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*sigh* Guess it is may then...


zedin
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Ok, I've been on the boards quite a bit and I had no idea that Kaladrax would need a 14" base. o.O

 

I thought Nethyermaul was supposed to be bigger?

I'd thought so too, but apparently not. I'd say they must be close in size though. Nethyrmaul must be a taller sculpt, just based on how they are positioned, but I guess Big K is bigger over all (must be the tail ;) )

I'd love to see a picture of Martin's painted ones side by side for comparison, preferably with Sir Forscale caught between them.

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I don't really see much worth in discussing the matter. Either you understand that Kickstarters are to fund something that's not into production and the more successful they become the longer it takes to fulfill or you don't. People that are still upset that everything didn't go out last month think it's the same as a pre-order of something that production has already started on and refuse to separate the two concepts.

 

Now whether or not Reaper should have delayed or canceled Reaper con is a valid argument as I'm sort of in the camp that Reaper should have delayed the convention back in September once they knew the true scale of this but I also don't buy convention tickets or plane tickets a year in advance as some people do and I know Reaper didn't want to burn those people. Hopefully next time Reaper does something at this scale, if they ever do, there will be better planning based off the information learned from this endeavor.

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Mistwalker, thank you for your response. I believe my response to Jasper shows I missed some of the posts/reports. So I was missing some info, and I I believe led to my sense of fustration. My tone was not meant to be hostile but I can see where it can be seen as such. I'm more disappointed. It does indeed suck that people who have paid may have to wait until May.

My reason for saying don't flame me comes from many people assuming I don't know/understand how shipping product works. Not don't flame me b/c you can not change my mind. The company I worked for was decent-sized. A huge influx of orders would cause delay but if a majority of the product was in, they would ship what they had to the clients. It also would not be considered acceptable by this company to make clients wait more than 2 weeks if the product was available.

My statement about customer service declining is held up by the response from some, you can ask for a refund. Worst thing in the world to say to an frustrated/disappointed/even angry client. You'll lose them. In fact sometimes just getting to the root of the issues helps in keeping that client. I said I had been purchasing from Reaper since 1991, and I backed this Kickstarter b/c I like their products. Otherwise I would not have wasted my time, it their time.

I guess I got lucky on the 2 other Kickstarters I supported. I did indeed relieve my materials well within the estimated delivery date. No these Kickstarter were not small in size but not as large as this one. Something I'll keep in mind if/when I support another.

My statement of I hope you have a great day was sincere. Sorry if that added a condescending feel to my post. Again, I wish all the best.

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Something to remember, moderators are not employees. I do not think Ladystorm meant anything other than you have an option.

 

Personally, the Bones minis are extra icing on the cake that is my life. They will show up someday soon. I do not want someone to have to miss time with their families so I can have it sooner nor am I upset that an annual event was not cancelled or impacted because my icing is not yet here. And I would hope that people lucky enough to go to Reaper Con are able to buy the new minis. It would mean that I could see and enjoy more reactions to build my anticipation.

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I've got three of them coming, I'm gonna need a bigger house!

I'm suddenly very glad I decided not to buy any dragons. Those are massive to the point of unplayable for the gaming I do. Hell, I was worried the Hydra I ordered was going to be too big, let alone a 14" BASE for a dragon.

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I'm going to add my two cents here because I think it's important to highlight something. I understand your frustration, Selnar. Particularly if somebody hasn't been active on the boards since the Kickstarter things can look a little different from the outside. Those of us who were here virtually every day were well conditioned to know that March was a flexible date due to many circumstances. Without that, it's not unreasonable to come along and wonder what's going on.

 

However, I think it worth pointing out that what you call bad service is, ironically, actually the opposite. There's a schism here between perception and reality, and if you're not familiar with how Reaper does what it does then it can look one way when it's another.

 

Reaper could have solved a lot of issues by simply setting the target out a few months to give them some space. They could have said, for example, estimated delivery in June. At least half of the current complaints would instantly vanish just from that simple statement.

 

So why didn't they? Well, when Reaper looked this idea over they said "You know, I think we can do this in March - which is a lot better than June - and everybody gets their stuff faster. So if we can do it, then that's what our target should be." In other words, Reaper decided that because they could get this done probably quicker, that it's better for the people who backed them if they do.

 

I think that's pretty hardcore customer service. I'd have pulled a Scotty and added months to what I thought I could do so I could look like a miracle worker. Despite the difficulty in getting millions of Bones into production from concept art to finished product in a mere 8 months, and despite it falling around Reapercon and causing more headache, Reaper went with the more difficult option that had the chance to get us all our goodies faster than we would have.

 

See, Reaper isn't like other companies. They do care, and they work ridiculously hard for us. I never had any clue how true that was at first, I figured it out after a while. They walk the balance between getting our hopes up (announcing things too soon that might not appear because of difficulties) and going above and beyond to keep us happy any chance they can get to do so. These guys are fanatical about CS, in a very old school way.

 

They're getting flak because they tried to do right by us and get things out as soon as they were available, instead of sitting on them or extending the date outwards. I think they've done a phenomenal job with this Kickstarter. You may disagree. That's cool, we don't all have to agree on stuff. That'd make for a boring world.

 

But I felt it might be helpful to sort of help fill in the other side of this issue from a different persepctive. We're all desperately eager to get our Bones, and we'll get them soon enough. Maybe not as soon as we'd like, but soon enough. So I hope this post has been a bit helpful in illustrating how (in my opinion, I don't work or speak for Reaper) things turned out the way they did, and that Reaper busted their butts to get it done as smoothly, and quickly, as they were able.

 

I hope your Bones will prove as satisfying as the existing pre-kickstarter ones I've been playing with, and if you're looking for advice, tips, or have questions about painting them then this forum is one of the best resources to help out. When all of our Kickstarter stuff finally arrives, there'll be a lot of fun stuff going in the community. Feel free to join in, we're always happy to welcome a new person slinging some paint. The whole point of the exercise is fun!

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I've got three of them coming, I'm gonna need a bigger house!

I'm suddenly very glad I decided not to buy any dragons. Those are massive to the point of unplayable for the gaming I do. Hell, I was worried the Hydra I ordered was going to be too big, let alone a 14" BASE for a dragon.

 

 

What sort of gaming do you do? I plan to use mine for RPGs, and Kaladrax (the biggest mammer jammer of the lot) looks fit to take up 1/3 to 1/2 of our hex real estate. That's big, but I figure it works because he ought to be a centerpiece fight anyway. But if you're looking at wargaming, yeah, he might be a skinch too large to be especially useful.

 

Although that may not stop me from trying.

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I think part of some peoples' frustration may come from the scale of this thing compared to, well, everything most people encounter.

When you look at the scale of your order, it's like "All I ordered was a Vampire, 2 sets of paint, a Big K and Nethy. How long can it take to throw that in a box?" for example.

But the scale from Reaper's side is a bit more daunting. I can look at the numbers and say things like "Yup, 19,000 vampire boxes is a lot of boxes". And I can know that a vampire box is a given size, like roughly a large shoebox size. But taking those two pieces of info and combining them to figure out how much space 19,000 vampire boxes took up when they were delivered to Reaper? Nope, I can't really picture it (and I watched the truck unloading video. Twice). Then add in that every Khaladrax, Nethyrmaul, and Cthulhu, are apparently in a box roughly (but not exactly) the same size as a vampire box. Then add in the thousands of miniatures cases. Then boxes for each option. And boxes for all the assorted Vampire pieces that can be added separately. And lets not forget the however many thousands of 12 packs of paints.
They built a new section onto their existing building, and still had to rent storage space.

Reaperbrian mentioned today that he has to calculate how many of each size shipping box he thinks he will need for each week as there isn't room for all of the collapsed boxes in the building.

The volume they are dealing with, for a staff their size, and a space their size, is ridiculous.

The company I work for deals with vastly more products and volumes, every day. But we have massive warehouses, including insanely expensive fully automated ones, and millions of dollars in software optimizing the whole process.

We have hundreds of workers, just for the warehouses (yes even the giant robots need someone to watch over them :) )

Reaper's got a staff of somewhere around 30 people, total.

 

Personally, I think that while Reaper prepared for the Kickstarter as best they could (and far better than most miniatures companies) the actual physical volumes of product and the logistics for all the combinations ended up as more than even they expected.

But I also think they are handling it very well.

So, while I'd love to be playing with the absolutely silly number of Bones I ordered, I'm content to wait, and curse the fact that I can't make it down to ReaperCon and buy them all a beer.

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Mistwalker, thank you for your response. I believe my response to Jasper shows I missed some of the posts/reports. So I was missing some info, and I I believe led to my sense of fustration. My tone was not meant to be hostile but I can see where it can be seen as such. I'm more disappointed. It does indeed suck that people who have paid may have to wait until May

...

My statement of I hope you have a great day was sincere. Sorry if that added a condescending feel to my post. Again, I wish all the best.

Oh, a bit frustrated by not having yet received your bones - I can definitely sympathize with that feeling - I have a large order and am Canadian to boot (the importation into Canada plan is being revised as there may be a better way, but it is now waiting on the Canadian Government to issue a license to Reaper, sigh), so I expect to have a long wait to receive mine.

 

As mentioned earlier, Reaper has been quite open about why the process will likely take 6 weeks or so to process all of the orders, and there will be a break in all of that for 9 or 10 days for ReaperCon (which was scheduled well in advance - with people booking vacation, paying for travel arrangements, hotel reservations, etc...). From what I gather, Reaper wanted to be able to start shipping early in March, to be done by ReaperCon, but some delays cropped up (like US customs), so the fulfillment process will have to be put on hold for a few days. Also, as mentioned earlier, they did not forecast 18,000 backers when the put in the estimated delivery date on the kickstarter. Reaper does not have the physical capacity or resources to do the fulfillment for all of the backers in a couple of weeks.

 

I know that tone can be hard to read in electronic media (no tone of voice, expressions, body language, etc..) and I will admit that I believed that your first post was hostile, but was not 100% sure .I suspect that the lady with the bat may have had the same impression, which may explain why her response was short and to the point - but I do not believe that her intent was to be dismissive, based on past posts on her part. It may be better in the future to ask questions before you make statements that can be perceived as hostile.

 

I believe that Reaper has met the estimated shipping date, but that too is a question of perception and I will freely admit that it can be seen as the opposite as the last shipment was not shipped out in March.

 

Welcome to the board. I hope that the rest of your experience here is a pleasant one.

 

Edit: Typo corrected.

Edited by Mistwalker
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