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If two models from a section use CC to damage a model and then a third member fires at the same target at range is the damage dealt at the same time or is the CC damage taken into account before the ranged attack resolution? What if the situation was reversed?

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Damage is resolved at the end of the action, not the activation. So perfectly legal technique would be for models A and B to fire at a target, resolve their damage, then charge models C and D into base to base contact and conduct close combat at the new lower DV.

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Damage is resolved at the end of the action, not the activation. So perfectly legal technique would be for models A and B to fire at a target, resolve their damage, then charge models C and D into base to base contact and conduct close combat at the new lower DV.

 

Not disagreeing Sarge, but where do you find your basis for this? It makes a significant difference in a new strategy I'm looking to employ.

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Page 89 -

 

"All damage takes affect after all Ranged Attacks and Defensive Fire have been resolved."

 

Close combat, step 6, applies damage.

 

Neither step syas end of the activation - the damage is applied after the shooting / close combat.

 

From that, I would agree with Sgt. Crunch.

 

Mike

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Because the rulebook specifically states that damage is resolved for Ranged Attacks and Defensive Strikes simultaneously. There is no mention of Close Combat being resolved at the same time. In fact, Close Combat resolution isn't even handled for several pages. Even if the argument of Close Combat used to be a seperate set of combat, you could always shoot a target and then move into Close Combat and start whuppin on the damaged enemy.

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Yes it is a non-repeatable action just like Ranged Attack in all it's variations. However, it is a separate type of non-repeatable action (page 75). Non-repeatable actions of the same type for the entire section must be resolved at the same time (page 76). The resolution steps for Ranged Attack at the end state "All damage takes effect after all Ranged Attacks and Defensive Fires have been resolved." (page 89) If you're still using the original (broken) close combat rules, damage is applied after both sides of the CC take their attack rolls until somebody is dead (page 97) so it's quite impossible to conduct CC and apply damage at the same time as Range Attacks or at the end of the activation. If you're using the new CC rules (which are much better) from the beta errata file they state in Step 8 of "How To Resolve Close Combat" (page 5) that "All Damage Takes Effect."

 

None of these reference anywhere that CC or RA damage occurs simultaneously or at the end of the activation. Heck, try this on for size:

 

A Mech Inf section with six rifle teams and say two badgers. Two of the teams have FIST, two have AT-23s, two have satchel charges. The two FIST teams dismount and call in a couple of air strikes, The transports move forward one movement action, the AT-23 teams dismount and fire their missiles at the target, The transports move forward using a second movement action. The remaining teams dismount into base to base contact with the target and engage it in CC. If I'm really lucky with my dice, that works out that the airstrikes go against the DV the target started the activation with, the AT-23's attack is against the DV after the two airstrikes, then the CC is against the DV after the missile attacks. Potentially 8 points of damage (10 if you're using No Mercy doctrine). If you were spendy, substitute Orbital Pinpoint Strikes for the airstrikes and get 6 attacks from the FIST units.

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The intent is for the CC damage to be treated just like any other type of damage and applied at the end of the activation. We will look at making sure that is cleared up..

 

Where does it say damage takes place at the end of the activation? So the example of infantry FISTing, shooting, and then CCing - none of the initial attacks degrade the target? Doesn't make sense to me. If it takes place at the end of the activation, the line about taking into account any damage incured while shooting (page 87 - Ranged Attacks While Moving) is invalidated.

 

Mike

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The rules very clearly state when damage from both Ranged Attacks and Close Combat should be applied. Follow the rules.

 

For now, deal with Strike the same way. Declare your Strikes, Resolve your Strikes, Apply Damage. We'll get it officially addressed in the Eratta.

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So based upon this discussion and the discussion involving Orbital Insertion the following should be a viable tactic (please correct if not):

 

Mechanized Infantry Section, Rach Berserker Faction doctrine

 

2x Kraken Gunship/Transport (orbital insertion upgrade)

4x Rifle team w/ 4 satchel charges

 

1. Insert the Krakens 12" from enemy models per Orbital Insertion.

 

2. Move 12" to engage enemy unit

 

3. Unload Infantry into B2B

 

4. Use remaining Kraken move to get 5" away

 

5. Engage in CC (if succesful doing 3 pts of damage per infantry attacking model. 2 for berserker, 1 for satchel charge for a total of 12 possible damage.)

 

6. Apply CC damage

 

7. Fire the Kraken's GC using the new stats of the target based on the damage inflicted by the close assault.

 

Ideally anything other than a model with 8 tracks should be dead and you don't have to worry about your transports getting smoked before you get there.

 

Thoughts???

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