Dr.Bedlam Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 I think Reaper's done mighty well, when I compare some of the other kickstarters I've seen and dealt with. Tre Manor's Red Box Games kickstarters is one of the other few where I've felt that I was being treated with good faith, effectively informed about delays and production problems... hell, where I felt that the kickstarter outfit felt like they owed me something, and fully intended to make good.More than a few others, things simply did not work, or didn't work as planned, and the backers were not well treated. Reaper's done okay, all things considered.That being said, I'm more'n a little curious what form this new one will take. I note that not a lot of new sculpt has shown up on the greens gallery since last I checked. Dealing with the LAST kickstarter has really wreaked havoc on the usual order of business at Reaper!...which begs the question: what new product will show up? I'm not sure a second kickstarter would be ANYWHERE near as successful as the first if it was all just a repeat of the same product, for all that Vampire boxes are still selling for lots of coin on Ebay. If it was the same ole sameole, I'd buy in... for a ball cap or something. Not for another Vampire box. Still trying to paint everything in the FIRST one.On the other hand, it's not like they keep me up to date on new product and/or greens or anything. What IS going to turn up in the next KS? And when will it begin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SamuraiJack Posted September 9, 2013 Members Share Posted September 9, 2013 Hoping for some more of the Pathfinder line in Bonesium too... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleBluberry Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Honestly my hope for Kickstarter #2 is dedicated staff. Maybe not a lot, but it's obvious that they can't keep up with their regular metal release schedule while doing a massive Bones push. If this is increasing their sales as much as has been hinted then more staff would be the best thing they could do for everyone. And while I can't commit to participating until I see what's going to be included, chances are good that I'll be in at some level. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ApesAmongUs Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 It certainly paid for stuff. I'm not sure why you would think it didn't. the fact that the stretch goal was free to reaper made it easier for reaper to pay for stuff. It's not deceptive or fake. things like that are indeed real stretch goals. They just aren't exciting stretch goals. It seems like you ignored everything I wrote. I even said explicitly that the money paid for something (the familiars). What it didn't pay for was the actual stretch goal it was attached to. Seems more like you are ignoring the point. What does it matter if they throw in a free thing in? Would it have made a difference if they threw the free stuff on top of the familiars stretch goal rather than at the half-way point to the familiars? The end result is the same. Maybe I'm just misunderstanding your complaint. Yes, that would have been much, much better. More honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Girot Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 It certainly paid for stuff. I'm not sure why you would think it didn't. the fact that the stretch goal was free to reaper made it easier for reaper to pay for stuff. It's not deceptive or fake. things like that are indeed real stretch goals. They just aren't exciting stretch goals. It seems like you ignored everything I wrote. I even said explicitly that the money paid for something (the familiars). What it didn't pay for was the actual stretch goal it was attached to. Seems more like you are ignoring the point. What does it matter if they throw in a free thing in? Would it have made a difference if they threw the free stuff on top of the familiars stretch goal rather than at the half-way point to the familiars? The end result is the same. Maybe I'm just misunderstanding your complaint. Yes, that would have been much, much better. More honest. Don't make me pull this car over. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prophetic_joe Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 It certainly paid for stuff. I'm not sure why you would think it didn't. the fact that the stretch goal was free to reaper made it easier for reaper to pay for stuff. It's not deceptive or fake. things like that are indeed real stretch goals. They just aren't exciting stretch goals. It seems like you ignored everything I wrote. I even said explicitly that the money paid for something (the familiars). What it didn't pay for was the actual stretch goal it was attached to. Seems more like you are ignoring the point. What does it matter if they throw in a free thing in? Would it have made a difference if they threw the free stuff on top of the familiars stretch goal rather than at the half-way point to the familiars? The end result is the same. Maybe I'm just misunderstanding your complaint. Yes, that would have been much, much better. More honest. I actually don't see anything at all dishonest about giving out a pdf as a stretch goal that came from an outside manufacturer. I looked back over the updates and at no time did they claim the PDF was a reaper product, at no time did they claim any money from the KS would go towards bringing the pdf out. I see nothing that they did as dishonest at all. It's just like when Reaper included a copy of their clockwork dragon with a KS by another company just to help them reach a higher goal I personally think it is awesome to see a comraderie like that from people in the business and in the hobby. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greyhaze Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 If they didn't reach the goal, was it implied that the pdf would've been given out anyways? If so, it kind of changes the perspective of the "goal". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Goodchild Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 I agree. There was nothing at all dishonest about the .pdf stretch goal. Nowhere is it written that a stretch goal is somehow illegitimate unless it costs the project creator money to fulfil it. Stretch goals have exactly one purpose, to drive pledges higher. They do this directly by offering something for which existing backers will pay by raising their base pledge to unlock a free add-on or to cover the cost of a paid add-on. They also drive pledges by generating additional interest and adding value which attract new backers. The .pdf goal was a gamble and whether it paid off we may never know but there was nothing remotely dishonest about it. If it helps, think of it as something Reaper threw out there to pass the time while we were waiting to reach the familiars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Girot Posted September 10, 2013 Share Posted September 10, 2013 The PDFs held absolutely no bearing in my various equations. At all. It was a fun and appreciated extra that was a convenient gift and had no bearing on the business end of things (as far as I'm concerned). 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buglips*the*goblin Posted September 10, 2013 Share Posted September 10, 2013 The PDFs held absolutely no bearing in my various equations. At all. It was a fun and appreciated extra that was a convenient gift and had no bearing on the business end of things (as far as I'm concerned). This. Same as any goal that didn't really pique my interest. And there were a few of those, mostly because miniatures I find in the catalog or online store don't seem to be as awesome as they turn out to be when I have them in hand. The Manor ogre and ettin; the old Ogre Chieftan; all of the giants except the Storm Giants pack we got. Now that I have them, I love them, but the Fire Giants and Frost Giants didn't excite me. On that level, they were the same as the PDFs. "This doesn't thrill me, so let's get past this and see something awesome." 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilJames Posted September 10, 2013 Share Posted September 10, 2013 The PDFs held absolutely no bearing in my various equations. At all. It was a fun and appreciated extra that was a convenient gift and had no bearing on the business end of things (as far as I'm concerned). This. Same as any goal that didn't really pique my interest. And there were a few of those, mostly because miniatures I find in the catalog or online store don't seem to be as awesome as they turn out to be when I have them in hand. The Manor ogre and ettin; the old Ogre Chieftan; all of the giants except the Storm Giants pack we got. Now that I have them, I love them, but the Fire Giants and Frost Giants didn't excite me. On that level, they were the same as the PDFs. "This doesn't thrill me, so let's get past this and see something awesome." I had that thought on a few of them as well buglips. If it was something I didn't care for then I just eagerly waited to see what was beyond it and it was usually something that did peak my interest. The purpose of the pdf stretches as far as I'm concerned is to break up the wait on longer stretch goals or when we hit the first longer stretch goal. That is hardly dishonest. Throwing the pdf on top of the stretch only makes the wait longer and really could be seen as just as dishonest if that's how we are thinking about it, It makes the stretch goal seem bigger than it is at no actual cost increase to reaper. I'm not sure how that would be any more honest than what they did. For me there is no real difference and neither is dishonest, it's just that one way is a tiny bit more interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caffiene Posted September 10, 2013 Share Posted September 10, 2013 Stretch goals have exactly one purpose, to drive pledges higher. My understanding is that stretch goals originally came about for the purpose of describing to backers what their excess money would be used for after enough money had been raised to fund the original goal of the KS. Obviously that has changed over time as stretch goals have started to involve more things, and as KS rewards have become more pre-sale oriented, but I dont think its accurate to describe driving pledges as the "exactly one purpose" of stretch goals. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godfather Punk Posted September 10, 2013 Share Posted September 10, 2013 The pdfs are like the entertainers at Disneyland when you're in the 2 hour queue for Peter Pan's Flight. You can ignore them, enjoy them but you're still going to wait 2 hours for the main attraction. And they're already included in your ticket price. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokingwreckage Posted September 10, 2013 Share Posted September 10, 2013 The PDF was free. Who gives a rat's bum? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiniCannuck Posted September 10, 2013 Share Posted September 10, 2013 The PDF was free. Who gives a rat's bum? LOL - well put. It didn't cost the supporters anything and, who knows, someone saw a value in the pdf and it made them decide to back the project. If you were already in, it didn't matter if it was a freebie miniature, pdf or a hamburger. You have already pledged because you saw the value in the project. Don't get me wrong. I love the freebie stretch goals and would prefer more minis but I won't get upset and complain when I've given a pdf instead. That is like slapping grandma when she give you socks at Christmas. You know she could have gotten you the video game you wanted. Heck you even gave her a picture of it beforehand and the best place to buy it. But NOOOOO, she got you lousy socks again. There not even the good socks. They are the itchy wool socks that you only wear when you play hockey and you stopped playing hockey THREE YEARS AGO!!!!! .... ummm, sorry about that. I guess I still have Christmas present issues.... Anyway, I'm fine with a pdf stretch goal if it makes sense to Reaper. ... I've gotta go now and call my grandma... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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