scotty kahn Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 I think a 750 box might end up being a bit pricey dollar wise. 500 may be the way to go , so people dont see the price and run. Maybe one troop of basic type soldiers(half archers half melee), the poster boy Warlords, a mage/cleric and then some sort of solo. So, in other words almost the exact same type of setup the old starters came with except some of the soldiers would be swapped for a few with ranged capability. Heres an example of what i would like to see in a starter. Khong-To= 157 Pakpao=52 4 x Reptus warriors=164 3 x Reptus Archers=78 Crymorian Warrior=59 Comes in at 510 points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty kahn Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Dwarves. King Thorgarm=148 Ivar=71 Dwarf Warrior x 5=145 piercers x 2=62 Dire bear=75 501 total. Elves Prince Danithal=147 Ardynn=54 Royal Guardsmen x 4=140 Vale archers x 3=99 Baeldrinahr=62 502 total Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgtriplec Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Goal - 8-9 models, 425 points, =/>$45 Crusaders - 411 points 8 models $43.42 Mother Superior Kristianna & Page 7.49 Valandil, Archmage 5.99 Hospitalier x 4.99 Justicar x 2 x 4.99 Ivy Crown Archer x 2 x 4.99 Saramonde, Chronicler 4.99 Darkspawn - 417 points points 8 models $39.92 Witch Queen 5.49 Isiri Archer x 2 x 4.99 Isiri Pain Tender x 4.99 Elros, Corrupted Guard P-65/2.99 Thuusia, Pain Mage 6.49 Demon Warrior x 2 x 4.99 Dwarves - 421 points 8 models $44.92 Herryk Aesir, High Cleric 6.99 Ivar Silverfist 7.99 Kneebreaker x 2 x 4.99 Shieldmaiden x 2 x 4.99 Piercer x2 x 4.99 Elves - 416 points 8 models $40.42 Larnach the Grey 4.99 Caerwynn 4.99 Niriodel 4.99 Vale Archer x 5.49 Death Seeker x 2 x 4.99 Royal Guardsman x 2 x 4.99 Mercs - 410 points 8 models $40.92 Boris Mingla 5.99 Mika 6.99 Olivia P-65 2.99 Gars Necka 4.99 Okuran x 2 x 4.99 Blackreef Pirate x 2 x 4.99 Necropolis - 417 points Moandain, Arch-Lich 4.99 Tharian, Bloodmagus x 5.99 Ghast x 2 x4.99 Burrowing Zombies x 2 x 4.99 Skeletal Archer x 2 x 4.99 Necropolis - 415 points 8 models $47.92 Elsabeth Briarkiss 5.99 Naomi, Mistress of Wings 4.99 Crimson Knight x 2 x 5.49 Skeletal Archer x 2 x 4.99 Crypt Bat x 7.99 Bat Swarm 7.99 Nefsokar - 504 points 8 models $40.42 Khufu 4.99 Fatima 4.99 Netikerti 4.99 Daughter of Sekhmet x 2 x 4.99 Tomb Guard x 5.49 Khamsin Ranger x 2 x 4.99 Overlords - 412 points 8 models $42.92 Marquise Zora d'Arengo 4.99 Lola Darkslip, Assassin 6.99 Moraia, Warbride 4.99 Shadow Legionnaire 5.99 Overlord Crossbowman 4.99 Daughter of the Whip 2 x 4.99 Kevis, Vizier 4.99 Reptus - 406 points 8 models $46.92 Khong-To 9.99 Pakpao, Clutchling Caster 6.99 Ssudai, Nagendra Mystic 4,99 Reptus Skulbreaker x 2 x 4.99 Nagendra Ranger 4.99 Clutchling Archer X 2 x 4.99 Reven - 389 points 7 models $44.93 Troop 1 Kiakara, Queen of Khans, Bull Orc 4.99 Skralla the Black, Goblin 4.99 Ogre Warrior 8.99 Bull Orc Berserker x 2 x 6.99 Gnoll Archer P-65/6.99 Troop 2 Greka, Shaman 4.99 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gus Landt Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 The most difficult part will be making them all roughly the same MSRP. When ya'll are brainstorming suggestions, check the MSRP total of your suggestion and post that too. It would be very helpful to see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakandara Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 There is also the question of whether or not you can sell the same set to the same person multiple times. Include a Warlord, or a Unique Elite, and the set only has value to a player the first time. Target non-Unique Leaders and Elites, and you have a set that a person could want to purchase more than once. Further, I think that ~8 figures is going to be about the top end for most sets, and that probably means that they will run in the neighborhood of 350-400 points (use equipment to make a 400 point list if the goal is to have boxed sets that are reasonably comparable to one another). At average figures prices, that would be about $40 before any package "deal" Reaper might offer. That, plus a rulebook, and you can play the game for less than $60. Examples: Overlords - 360 points ($39.92) Merack of the Onyx Phalanx Moraia, Warbride Overlord Crossbowman x 3 Onyx Phalanx x 3 Crusaders - 372 points ($40.42) Ironraven, Templar Marcus Gideon, Undead Hunter Justicar x 3 Ivy Crown Archer x 3 Some factions are going to end up a little more expensive either because soldier models are invidually more expensive (in dollars) or less expensive (in points, therefore requiring 1 or two more models in the pack to hit that 350-400 mark). I don't know about the Crusader example, but I'd buy that O'lord box more than once if I were getting in to the game. ~v Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vejlin Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 The good thing about those $40 armies is that the player can easily upgrade it to 500 points by throwing in his/her favorite Solo and/or Elite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qwyksilver Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 (edited) Crusaders - 372 points ($40.42)Ironraven, Templar Marcus Gideon, Undead Hunter Justicar x 3 Ivy Crown Archer x 3 I probably wouldn'y buy too many of these boxes, just because the ICA are not horrible, but neither are they all that good. Not enough that I would want a whole lot of them. I think I own only about 6 total, and I had plans on building a 10K army at some point. ICA are more to keep an opponent honest, and have some semblance of a ranged threat. Not to actually go kill things A box that would likely see more repeat purchases for crusders should probably include some Ironspines or Knights because those are likely going to be a backbone of a lot of builds. And yes Vince, I will put one together Lord Ironraven - 66 (5.49) Finari - 59 (5.49) Justicar x3 - 141 (14.97) Ironspine x4 - 88 (19.96) Total Points: 354 Total Cost: 45.91 It costs a little more MSRP, and is a little lighter on points, but I also see it as something that would probably be purchased by a player more than once, particularly if it actually gets that 39.99 MSRP. It's a bummer Halbarad is now Unique, because he was always a nice combination of cost and points to flesh out the box. Edited October 23, 2009 by Qwyksilver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildger Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 I think that any starter set should only include a sergeant, an elite and some basic troops only. Archers are especially useful. There should be no unique. This way, people can build up their armies to whatever way they want. I started Warlord with the deluxe starter set and Necropolis set and I got stuck with Judas and Naomi since then. Instead of trying to aim at 500 points, I would suggest to go for 250 to 300 points. This way, for those players who are not decided, they can try it with the starter set and go from there. Getting rougly the same price is somewhat difficult. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinden Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Well i guess everyone has there own opinions about crusaders, Id want the box set because of the archers, but i wouldn't buy it because of the Justicars. I have had whole lists based on there archers and it did very well. There slightly cheaper than the elven archers but don't have indirect shot which I rarely see used. If you want a mixed melee/raged army i would do this: Army: (500 points) Troop 1 1 Ironraven, Templar (66) 4 Templar Ironspine (22) 4 Templar Knight (28) 1 Halbarad, Priest of Aurellius (U) (82) Troop 2 1 Acacia, Ivy Crown Ranger (32) 4 Ivy Crown Archer (30) If you want a melee only army id do this: Army: (499 points) Troop 1 1 Ironraven, Templar (66) 6 Templar Ironspine (22) Troop 2 1 Sir Malcom, Lightbringer (39) 1 Halbarad, Priest of Aurellius (U) (82) 5 Templar Knight (28) 2 Templar Unforgiven (20) Myself and several others including a new player i didn't say anything too really don't like the Justicars and don't ever use them. I would keep them out of the starting box set. (Just stating mine and others opinion, lets not take over this thread by arguing which is better) -Sin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Rodolfo Graziani Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 You actually make a really good point. The problem is not only building a box with a decent number of troops for a good cost but putting in figures new players will still use later. Everyone builds armies differently. The only guarantees are the use of a captain or average sergeant, basic troops, and maybe basic archers. That said, I like a number of box options suggested earlier. DRG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgtriplec Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 I don't think designing a box set from a veteran player perspective is correct. We need to look at it like we know nothing about the game and what about this set is going to make me want it. I've never looked at box sets as something I wanted several of, they are to introduce new players to the game, and to give them a jumping off point. Established players have no need for them, they know the game and lists and can buy the blisters they choose. There is no better value to buying box sets. So why design them around a multiple purchase concept? I got started from a dwarf box set, but used it to learn and build. I never considered a second set, even using the two unique figs as proxies, I went straight for a blister of halberds and a bear rider and Ivar. Also, most people want range and magic from the start, and having both in the sets will probably make them more attractive to new players. The game is called Warlord and many new players want a Warlord from the start. I just read a post from a new elf player asking for build help and his one perquisite was that it contain Danithal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildger Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 Some suggestions to consider: Necropolis Points Costs Sir Athak 68 4.99 Skeletal Archers x6 132 29.94 Gauntfield 49 5.99 Total = 8 figures 249 40.92 Crusader Sir Malcom 39 7.49 Ivy Crown Archers x6 180 29.94 Saramonde 28 4.99 Total = 8 figures 247 42.42 Dwarves Tohil 32 4.99 Klaus 46 5.49 Piercer x4 124 19.96 Pathfinder x2 46 9.98 Total = 8 figures 248 40.42 Elves Raynor 36 N/A Irith 53 4.99 Vale Archers x4 132 19.96 Faery x2 28 10.98 Total = 8 figures 249 N/A Mercenaries Mack Hardwick 43 4.99 Ado Salint 44 5.99 Crossbowman x6 162 29.94 Total = 8 figures 249 40.92 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakandara Posted October 23, 2009 Share Posted October 23, 2009 The re-buyability is not a player thing, it is a Reaper profit thing. Boxed sets are more expensive to make than blisters. Making sets both a good starting point *and* worth buying more than once is good not only for players, but for Reaper too. Sets that include Warlords and other Unique models squash that, whereas ones with non-unique leaders, elites, and common soldiers can be used not only as a starter to get someone in, but also as a re-buy later when they want to bulk up their army with more of those models. A quick look through my own armies is fairly proof postive of this: Overlords: 2 copies of Andras, 2 of Merack, 4 of Corvus, 2 of Moraia, 2 Ymrilix, 15 O'lord Warriors, 12 O'lord Spearmen, 6 O'lord X-bows Retpus: 2 copies of Chai-uut, 3 of Audt, 2 of Chhaya, 2 of Ra'am, 2 of T'Kay, 12 Reptus Warriors, 12 Skullbreakers, 6 Archers, 8 Spikeshells Darkspawn: 2 copies of Javolith, 3 of Vysa, 2 of Thuusia, 2 of Nasithe, 12 Isiri Warrior, 6 Isiri Archers, 9 Paintenders, 6 Demon Warriors And it goes on... There is nothing wrong with a boxed set that is open to repeat purchase and also serves as a good intro to the game. Why ignore one when you can have both (expecially from Reaper's perspective). ~v Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harbinger Posted October 25, 2009 Share Posted October 25, 2009 I think Shakandara has some very good points. Id like to add that personally the chances for me buying a boxed set goes down as price goes up. Its not a matter of willingness to shell out cash its just that you get over $40ish Im not going buy it unless has exactly the minis Im after; Id rather take $60 and get the exact ones on my want list. maybe think along these lines... if you was going to demo that warband to a new player what size and what minis would you use (without using uniques or warlords.) I think if met those requirements, it would be helpful for a new player buying their first warband. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgtriplec Posted October 25, 2009 Share Posted October 25, 2009 I think Shakandara has some very good points. Id like to add that personally the chances for me buying a boxed set goes down as price goes up. Its not a matter of willingness to shell out cash its just that you get over $40ish Im not going buy it unless has exactly the minis Im after; Id rather take $60 and get the exact ones on my want list. maybe think along these lines... if you was going to demo that warband to a new player what size and what minis would you use (without using uniques or warlords.) I think if met those requirements, it would be helpful for a new player buying their first warband. You bring up a good point, why would you buy a box when you can order exactly what you want? There is no need to. I may be way out in left field, I have been before but this is my thinking... Selling sets is a marketing thing, its not about selling models. Its more about game introduction, which is why the old sets had quick start rules and dice. People looking for a new game gravitate to sets and not blisters. The same is true in CCGs, Starter Packs draw new players and packs build your deck. The old sets sold well enough, and were not retired due to bad sales, but because the changes in data cards made them unbalanced... Dwarfs and Reven were killers while skeletons and Mercs stunk. Reaper did not design those sets for multi-purchase, but for introduction. IMO a set with a Warlord and a couple elite(even uniques) is more appealing to a new player than a sergeant and a bunch of soldiers. Certain things will make make a game look cool before you even know the rules, one of those things is characters with names and ranks. I think its as simple as what people remember from a demo. They don't remember that Merack and the Phalanx were their core they remember Moria kicked butt and Ashkrypt rained hell from the sky, and that they they are sure to get Selwyn and Caerewyn and won't remember what their Royal guards were even called. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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