mikem91 Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 I tripped across this note in the morning's news feeds: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/200664283/deluxe-w20-changing-breeds/posts/659300 The short of it is someone pledged for Onyx Path's Deluxe Werewolf at their highest tier. This pledge turned out to be a scam which is impacting the funds for the project considerably and affecting the deliverables. I've no skin in this particular game as I'm not a backer of this project, but I'm finding it difficult to find words to describe this scammer. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buglips*the*goblin Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 Oh, chargeback. I see. This was a common fraud on eBay, and credit card companies now very much frown on abuse of the feature. The person in question may be in for a surprise if said activity is habitual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nocturne Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 Looking at the number of projects he's backed* it's going to be a very nasty surprise on the way, *(his backer history can be found from an article that someone in the W20 comments linked to) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pingo Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 Here's another article about it. http://kotaku.com/scammer-accused-of-ripping-off-over-100-kickstarters-1462074405 The scammer's account has been banned from Kickstarter. It's a vicious thing to do to a small creator, especially on those smaller Kickstarters where losing one or two thousand dollars after shipping rewards can ruin them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loim Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 I'm not really a business person, and I freely admit to not having a clue about the ins and outs of scamming. What possible benefit could be obtained from doing something like this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nocturne Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 I'm not really a business person, and I freely admit to not having a clue about the ins and outs of scamming. What possible benefit could be obtained from doing something like this? He does the chargeback after receiving the goods so he gets the items and gets his money back. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loim Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 Thanks for the clarification, Nocturne. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buglips*the*goblin Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 This is why we can't have nice things. And also why, some time back, I said look to eBay to see where Kickstarter will evolve. It's the same problem: a site acting solely as an intermediary venue with no guarantee; operated largely by trust and a strong community; runs into problems where project creators don't fulfill and backers demand action; backers abuse system and project creators demand action. And the only way to solve these problems is for the site to more directly interfere, and then it will mutate. Incidentally, I think that's a bad idea, however inevitable. I don't eBay anymore. I used to be all the way into it. Despite the fact I got burned a few times, it worked better without interference. So does Kickstarter. But people will never tolerate it, they'll only look to their own personal loss and demand action. Eventually Kickstarter will cave. Then the funtimes are over, because Kickstarter will get more involved - and that'll start rationally enough, and seem good, but within a short time it will mutate and cut off the spigot for independent projects. Because independent projects from new faces carry risk, and people will lose patience with risk, and so a de facto vetting which favours the already established will prevail. Which is pretty much the antithesis of the whole idea in the beginning. But, hell, I remember when eBay was a peer-to-peer auction site. Whatever happened to that? Print out this post, tuck it away, and check back in four years. See if I'm wrong about Kickstarter. It's inevitable evolution, a corruption that will happen at a grassroots level. The site will be killed by its users, in aggregate. Some of it will be the backers who will only deal with people they trust after being burned a few times and getting fed up - and the other half will happen top-down as damage control and prevention. It's an organic certainty, and wholly unstoppable. Because people aren't "basically good"*, people "basically suck and are horrid". *eBay's old motto. Ah, good old days. 20 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator OneBoot Posted November 12, 2013 Moderator Share Posted November 12, 2013 Here's Kickstarter's response: http://comicsbeat.com/kickstarter-respond-to-scam-allegation/ I have no words to express how I feel or what I'm thinking right now, so I'll keep my thoughts to myself. Huzzah! --OneBoot :D 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nocturne Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 Thanks for the clarification, Nocturne. Got to be honest, it took me a while to figure out. I was confused as the W20 one hadn't delivered yet, but they have lost out on the money which covered about three of their stretch goals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Last Knight Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 There's a word for people like this, but the forum filter won't let me use it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pingo Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 There's a word for people like this, but the forum filter won't let me use it. "Thief" 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Last Knight Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 There's a word for people like this, but the forum filter won't let me use it. "Thief" ...there's a more colourful and satisfying word for people like this, but the forum filter won't let me use it. 13 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trodax Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 So I'm not sure I understand the motivation behind something like this; is it to get stuff for free or to mess with project creators? It must be the last of these I'm thinking because in this particular instance (Werewolf Changing Breeds Deluxe edition, I'm a backer btw), this... person pledged (and was charged, if I'm understanding things correctly) $2500 for which he received 13 PDF's (the pledge was also for the printed deluxe book, which hasn't been delivered, and a four hour RPG session with one of the creators via Skype, which I don't think has happened yet). Isn't $2500 a helluva lot of money to put on the line for 13 PDF's? How does this thing work, could this guy be 100% sure he'd get his money back? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slendertroll Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 I think it must be both. Intentionally malicious with a side of getting free stuff. You wouldn't do it for such high levels of you just wanted the stuff. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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