Delayed Mierce Darklands: New Kindreds

[Trodax]

Yup, I agree with that too; here's what I wrote in the Mierce Dakkadakka thread regarding the pricing:

 

Another thing I've thought about in connection to the long string of Kickstarters is the availability of the back catalogue. It's just something I've noticed in myself, a year ago if a sexy new unit (like the Shadow Drunes or whatever) would show up in a KS, I'd rabidly pledge to be able to get them. But today I'm feeling a lot more hard to seduce, because I'm thinking if I don't buy them now there's probably a good chance they'll show up in a later project as part of some host package or whatever (perhaps as a better deal). And in a like manner, if you are a 'Kickstarter company' and repeatedly include the '20% on existing stuff'-deal in your projects, then this is really the benchmark against which all other deals should be compared, instead of the RRP. What I mean is that snagging a monstrous mount for £50 (RRP £60) is suddenly not looking so juicy if I know I could also just wait and buy it at 20% off through a KS a year from now when it's directly available.

[Beagle]

Yup, I agree with that too; here's what I wrote in the Mierce Dakkadakka thread regarding the pricing:

 

Another thing I've thought about in connection to the long string of Kickstarters is the availability of the back catalogue. It's just something I've noticed in myself, a year ago if a sexy new unit (like the Shadow Drunes or whatever) would show up in a KS, I'd rabidly pledge to be able to get them. But today I'm feeling a lot more hard to seduce, because I'm thinking if I don't buy them now there's probably a good chance they'll show up in a later project as part of some host package or whatever (perhaps as a better deal). And in a like manner, if you are a 'Kickstarter company' and repeatedly include the '20% on existing stuff'-deal in your projects, then this is really the benchmark against which all other deals should be compared, instead of the RRP. What I mean is that snagging a monstrous mount for £50 (RRP £60) is suddenly not looking so juicy if I know I could also just wait and buy it at 20% off through a KS a year from now when it's directly available.

 

Agree with all of that.

Now go to bed, it's late! (Haven't forgot your mail, I'm just a bit tied up dealing with my new found fame).

[CashWiley]

Yeah, the RRP thing has gotten to be a weird phenomenon; I base everything on warstore pricing but they have very little stock. The GBP beating RRP up even further doesn't help, nor does the pile of unpainted Mierce resin I have now. I hardly look at anything that's not a project exclusive.

 

I think a lot of companies thinking about staying with KS as a release channel are going to have to rethink things sooner than later.

[MonkeySloth]

I agree too. You can still get really good deals through their KSers but you have to go in on the $600+ levels to usually get that. If you want one or two things it's best to wait--which is why I think Rob's been doing the KSer alts as he can charge more for them (sometimes double), they cost very little extra in sculpting time and can get people to but into them.

[Darsc Zacal]

I've had my say before about how I feel about the people behind Maelstrom who became the people behind BaneBeasts who became the people behind Mierce...

[MonkeySloth]

And I still think your wrong Darsc and your repeated insistence that Mierce kickstarters are a con job is quite tiresome. It's easy to hold onto preconceived notions but Mierce hasn't shown any of the signs that this is a shell game like Drake or Centerstage. Mierce has steadily delivered on everything and the only significant slippage happened with the Mounts (and that might just be one mount that gets delayed as they've placed their fastest sculptors on the others not done).

 

What is concerning is that Rob pretty much seams to have given up selling on the open market and the few stores that do sell things for roughly the same price as the 20% that they keep offering as a great deal--so many people feel less and less inclined to back, which means less things being produced and eventually their KSers not getting funded--which honestly could lead to some problems as even if the man hours are covered in a KS that doesn't mean rent, utilities and such are.

Edited December 22, 2014 by MonkeySloth

[Darsc Zacal]

And I still think your wrong Darsc and your repeated insistence that Mierce kickstarters are a con job is quite tiresome. It's easy to hold onto preconceived notions but Mierce hasn't shown any of the signs that this is a shell game like Drake or Centerstage. Mierce has steadily delivered on everything and the only significant slippage happened with the Mounts (and that might just be one mount that gets delayed as they've placed their fastest sculptors on the others not done).What is concerning is that Rob pretty much seams to have given up selling on the open market and the few stores that do sell things for roughly the same price as the 20% that they keep offering as a great deal--so many people feel less and less inclined to back, which means less things being produced and eventually their KSers not getting funded--which honestly could lead to some problems as even if the man hours are covered in a KS that doesn't mean rent, utilities and such are.

There appears to be some misunderstanding about my concerns with the people behind Mierce.

I do not believe them to be con people however they do have a history of both poor business acumen and of misleading their customers. I experienced this first hand when they were part of Maelstrom, by getting a flurry of emails from them over a period of several months offering deals that appeared to be to good to be true... And were.

 

They were fine folks to deal with when their businesses were going smoothly, but when they started running into problems it was very concerning how they treated their customers. I do have a concern of history repeating itself and would feel badly if anyone here were to be caught up in that without any inkling of that history.

 

I am sorry that you find the very few posts where I've expressed those worries tiresome. However we have already seen examples with other kickstarters here where ignorance of a companies history has led to bad things happening to people on these forums. I sincerely hope that Mierces backers never have similar bad things happen to them out of ignorance.

[Beagle]

No point arguing over this, you're both right

[Dan d'Lyon]

Rob did state that BaneBeasts really wasn't aimed at the Darklands audience, but if Roberto is sculpting any of it then I'm interested. Regardless, I simply cannot afford to go heavy into any of their projects anymore. I have several hundred already with easily 100 more still coming and I haven't painted any of them. So I'll probably continue to support the projects, but my buy in will likely be £100 or less... Unless there's another dragon.

[MiniCannuck]

I don't know much about the history of the owners.  However, it is becoming apparent that KS may not always be the best way of launching a product.  There is such a saturation on the market at this point that people are being forced to compete on price instead of quality.  The concern, as always, is when a deal looks "too good to be true", it probably is.  I'm sure that many will deliver but they aren't exactly building a strong financial base for their company.  I'm getting to the point where I'm more impressed with a company who has a viable business plan rather than a "killer deal".  I'm tired of getting games that die off shortly after the KS because the company used all their resources for fulfillment and had no profits to grow the company.

 

As for my dealings with Mierce, they have been very positive.  I posted on Reaper and a few other forums how much I liked the miniatures I found at GenCon and whoever monitors the forums at Mierce contacted me.  They thanked me for my comments and offered to let me get other figures at the original KS prices - including the stretch rewards.  Now, I'm sure that they offered this to others but it doesn't stop me from feeling good about them reaching out to me.

 

I also appreciate how much they support a number of podcasts that I listen to.  It seems like they are doing everything they can to develop a company instead of just a bunch of one of KS events.

[Berik]

I think there's potential for a 'Kickstarter Company' to work, but I think that's more applicable for someone like Stonehaven who generally finish one Kickstarter and then roll into the next when the previous one fulfils. But if the plan is to continually have three to four Kickstarter projects in various stages that strikes me as pretty dangerous. What happens to the whole operation if there are a couple of Kickstarter projects that barely fund or don't fund at all? When Kickstarter money is for a specific project that's one thing, but if Kickstarter project funds are the primary source of income for the company as a whole that makes for quite a stack of cards when there are multiple unfulfilled projects.

 

To be clear I think the Mierce product is incredible and I very much want them to continue to succeed. My own dealings with the staff have been nothing but positive, so I certainly hope that my concerns for the company prove unfounded. But I do have some misgivings over the strategy they seem to be going with, and hope it doesn't end up biting them.

[Trodax]

Berik, your post above is almost exactly word for word how I feel about this; they have a fantastic product, they've handled everything so far very well, but I'm a bit concerned.

[SIGIL]

I like the Mierce guys, despite what a few of posts might otherwise suggest but ALL kickstarters have a the potential to fail. Anytime a creator has unfulfilled obligatiosn and they come back to the well again and again to take on more they are due some scrutiny. The more often they do it the more intense that scrutiny should be. I kept my mouth shut on so many previously failed KS's that I saw red flag after red flag with and I am just tired of it all now. Finish what you start, deliver on your promises, THEN come back and make more.

 

Sorry but that is just the flat truth.

[MonkeySloth]

OK lets bring this thread around as they've started to get sculpts going again. If you want to wine about Mierce please do it in their current KSer thread.

 

I was really on the fence about the tree monsters in the Irish starter set and now, after seeing it sculpting, I really like them. Assuming I have money around June (when they're expected to ship) I think I'll pick up the set.

 

[Dan d'Lyon]

Yeah, that thing is all kinds of awesome.