Classic Dungeon Adventurers Miniature Set - Chibi Style

[TheAuldGrump]

Pretty much - and as it can be shown to not be a frivolous case it is unlikely that the defendant could recoup legal expenses from the plaintiff.

 

So, if the funds spent on defense would be greater than the monies made selling the miniatures it is easier to lout the knee. To drop the offending miniatures rather than defend them - even if it is almost certain that the defense would win.

 

And the companies that WotC is targeting are the ones that cannot afford to mount a defense - it is not a matter of being small enough to fly under the radar, but of being small enough that they can be taken down easily. Being small is not a good thing.

 

TSR used to use much the same tactics - and ended up settling out of court and paying off the defendants when it was taken to court - they could not afford to lose in court as that would open them up further. Making it easier for the next company to 'infringe'.

 

The Auld Grump

[Caffiene]

And they have gone to court and won.

 

As far as Im aware, though, they dont win on the basis of just parody. They win for other reasons, such as the fact that pretty much nobody in their right mind believes the adult movie is officially licensed, that people rarely buy or consider the movie based on what it is spoofing (they are buying based on the adult content), and that they operate in different markets (DC & Marvel obviously have no intent to ever attempt an official adult product based on their IP).

 

Whereas in this case people buy the minis specifically because of them looking like iconic D&D creatures/characters, WotC/Hasbro obviously do create very similar products in the exact same market, and somebody coming across the minis for sale could easily mistake them for being officially licensed.

 

The other thing, of course, is that we know these things were successfully defensible because they got taken to court. Its the opposite of showing that these things dont need legal action against them - they are a demonstration that they do need legal action against them even when they are defensible.

[Frankthedm]

(DC & Marvel obviously have no intent to ever attempt an official adult product based on their IP)

So I take it you have not heard of the rooftop sex scene in the recent Catwoman #1?

[Nocturne]

Or this classic annual offering from Marvel (NSFW)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marvel_Illustrated_Swimsuit

[ApesAmongUs]

And they have gone to court and won.

 

As far as Im aware, though, they dont win on the basis of just parody.

But that's the point. Whyever they won, it shows that all the people saying (in essence) that the works were too similar are at least partially wrong. You can be functionally identical and still be protected. "Make their heads big and cutsie" starts looking like a pretty substantial change once you have accepted that you can copy names and costumes and plot points and the occasional exact line of dialog without violating anything.

 

The other thing, of course, is that we know these things were successfully defensible because they got taken to court. Its the opposite of showing that these things dont need legal action against them - they are a demonstration that they do need legal action against them even when they are defensible.

I cannot make my brain follow the logic of that. "They won, so it is good that they were sued"? I can't imagine how that set-up benefits anyone apart from lawyers.

[impactminiatures]

As a footnote to the discussion. We talked to our IP lawyer before we started the project on what he felt we could and could not do. We stayed away from items that his research told us were clearly defined as still protected and not open to OGL. We had a ton of backers ask us to do beholders and we said no over and over again becaue it was on the lawyer's list. Similar to the Reaper comments on the T&E KS thread ... we wanted to do parody figures that were dervitive in nature. Something we saw Reaper do with several figures on the Bones KickStarter and other projects were included in our research. Despite doing our homework and paying for legal IP consul ... we got this letter 3 weeks after the KS ended. Our IP lawyer said ... I think you can fight and win ... but in doing so ... you'll spend all the money to make the figures and these 8 are only 15% of the total figures planned to offer as part of the KickStater. So it would be a hollow victory ... we'd stand a good chance to win but then no figures would be produced. So we did the right thing we could for the backers. We came up with alternate figures to replace the 8 mostly based on what was requested in the comments during the project and we honestly offered full or partial refunds to anyone who wanted out which we've granted to the 5 backers that requested them.

 

However ... since then we've added new extra figures offering. Added accessories weapons for free onto existing figures and added a free figure to all our high level backer rewards. Some of these plans are new ... most were already in motion before the letter. So plans continue on and for us it is full steam ahead. We tried to follow all the rules and industry standards from day one ... WotC disagreed ... we decided it was better to agree to their request and move on so we could design the other 85% of the figures and extras we have in the works and make sure all the backers get their rewards fully and on time.

[Pingo]

It's a difficult position for any company to be in, and the balance between what's right and what's affordable is not always just.

[manyik]

sorry for the thread necromancy but has anyone actually received any minis from these guys yet. I only ask because the contact from them has been regualr but I just realized I have not seen a selection option to choose my minis from them...and its Feb so.

 

Edited for Spelling

Edited February 5, 2013 by manyik

[Qwyksilver]

They have not shipped out or done the survey for any backers yet.

The only thing that was shipped out was a purchase early Hydra for KS backers only from one of the mid-50 updates.

 

IIRC, surveys will be out in March. They will miss their February 2013 deadline, and have acknowledged it. In fact some of the sculpts will not be received until the first week of March.

[Jubilee]

Did anyone else back this project and receive their product? I got mine in the mail today and am surprised at the total lack of QC. Am I alone?

 

Ali

[Berik]

I backed it, but I haven't received anything yet as I'm getting one of each Type 2 with my pledge and apparently that isn't ready yet. What sort of problems are you having?

[Jubilee]

The casting is horrendous, the bubbling is outrageous, there are striations on the models from what I assume is poorly-cleaned digital prints.. I have been told if I don't like it, I should consider what it takes to clean a GW finecast model (which are more expensive) and that I can ship them back for a refund, because if I don't like what I have, I won't like anything else he can send.....

 

http://goldengooseminiatures.com/2013/07/20/chibi-dungeons-and-dragons-by-impact/

 

I have posted pictures on my blog (you will want to expand the pictures to truly see the horror). I particularly point your attention to the fingerprint on the large wing, the almost total lack of tusks on the boar, the striations on the boar's eye, the EXTREME mold line/mold shift on the centaur's head, and the utter incomprehensible horror that is the head and body of the water mage (I have no idea what's going on with the back of her head).

[kimbers]

The casting is horrendous, the bubbling is outrageous, there are striations on the models from what I assume is poorly-cleaned digital prints.. I have been told if I don't like it, I should consider what it takes to clean a GW finecast model (which are more expensive) and that I can ship them back for a refund, because if I don't like what I have, I won't like anything else he can send.....

 

http://goldengooseminiatures.com/2013/07/20/chibi-dungeons-and-dragons-by-impact/

 

I have posted pictures on my blog (you will want to expand the pictures to truly see the horror). I particularly point your attention to the fingerprint on the large wing, the almost total lack of tusks on the boar, the striations on the boar's eye, the EXTREME mold line/mold shift on the centaur's head, and the utter incomprehensible horror that is the head and body of the water mage (I have no idea what's going on with the back of her head).

She has no head! Oh, wait... haha, there it is. Those are pretty nasty looking. And to justify the bad quality of a miniature by comparing it to a more expensive bad quality miniature is bad form. If they think those are acceptable quality, then I'm glad I skipped this one...

 

Lets hope that yours were a freak anomaly for the sake of everyone else.

Edited July 20, 2013 by kimbers

[Goblyn]

wow nasty minis,

 

[Beagle]

Aren't these troll forged?