Jump to content

Your problems with kickstarter?


Shogun
 Share

Recommended Posts

Chibi Addendum: Looking over the other ones they were challenged on, I think they might have been able to mount a case for those. They would have definitely lost on Soth, and I think Soth opened the door to the other challenges and made a case harder. Without Soth in the picture, regardless of how valid WotC's claim appears, I think it might have gone either way if hashed out in court.

 

I'm happy to agree to disagree on the matter. To me, the scariest thing on the face of Krynn done up in Chibi style is hilarious and humour is well-recognized as parody.

Either way, I wish people would push back against copyright maximalists; if they don't we'll lose protections like fair use to say nothing of the public domain. :down:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 196
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

So far, every KS I've backed save two have been late - but usually only by a couple of months. The first of the two that hasn't been late is the Reaper one, and we all know where they stand.

 

The other one was supporting a local high school's film class entries to a local film competition. Fulfillment was tickets to the film showings. Basically, the students either had their films finished on time and got a grade, or they didn't. The backers got their tickets regardless of how many of the students completed. I gave my tickets to charity, so I was out nothing anyway.

 

The first two that were late bothered me, but they eventually pulled through, and both had good communications. Right now the one I'm frustrated with is one called Mobile Frame Zero - I knew his promised release of June 2012 was too ambitious, but the book hasn't even gone to print yet. We just got the PDF earlier this month, but I haven't had time to read it yet.

 

Based on my first few forays with KS, I'm much more selective of the KS projects I back now. FREX, even though I'm a big Traveller fan, based on the history of T5s delays well before the KS project, I have serious reservations on Marc's abilities to deliver it in the KS time frame, so I passed on it.

 

My biggest frustration with KS now is that there are a large, large number of gaming projects on there. This doesn't really surprise me, as just about every gamer I know has a game or two they'd like to bring to print. But so many of them are jumping on the KS bandwagon that I feel it's becoming saturated, giving it the feel of a gamers flea market.

 

I know some of these projects are going to be good, but they're hard to sort out who can really follow through and who can't. Which means I've backed off on supporting any at all now.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm not going to detail all of my backed projects (currently at 164), but here are some comments on some good, some bad:

 

Glory to Rome Black Box Edition: Terribly run campaign. They had been advertising that they'd have it done by Essen 2011 (that's mid- to late-September). Didn't start shipping until mid-2012. Shipped to retailers over a month before shipping to backers and had decided to do shipping from multiple places around the world. To give an idea of how badly the shipping was done, an Australian retailer had not only got the game in stock, but sold out and restocked before Australian backer copies left China by boat.

 

Cookie Connections cookie cutters: Originally due to be shipped in time for Halloween 2011, the last official communication from the creator was 11 months ago stating that he was starting to ship.

 

Scotlings team: They must have already had the greens in hand for these minis - I received them less than a month after the project ended.

 

Levitatr keyboard: A great example of how not to run a campaign. After having been stringing us along for a year, the creator finally admitted that the goal was well below the amount he needed to actually create the product. He was assuming that if he had some people pre-ordering it he'd be able to get investors to front the rest of the money. This is information that should have been presented before anyone handed over money.

 

Wood Ties: Although this project failed to reach its goal, the creators were happy to let their backers buy the product at the Kickstarter price. This included working with me to allow me to buy them even though their webstore is set up only for US customers. Very happy.

 

Order of the Stick: Nothing new to add to what others have said - delays were perfectly understandable given his injury and great communication.

 

Artisan Dice: A little disappointed in the length of the delay, but he's making over 100x the number of dice he'd planned for (original goal would have been around 50 dice, my estimation of number of dice was around 6000) by hand. And looks like he's close to finishing fulfilment.

 

Pebble smartwatch: Delays are understandable (once we finally got told about the reasons well after the fact), but the communication has been terrible. During December they were unwilling to even state that they would be unable to ship last year. I found out about a contest they were running when they announced the winner. SDK that was supposed to be available before watches were shipped (which was due in September) is still nowhere to be seen, with shipping due to start this week.

 

Zombicide/Sedition Wars: Nice minis in Zombicide (still waiting on SW), but the way CMoN has "communicated" has put me off backing anything they run. They're completely unwilling to apologise for anything, they broke their promise of "backers will get their copies first", they still haven't made any announcement (that I'm aware of at least) about what's happening with Marvin and Eva, they made an update on SW that strongly implied that they wouldn't be replacing damaged or bad components, then another saying they didn't know where people got that idea.

 

Dwarven Adventurers: A little behind schedule, but not much. Overall very happy with them, even though I don't really have a use for them, and am backing the gnomes with even less possible use for them than the dwarves.

 

Bones: My biggest disappointment with this was the backflipping on split shipment for internationals and, even more than the backflip, the fact that it wasn't properly announced until well after I'd filled in the RPM (not noticing the bit in there about it).

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've backed three projects so far, with nothing to show for it yet. Each of the projects still seems to be on schedule, but I'm hesitant to back other projects until something starts coming out of the queue and I start getting evidence that KS isn't a collasal mistake. The Reaper Bones project I'm pretty confident about, likewise Larry Elmore's book. I've backed one of the assorted Catan board projects which I expect will slip their deliverable dates. I too passed on Traveller 5. My reasons were partially Traveller 4 was a dog and Mongoose Traveller isn't really that awesome to me. I'll look at it if it reaches store though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think that excitement for Kickstarter (and crowdfunding in general) will wane as more and more projects don't deliver or deliver very late. Seems like most people who start projects are very optimistic about their schedules and underestimate costs (particularly if they are wildly successful).

 

I expect that most project sponsors discount the possibility that a project will never be delivered or delivered very late.

 

I've backed a few projects, and, so far, only one has delivered even remotely on time (partially).

 

With regards to Traveller 5, Marc hasn't even come close to hitting any of his previous projected delivery dates for T5, so I passed as well. I've long had a soft spot for Traveller, and I ran a successful T20 campaign on Yahoo Group for several years. But, I still passed on T5.

 

Ron

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My rundown of mini kickstarters:

.

Finished

.

Reaper Bones: All seems OK, being an international though I've received nothing as yet but I've no concerns.

.

Relic Knights: Went quiet after Christmas but the updates on sculpts have started again. Looks like it's still on target for May. I am glad that I pledged judt for figures I'd seen and added the rest through the pledge manager for the ones that had gone from concept to digital sculpt, a couple like the Penny Arcade figures I lost interest in.

.

Bombshell Babes: Estimated Jan and a few look like they'll be shipping next week but most will be Feb, barely a delay at all.

.

28mm Demons & Devils: Looks to be on schedule but I'm not sure yet if I'd back another of their Kickstarters. The whole Resin/Metal issue wasn't handled very well and I'm still not 100% convinced what comes through the door is going to be great quality. This was one of the first I'd back, in future I'd be more wary over backing a project that leaves off the shipping until the end (still don't know how much it'll be).

.

Medievil Villaage for 28mm gamers: Excellent communication, estimated delivery was this month, looks like shipping is starting soon and into Feb.

.

Assimilation Alien Host: Decent communication, I like that he's leaving off the pledge manager until most, if not all, the sculpts are ready to show. Expected May, looks to be ok for that at the moment.

.

Creature Cards: Sparse updates since it's finished but expected delivery is March and the cards went to the printers a fortnight ago so nothing that's really converning.

.

Kingdom Death: All quiet since it's ended but I'm not sure the cash will have even been transferred over yet. Comments on the last update became toxic, not bothered looking back in other than checking if Adam has made any comments. I'm expecting this will fall back a couple of months at least as it clearly went beyond what he was expecting.

.

Imbrian Arts: decent communicaiton since it's finished, looks to be moving ok.

.

In progress

.

12 Realms: A few days left, I feel more confident on this one now the first couple of actual figures have been seen instead of ust the digital sculpts.

.

Beyond the Gates of Antares: A month left but I'm almost certain to drop the one. Very very uncertain about a wargame which has still only shown one figure being sculpted.

.

Rivet Wars: Had to stop keeping up with the comments. Occassionally look in, lose faith in humaanity, leave. Will keep pledge as it is and just use CMON's pledge manager after the fact, can't even bring myself to load the page.

.

Bug Hunt Corridors: Had to revise my pledge down to level, mostly I'm ust not going to use everything that's in a Level 2 plus the oddity that buying two Level 1's is better than 1 Level 2. Really liking the designs though.

.

Gnomish Adventurers: Too soon for their to be any concerns.

.

Agnostic Giraffe Miniatures: I was a little undertain about them not showing any Familiars a first despite having a pledge level for them but now there are several concepts in they are looking good. I'm being wary though as it seemed to mentione a second level of familars if it goes beyond 15-20. That sounds like the Familiar level may not aontain all of the stretch goal familiars like it claims depending on number. Will have to wait and see.

Edited by Nocturne
Link to comment
Share on other sites

OGRE by SJ Games, which was due out late last year, is well behind schedule. Communication hasn't been all that great (though they have recently improved), but I have faith that they will deliver a quality product and it looks like its on schedule to be 6 months or so behind schedule.

 

Red Box games, again behind schedule. However he communicates when he needs to and is taking steps to ship out what he has now while they work out some of the kinks on some of the other molds. Again, someone I have faith in to complete the project, though I'll be hesitant to back him again until I get his product.

 

Tenra Basho Zero is a Japanese flavored RPG. My big concern with this is that I'm not sure what exactly I signed up for. I did get PDFs of the beta, but I'm not sure if I should be expecting the final versions.

 

I did also back a local musical group who delivered their CD on time and a friend of mine who's project sadly did not get enough money.

 

Red Box games and Ogre I think are victims of their own success. I can be more paitent with people in that category, but I am still anxious to receive my stuff.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Traveller5 is at the printers right now and is due to be finished within the next 7 days so shipping at the beginning of February (Books are scheduled to be finished on 2/1). I'm not sure how the rest of the rewards are going though (they have been ordered) and if one of those items will cause a dealy. Right now he is only 3 months behind and the book has grown to a whopping 656 pages. So no worse than most kickstarters at this point. I know that the dice have arrived, so I guess I'll find out soon if it will be a longer delay or not.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've backed Bones, Judge Dredd and Combat Kitchenware.

Bones is obviously proceeding at a pace; I have no concerns about everything being sent on schedule, but I'm a bit anxious about how long international shipping might take on such a large package.

Judge Dredd has been pretty good so far; they've had a few delays with sculpts for various reasons that have been fully explained, and where those hold-ups have occurred, they're focusing their efforts on other figures to get out. Plus they're shipping everything as soon as it's ready, so I've already recieved a couple of packages from them with new minis.

The Combat Kitchenware is a bit slow, on the other hand. It was quite a long time after the end of the kickstarter that I heard anything from them, and despite their promise of weekly updates, I've not heard anything in a couple of weeks.

I think the main thing to take away from this is the importance of communication in this sort of endeavour. It would seem that most backers can live with justifiable delays, so long as these things are communicated to them.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think the main thing to take away from this is the importance of communication in this sort of endeavour. It would seem that most backers can live with justifiable delays, so long as these things are communicated to them.

+1

 

Stuff happens, both in business and real life. So long as proper and regular communication continues I can stomach most any delay. Sometimes even something as simple as an occasional: "We don't have anything new to report, but it's been a couple weeks and we just wanted to let you know we haven't forgotten about you. Thank you for your support and continued patience."

 

At the same time, please don't spam the hell out of me. I don't need updates every couple days post funding. And especially don't use the KS that I am currently waiting 3 months past estimated delivery date to pimp your new Kickstarter, unless it's for something you are not going to start until AFTER you have completed your obligations to the existing KS.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Kickstarter is causing me no end of "problems".... I keep finding awesome miniatures, beautiful art books, interesting food items, labor-saving game enhancers, and amazing board games I'd otherwise never see or try. It's completely changed and radically improved my gaming hobby -- to the point where I'm actually excited to dig through their website and see what other forum members find and post here. Some are letdowns. Some I can't get into. Some I would never use. Some become too expensive and I have to drop out. Some I want to succeed so well I hate to see the final seconds ticking by, knowing the wild ride is over and the waiting process begins.

 

I don't care if things take longer than expected, provided the project creators keep the backers updated on what's happening. I want the projects I back to be of the highest possible quality, and that takes extra time. Okay, I'm fine with that. I can ignore the project zealots who must protect their chosen "thing" with the vehemence of an obsessed gamer--yes, even when they are actively trolling. It's annoying, but all part of the show. We all take turns tripping down that aisle from time-to-time, and, ultimately, why worry about it? It's a string of 0's and 1's on a server, and will quickly be forgotten by the allure of the next "shiny" needing your or my backing.

 

We, all of us, get wrapped up in the projects we love, try to politely vilify the projects we hate, and passively explore the projects that are incredibly interesting but lack the planning necessary to succeed. It's become yet another way for us to expand our love of gaming, be it with miniatures or board games or decks of cards, etc.... To that end, we all win! Yay! Game on!

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

As someone that has run a couple KickStarters, I'll put this out there for you: how do you estimate a date of release based on something that grows?

 

When you make the KS campaign you're told to put in a date that you can deliver on. Assuming you make your first goal and add on any kind of stretch goal, you're now going to go over your (probably) generous estimate on delivery. If you rush it, you're likely to make mistakes or make something sub par.

 

I've backed Zombicide, they did very well on delivery, but they must have been practically done in order for us to get that so fast. Shipping from China takes 30 days minimum, then there's customs and freighting it from customs to your warehouse.

 

I've also backed Reaper Bones and Larry Elmore. I too have found many projects that I really have to stop myself from backing so that I can try bringing new minis to the market. ;)

 

I've backed out of those campaigns that I felt were crossing the line or might've been sketchy.

Edited by greyhaze
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...