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Giant sizes, how have they changed?

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Well, the sizes for most of the 2E giants are huge which is 12' + to 25' except for the wood, verbeeg and firbolg which are large, and the storm which is gargantuan. So for game purposes I suppose that it would be ok as long as they were based correctly, but I don't play 5E so I'm not sure about their rules. I actually like the 3E change to the fire giant, since they have always been listed as being built like dwarves. I never did understand Reaper's take on the frost giant though, except Frorigh and Frulla, but hey maybe frost giants in their world had dwarfism.

Reaper's recent frost giants leave me cold.

 

I'm with dsmiles on this one. I always remember the main D&D giant types being in 3 foot steps. Storm (21), Cloud (18), Frost (15), Fire & Stone (12), Hill (10). Ok so the Hill is a bit off the 3 foot pattern. Anyways! More giants would be nice. Especially some more female giants. Has anybody ever made a female Hill Giant?

Sadly mini manufacturers often shied away from ugly females and hill giants don't tend to be that good looking. If you don't mind the jungle queen or amazon look, you might find some larger gift pewter statues out there,  For female giants, I'm using the recent Hero clix Giganta # 016 from Superman and the Legion of Super-Heroes heroclix set. 89mm tall and dirt cheap.  

 

post-12161-0-02067000-1418984237_thumb.j

 

 

 

Back on topic. Having really gigantic giant minis just isn't practical.

Well, if one is dead set on pewter and resin figures from miniature manufacturers, yeah, but if one doesn't mind putting some action figures on bases, it opens up some reasonably priced options. 

 

That makes sense. I always thought classic D&D giants had more HD then what was justified by their mass alone. It seems like they should either be bigger or scaled down stat wise. It's like if you tried to make a smooth graph of HD progression there's a sudden inexplicable spike after bugbears and ogres. *shrugs*

Here's a bit on monster size vs HD from the 3Era. And here's another article on specifically giants packing more power than their size would indicate in 3e. On classic HD curves, minotaurs and trolls hang out at 6 HD ish, but they are pretty monsterous compared to the other humaniodish types.

 

Ahh.  I hadn't considered the 1980s great demons-and-devils-purge-big-satanism-scare as a factor in the giants being scaled up in 2E.

 

The history of backroom politics is so illuminating sometimes.

 

Hard to piece together though. I THINK some data was in the 2E AD&D Preview book back in the day. 

add2preview.jpg

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As far as base sizes, It is worth noting that the D&D 5E miniatures from the licensed Tyranny of Dragons line up are only on large 2" bases (well, 50mm specifically), rather than the huge 3" bases the rules suggest.

 

bigunss_zpsa63089c9.jpg

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And Ral Partha (Ironwind) have a female giant. It's one of the few early ones I can recall.

See, I seem to remember that, too. Can't seem to locate a pic online, though. I could have sworn it was a frost giant female, not too different from Reaper's. Or at least a female with an axe.

Here she is: Iron Wind Metals DF-090 (I nerfed the link because I just realized it violates Reaper's commerce rules)

This is the early one, anyway. I have a copy of her. I'd have to pull her out and check but in my memory she's not that big, maybe only an inch and a half, an inch and three quarters?

By the way, she's clearly not a big seller. All those "Customers who bought this product also purchased"? They're all mine, from the same order I ordered the giantess in last spring. If anyone else had bought a copy of her their purchases would be mingled with or supercede mine.

Here's one of my favorites, a Julie Guthrie female hill giant, which was the giant they sold before DF-090. This one they discontinued however

 

http://www.miniatures-workshop.com/lostminiswiki/index.php?title=Image:Rp-02-902-1.jpg

 

I think the problem with the one that replaced her is she doesn't definitively even look like a female to me.

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Here's one of my favorites, a Julie Guthrie female hill giant, which was the giant they sold before DF-090. This one they discontinued however http://www.miniatures-workshop.com/lostminiswiki/index.php?title=Image:Rp-02-902-1.jpg

I think the problem with the one that replaced her is she doesn't definitively even look like a female to me.

I don't recall seeing that mini before. She looks ferociously wonderful.

 

If you mean DF-090, she looks female enough, if rather more civilized than the hill giant in the fur two-piece. She's only just a giant, though, especially by today's scales.

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Tiger%20Tiger.jpg

15027499488_87cbe12d10_z.jpgMaddie Calendar by kitchen_wolf, on Flickr

Funny thing about gigantism - some parts get bigger faster than others.  Note the size of the eyes and nose on the Shirtless Tsar's pet cat compared to Maddie-chan.  To make something look little, you make the eyes relatively large and shrink the extremities.  To go in the opposite direction, I suppose a giant should have huge hands and feet, a great big lantern jaw, piggy little eyes, and a shnoz of genuinely cavernous proportions.  Maybe a 3-up of a GW Cyrano de Bergerac.  Otherwise I'd just go with some of those big Schleich humans for civilized giants.

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And here I thought that was going to be a post about scale creep...

It's part of what I was thinking in the OP, although scale creep seems to be a phenomenon of miniatures exclusively, whereas the scale changes in the game have followed a different evolution.

 

It's interesting.

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I was wrong about the size of the Ral Partha-Iron Wind DF-090 female giant.

 

She's bigger than I remembered, about 2 1/4 inches tall, almost 60 cm to the top of her head.

 

Not gargantuan, perhaps, but certainly pantagruellian. ;)

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I'm really not picky about true to scale. My players are mostly just happy I have minis, and doubly so if I got paint on them. 

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Not gargantuan, perhaps, but certainly pantagruellian. ;)

Huzzah! I learned something today!

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Hmmm, for scale... I generally tailor the giant to fit the mini - so the Hill Giant from the old 2nd ed. Ral Partha boxed set and the even bigger Hill Giant from the Reaper Warlord line are Huge - and handled by popping the Jotun Blood template on the giants. (Advanced Bestiary is your friend....)

 

Makes it easier.

 

The Auld Grump

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I'm with dsmiles on this one. I always remember the main D&D giant types being in 3 foot steps. Storm (21), Cloud (18), Frost (15), Fire & Stone (12), Hill (10). Ok so the Hill is a bit off the 3 foot pattern. Anyways! More giants would be nice. Especially some more female giants. Has anybody ever made a female Hill Giant?

 

I always used Frulla Krung (02622) with different paint jobs. Only recently has anyone addressed the idea of female giants at ALL.

 

I wonder why it took so long. The all male races generally produced by mini makers is really annoying. 

 

If I may:

 

When manufacturing miniatures for use in a game system, one must consider the types of miniatures one might require for the game.  

 

Let us examine this station, then.  

 

Given: Statistically, more adventure modules and commercially available supplements* will call for (thus economic demand) a greater number of male Giants and Giantkin than of females.

 

Given: Giants in minaiture will have greater volume (and thus greater material/metal investment) than a comparable non-giant, following knowable mathematical laws for volume interacting with linear changes in height.

 

It follows from this that demand for the male miniature is assumed (whether correctly or incorrectly) to be higher. 

 

It follows also that a giant will be more expensive to produce in metal than a humanoid would be.

 

It follows from this then that to test the viability of an expensive model with an unknown sales record, one should use the highest demand option, to minimize risk. This is sound business, and I like sound business, it pays my salary.

 

It follows then that the Male Giants of each variety make business sense as First Forays into Giant types.

 

It follows that when sales are strong, Female giants of the same subtype are introduces, and for giant varieties whose highest-knowable demand version are unpopular, female versions of the same are potentially too high-risk for safe investment in sculpting, models, and materials.

 

 

What's my point? That it's simply an extrapolation of the best data we have available to us - in a simple majority of cases, the male version of a gendered monster is typically thought to be more common, and as such, a better candidate to test sales viability with minimal risk.

 

 

*market research can only be conducted on known variables, and the contents of people's home games and adventures, before the rise of online campaigns searchable by Google, were not knowable, therefore not available for study.

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Wouldn't it be cool if there were giant casualty figures!? Dead and lying on the ground with great wounds!?

 

This would be one of the most popular figures ever ... for about 100 people.

 

Decisions about what to make, when made by companies who are likely to stay around, need to be expensive and low-risk, inexpensive and low-risk, or inexpensive and high-risk. Expensive and high-risk, even when the payoff might be commensurate, is the business equivalent of a Hail Mary pass -- when it works it can save a lost game, but you don't do it unless you have to.

 

Which is to say, "What Bryan said".

 

ps. Casualty figures are beloved of diorama builders, who are apparently a very vocal part of the audience, but have historically been poor sellers.

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