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ADW Ice Age Miniatures Kickstarter


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that everyone writes little gender symbols next to their name like pokemon. I am so bad at this.

I'm not sure what you mean by this, but it seems to not be revenant to the topic.


Speaking of the Topic - We need to be sure we are not posting defamatory or abusive commentary about the project or persons involved.  remember our rules.  Posts will, unfortunately, be culled again.

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Andrea Svgolfi, unbeknownst to me, was a guy (andrea is a girls name in german); and it turns out the sculptor was a girl, and I'm just really bad at figuring out genders on this KS, I guess. :/


Lovely people, regardless. I'm just tired, and thought it funny that it happened to me twice on one KS... A bit off topic, yeah, I guess.


On a more on topic note, I thought her attempts to make "Terror Bird" sound like IP were pretty good, if you didn't know that that was what people call Family Phorusrhacidae... Almost convincing; the name really does sound like something a miniatures company would come up with...

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Aard_Rinn is my hero.  Hell hath no fury like a gamer scorned! 

Er, on topic, It's nice to see Andrea talking about some of the stuff behind the scenes.  I feel bad for all of the artists involved.

Even slightly more on topic, doesn't reaper produce already a good amount of ice-age type mammals?  Like a giant furry rhino? a sloth?

Edited by Corporea
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Be fair, Aard_Rinn, a lot of people over on the Kickstarter seem to think you're a dude.




Well, I had a look at the latest update (#121).


A few observations.


This in no way reads like the statement of a genuinely aggrieved company. The tone is arrogant, sneering, and contemptuous. There is nowhere even a single "We're sorry to say...", no sense of sympathy for backers, no element of regret or apology, only wrath and scorn and awkward and inept attempts at legal threats.


The poster displays zero understanding of copyright and trademark law.


That he or she is referring to "common law trademark" is a giveaway. Common law trademark means the trademark is not actually registered anywhere, but is simply asserted, and has pretty much no standing in court.


By the way, this poster also displays zero understanding of legal language. The post uses big, intimidating words, but ... how do I put this ... that's not how legal documents work. This stuff sounds like comic opera legal language.


Their claims to own the IP of Ice Age creatures is beyond ridiculous. Their new claim that the freelancer they stiffed was actually an employee who didn't give them time sheets is interesting, and in my opinion likely to be horse puckey. If they ever filed tax withholding forms for that person as employers are supposed to do for employees, there would be an address on file where they could be found, and I will eat my hat.


They are brutally contemptuous and insulting of the skills and integrity of the artist they cheated, which is odd considering they are still promising her sculpts to their backers.


The cut and paste from Wikipedia without attribution is in violation of the terms of Wikipedia's Creative Commons license, ironically.


It's also a wall o' legalese far better wrtitten than their own, but irrelevant to their case. They don't explain what it's there for because they cannot. I think it is just there to scare people.


I think the poster betrays a great deal about his or her ethics, thought processes, and practices in what he or she is doing and saying and accusing others of doing.

Edited by Pingo
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Yeah, I know. Like I said, gender icons!


All in all, yeah, that's pretty much how I saw this. Common law trademark is another great catch, BTW. I think that part of their problem is that they're used to scamming 1-2 people at a time, face to face. A lot of their tactics revolve around infighting, deceit, and lying with big words that confuse their victims - strategies that fail when you have a wide pool of people with a diverse knowledge set and the internet at their disposal while they interact with these scammers. When they seemed legit, nobody questioned, so discrepancies went under the radar - now that people are watching, the combined pressure of 200+ sets of eyes looking at their project makes it nigh impossible to slip things through like that. For example, I might not know what common law trademark is, off the cuff, but Pingo did, and if she didn't, one of us could just look it up. Likewise, I knew already that terror birds refers to family Phorushracidae, so even if people thought it was a IP of ADW, I could point that out.


In effect, we're crowdsourcing our research into their crowdsourcing scam. It's fascinating - I really might see if I can get a paper out of this...

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If you believe this is a fraudulent project you can file a complaint with the U.S. Federal Trade Commission here: http://goo.gl/4kTeb3

You can file a complaint whether you are a U.S. citizen or not.

I have first-hand knowledge that there is at least one failed Kickstarter project under Federal investigation due to complaints made through the aforementioned site.

Additionally, the FTC's responsiveness is based on the number of complaints they receive. The more complaints that are filed, the quicker they will respond.

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Also, if, as some indication has suggested, you believe that part of this group is operating out of Canada, we have our own trade group. My brain is not working right now, so I can't tell you what it is called, but I will be happy to look into it for you and share that information.  Things like this make me sad, but the fact that so many are working to help make things right gives me a warm fuzzy.

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One of the IAM backers looked up Susan. Notice Quebec here. : http://www.weaverchestertweed.com/press100113.html

Copy the ISBN listed for that Quebec book and try searching for it on Amazon or http://www.isbnsearch.org/ It doesn't exist.


And I wondered if maybe Amazon just didn't return any results b/c they didn't carry the book, so I searched for the CAV JoR 1, figuring that was out-of-print and would be hard to find. Amazon found it.

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I took the time to file an FTC complaint today.  It was actually a pretty easy and painless process and only took me about 10 minutes.  They just ask you to provide the contact information for the company, as well as your own contact information, how much you money they took and how you came into contact with the company, etc. and give you a place where you can write a little blurb in your own words as to what happened.  I used that space to briefly describe what happened and to provide links to the Ice Age Mammals and Sea Monsters Kickstarters.  Apparently the more people that take the time to file a complaint, the higher the chance that the FTC will take up the issue and investigate and/or prosecute.

Edited by zoroaster100
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Also, if, as some indication has suggested, you believe that part of this group is operating out of Canada, we have our own trade group. My brain is not working right now, so I can't tell you what it is called, but I will be happy to look into it for you and share that information.  Things like this make me sad, but the fact that so many are working to help make things right gives me a warm fuzzy.


Yes, please. We're currently OT on Dakka with ADW, so posting something salient would help, thanks!

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