...

BUT this is a great set to split with another marine player.

Edited by Ranzadule
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GW owns most of the gamign market, next to WotC...wizkids is catching up, but ever so slowly...

 

It's way too bad we have to play subscription to GW...but hey, you are right. you can at least find the GW players...other gamers either hide under rocks or are not worth talking to...(yes, i said it...i've met vampire players before who were so whack in their beliefs/conversation choices it was sad to be involved in the conversation...)

 

i say pick what you like...either it will eventually receive a baaad codex, or you can at least be smarter than your opponent, as that works 50% of the time.

 

i know some of us can play collect em' all with 400$ armies, but i'm not one of them.

 

pick your type. stick with it.

 

Sad note: GW's Lord of the Rings game is mostly superior in basic rules value than the other games, yet it is faded in power with the fading fad of P.Jackson...though i don't like the 'roll off to fight' dice mechanic, all other aspects: how a turn is played, heroic stats, Balance of magic...all is pretty good.

i will say the stats they cook up are poorly researched/uninventive, but then again...

 

I must confess. taking up 40K again looks like a good idea....

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If you want to get into GW more cheaply, there is always someone who is ticked off at GW dumping their stuff on Bartertown for their new favorite game. :poke:

Bartertown. Ebay. the works is available if you know the place. hell, most Online game stores will back-door the stuff for 10% off or less!

 

OK, lemme explain...i have bought expensive stuff before, i've bought cheap, for all kinds of games.

 

the fact that GW consistently sells the same product over and over again cycling newer models and different tweaks of the same rules is something that Boggles me. props to their specialist games...at least they have made interesting forays there...

 

when they upgraded their casting process...i did buy in.

 

the release of the Tau made me giggle

 

But the company is INBRED. and very much so...afterall, they release Demon Hunters (IG/Space marine mix-o-rama) and call it new. now, i DO look on the bright side...i have plenty of scupts to choose from, i pretty much know what each army does (unless they throw a big change at me, like giving the eldar the equivalent of combat auto-shotguns when they once had FN-FAL's)

 

by now, they could have some 24 races for Warhammer, and some 13-ish races for 40K

(army sub-lists do not count....)

and still do other force partial model and rules updates.

 

or, they could have have 11 or so different story line chapters...if they Do, they have a crap time advertising it...hasn't macragge been invaded some 40,000 times?

 

it'd be nice if Gotrek's grandson was kickin' around with pappy's axe...with the Daemon Slayer long since dead...

 

i guess there is some inhuman desire in humans to buy re-furbs of their same ol' s#1t...

worse when you get looked at funny because your army is 4th ed. mini's, not 6.5, or whatnot...

 

*ramble, ramble*

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