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Great Canadian Mass Shipment Bones Race


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Well, it's been almost a month since the last update and two since people (read: 'Mericans) started receiving their packages.

 

:(

 

I know they're waiting on someone else to rubber stamp a form and it's (almost) as painful for them as for us but... irksome.

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Well, it's been almost a month since the last update and two since people (read: 'Mericans) started receiving their packages.

 

:(

 

I know they're waiting on someone else to rubber stamp a form and it's (almost) as painful for them as for us but... irksome.

 

Sadly I have to agree. Reaper is really dropping the ball with communication considering how late they are running with the anticipated shipments. Weekly or bi-weekly status communications would be ideal. I know a lot of people here are going to 'white knight' for Reaper, but sadly the truth is that they are doing a terrible job at keeping their backers informed. I know, I know - kickstarters can be delayed - it's the nature of the beast. The delay isn't the issue - it's the poor communication.

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Well updates 91 & 92 say it all really

 

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1513061270/reaper-miniatures-bones-an-evolution-of-gaming-min/posts

 

when stuff arrives and they can resume shipping (or when the Canadian government give them their permit so they can start it for you guys) they'll let us know

 

there's not a lot else they can say

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If you consider this "white knighting" for Reaper then so be it; I'm ok with that.

If there is no new information then no update is necessary. Reaper has been good about passing along new information as it becomes available. No new update means that the information in the latest update remains valid. I for one don't need constant reassurance every week or so to the effect of "yup… nothing's changed yet".

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We're not "white knighting" for anybody. We've got all the info there is to get, as posted by Orlando. When something new & exciting happens, we'll get new & exciting information.

 

And I don't much like how you loaded your comment with that term. Everybody here is champing at the bit to get their Bones. Everybody. And I ordered everything and I'm in Canada so god only knows when I'll get mine. But, anxious or not, most people (including yours truly) are still doing their best to collate, disseminate, and explain all information we get from any source and simultaneously urging people (and ourselves) to be patient. Because what else can you do? You can complain, if you want to waste the energy, but container ships from China don't run on complaints so it won't speed up the process. Plus we know customs is The Big Unknown, and there's no way to predict that. We saw that with the Bones shipment before Christmas, where it was released weeks after Reaper was told "any day now".

 

The goal here is to provide as much factual information as concisely as possible while trying to maintain as positive an attitude as we can about things. That helps us, that helps Reaper.

 

Loading comments by suggesting any attempt at the above is "white knighting" and thus easily dismissed is, frankly, extraordinarily insulting. This isn't 4chan.

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Loading comments by suggesting any attempt at the above is "white knighting" and thus easily dismissed is, frankly, extraordinarily insulting. This isn't 4chan.

 

No loading was intended, but there are a clear number of supporters who are not satisfied by the communication put forth by Reaper.

 

One has to read these forums, look for facebook updates, and read the kickstarter comments in order to get a clear picture of where things are.

 

There was a notice on facebook about the Canadian shipping status long before the 'official' backer update; so unless you were digging for the info, you didn't know what was going on.

 

Please consider those of us who are new to Reaper and were introduced by this kickstarter... most don't post on these forums or their facebook page - the only source of information is via Kickstarter updates.

 

If you look at the comments page on the kickstarter you will see a large contingent of people who are echoing the same sentiment - Reaper is lacking in the communcation department; and there is another large contingent which counters with back with 'it's fine, it's the nature of kickstarter, etc etc'. That attitude causes problems because it often implies 'you have no right to be unsatisfied', and what I consider white knighting.

 

See: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1513061270/reaper-miniatures-bones-an-evolution-of-gaming-min/comments

 

Notice how many people there feel like they are in the dark?

 

Again, I want to stress I'm not complaining about the amount of time - just communication.

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aud604:

 

Obviously, I fall into the group that doesn't mind not hearing about the project unless there's something new and you seem (to me at least) to fall into the group that would rather have more updates more often. I think it would be beneficial to everyone if we tried to better understand each other's perspective. Therefore instead of waiting for this to degenerate into an argument I will ask you to simply help me understand your point of view better.

If you're game, I have the following questions based on your posts above:

  1. If there is no new information to convey to backers do you feel that there should be updates to effect of "nothing new to report, carry on"
  2. If yes to #1, how often should those updates go out?
  3. How much effort should backers be expected to put into finding information for themselves? ie: should they only have to check their email? The project's Kickstarter page? Here on the forums? Facebook? Twitter? Etc.
  4. Knowing that there are people at both ends of the spectrum of how much information they want, what do you feel is the best way to strike a balance between too much, too often and too little, too infrequently.

Cheers,

Dan

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Well, it's been almost a month since the last update and two since people (read: 'Mericans) started receiving their packages.

 

:(

 

I know they're waiting on someone else to rubber stamp a form and it's (almost) as painful for them as for us but... irksome.

 

Sadly I have to agree. Reaper is really dropping the ball with communication considering how late they are running with the anticipated shipments. Weekly or bi-weekly status communications would be ideal. I know a lot of people here are going to 'white knight' for Reaper, but sadly the truth is that they are doing a terrible job at keeping their backers informed. I know, I know - kickstarters can be delayed - it's the nature of the beast. The delay isn't the issue - it's the poor communication.

I wouldn't say "dropping the ball" and we certainly don't need weekly or even bi-weekly comments of "nope, no news." But a monthly status check would be nice, which is why I bumped the thread.

 

They likely think about this every day. Every damn day. They can't not think about it. Us? If I think about it twice a week I'm obsessing.

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If you're game, I have the following questions based on your posts above:

  1. If there is no new information to convey to backers do you feel that there should be updates to effect of "nothing new to report, carry on"
  2. If yes to #1, how often should those updates go out?
  3. How much effort should backers be expected to put into finding information for themselves? ie: should they only have to check their email? The project's Kickstarter page? Here on the forums? Facebook? Twitter? Etc.
  4. Knowing that there are people at both ends of the spectrum of how much information they want, what do you feel is the best way to strike a balance between too much, too often and too little, too infrequently.

Cheers,

Dan

 

Hi Dan,

 

Before I answer your questions I'd like to point out a few things. The first Kickstarter update that indicate there was any trouble went out May 6th - long before this point Reaper must have known that there were issues (about Canadian customs and about their lack of inventory / slow boat from China). There were little blips here and there (if you were looking at FB/Forums) about what was going on, but not via the official channel of information (Kickstarter updates). It's not just the current situation that people are frustrated about, it's been about communication throughout the whole cycle. I know a few people were also irked when Reapercon occurred and communcation went dark for a few weeks, which was supposed to be the original shipment window.

 

Now, to answer your questions:

 

1&2 - Twice a month feels fair. Just to let us know things are on track or not, or let us know about any hiccups. Even just to say hello to everyone and thank them for our patience.

3 - Backers shouldn't have to dig through forums/facebook/the Kickstarter comment thread in order to find out the status of the Kickstarter. This is my main point and where I feel communication has failed the most.

4 - Deleting an email update from Reaper is simple enough if someone doesn't want the info. I can't see too many people saying 'hey, this company I gave XXX dollars to last year is updating me on the status of my stuff - how annoying!'

 

I'm sorry my comments have rubbed anyone the wrong way, I'm excited as everyone else to get my mini's, I just really feel that there is room for improvement. If you read through the Kickstarter comments you will see that I'm not alone. The good news is that not too many people are put off about the delay - they are just put off at the lack of communication.

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Not all of us are fully satisfied with the status of things, and I don't think most people are ready to jump down anybody's throat for not being satisfied. My problem with the "white knight" comment is that using that term instantly converts the discussion into an adversial "me vs. them" argument. It changes it to "Here's what I think, I expect a fight, if you disagree you are (label)" which doesn't do any of us any good, just lights a fuse.

 

You didn't mean it, fine, all is forgiven. We're all in the same boat here, after all. Which should be somewhere in the Pacific now, heading east.

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If you're game, I have the following questions based on your posts above:

  1. If there is no new information to convey to backers do you feel that there should be updates to effect of "nothing new to report, carry on"
  2. If yes to #1, how often should those updates go out?
  3. How much effort should backers be expected to put into finding information for themselves? ie: should they only have to check their email? The project's Kickstarter page? Here on the forums? Facebook? Twitter? Etc.
  4. Knowing that there are people at both ends of the spectrum of how much information they want, what do you feel is the best way to strike a balance between too much, too often and too little, too infrequently.

Cheers,

Dan

 

Hi Dan,

 

Before I answer your questions I'd like to point out a few things. The first Kickstarter update that indicate there was any trouble went out May 6th - long before this point Reaper must have known that there were issues (about Canadian customs and about their lack of inventory / slow boat from China). There were little blips here and there (if you were looking at FB/Forums) about what was going on, but not via the official channel of information (Kickstarter updates). It's not just the current situation that people are frustrated about, it's been about communication throughout the whole cycle. I know a few people were also irked when Reapercon occurred and communcation went dark for a few weeks, which was supposed to be the original shipment window.

 

Now, to answer your questions:

 

1&2 - Twice a month feels fair. Just to let us know things are on track or not, or let us know about any hiccups. Even just to say hello to everyone and thank them for our patience.

3 - Backers shouldn't have to dig through forums/facebook/the Kickstarter comment thread in order to find out the status of the Kickstarter. This is my main point and where I feel communication has failed the most.

4 - Deleting an email update from Reaper is simple enough if someone doesn't want the info. I can't see too many people saying 'hey, this company I gave XXX dollars to last year is updating me on the status of my stuff - how annoying!'

 

I'm sorry my comments have rubbed anyone the wrong way, I'm excited as everyone else to get my mini's, I just really feel that there is room for improvement. If you read through the Kickstarter comments you will see that I'm not alone. The good news is that not too many people are put off about the delay - they are just put off at the lack of communication.

 

Reaper did let Canadians know at the end of March that there was an issue with how they had planned Canadian fulfillment, and that they had basically found out at the last minute about a better-in-the-long-run method of shipping to Canada. We knew there would be an extra delay getting items here. It wasn't in a kickstarter update originally, but it was posted first to facebook, then in a kickstarter comment from Reaper and finally here in the Reaper forums before the official update on May 6th.

 

They also let people know well ahead of time that they were stopping for Reapercon, and while people might have been irked, the con was on the calendar from the year before, a whole different group of people would have been irked and more if the con had been cancelled. Especially those that had planned and booked vacations around attending. I think it was likely the Reapercon stoppage that compounded some other problems, as it gave the folks at Reaper a couple weeks leeway before they had to explain any delays, something I expect in hindsight they wish they had done sooner.

 

All that said, I agree with the bulk of your comments. A couple times a month is a very reasonable time frame for updates, even if it is just to say everything is on (or behind) schedule, even if it is of the "Nothing has changed, we are still waiting on customs, sorry for the delay." variety. And important info like the Canadian import changes should be in an official update.

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Drops in a comment from Reaper on the KS comments

 

"Creator Reaper Miniatures about 14 hours ago

 

We continue to expect the last two shipments in the next 14-20 days. Nothing significant has changed since the last update - we will resume shipping once more material is in, and will post an update when we do so.

 

We understand that this is later than everyone (including us) had expected, and recognize that people are growing impatient. We are doing everything in our power to make fulfillment happen as fast as we are able, and hope that everyone will understand. We know that there were mistakes made, and unplanned events that caused delays, and are truly sorry that these delays have interrupted the process."

 

so we have a little more info, but sadly it's still the same story, no change from the last official update

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Reaper did let Canadians know at the end of March that there was an issue with how they had planned Canadian fulfillment, and that they had basically found out at the last minute about a better-in-the-long-run method of shipping to Canada. We knew there would be an extra delay getting items here. It wasn't in a kickstarter update originally, but it was posted first to facebook, then in a kickstarter comment from Reaper and finally here in the Reaper forums before the official update on May 6th.

 

I'll have to disagree with this statement - as far as I'm concerned they didn't let Canadians know about the delay until the Kickstarter update went out. They might have put the information out there through other channels, but the only official way to inform your backers is through the update system.

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Not everyone that gave money to Reaper has access to those backer updates, as some sent the money directly to Reaper, these people may be following facebook for their info.

 

Still, I agree with everything buglips has said in his last few comments here. Throwing a title over something like that just causes negativity, and those of us who are attempting to remain positive, even in a not so optimal situation, are just being called down because of it.

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