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Panzerfäuste: Mechanised Warfare in a Mythical Realm Kickstarter (Hysterical Games)

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Last Chance Friday!

 

This weekend we will be closing down the PayPal option to get on board the Kickstarter if you missed out last year.

So if you want to get on board at the start and pick up some KS bargains and exclusives drop us an email at [email protected] for more information right now!

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I have no Polish heritage that I know of but I can't help be a little offended on their behalf... :mellow:

 

Italians as Elves? Hmmmmm.

 

Italian Elf Chick. <<<=== I am gonna guess that is a phrase one would be wise to leave un-googled.

 

As an American of Polish and Mexican descent I'd say that the trogs are kinda worrying. If only because they aren't really playing off any bits of actual Polish identity. Dwarves being all grumpy and industrious as Germans, sure that's a part of German self-identity. So if that same sort of logic were being followed I'd assume Poles would be ogres or halflings or some other rural fat folk, but nope it's instead it's a race of rat people for some reason. The only remotely Polish things in that army are the bear brute and the grandma looking lady serving drinks.

 

I don't know if I'd call it actively racist yet, but it's definitely worrying.

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I have no Polish heritage that I know of but I can't help be a little offended on their behalf... :mellow:

 

Italians as Elves? Hmmmmm.

 

Italian Elf Chick. <<<=== I am gonna guess that is a phrase one would be wise to leave un-googled.

 

As an American of Polish and Mexican descent I'd say that the trogs are kinda worrying. If only because they aren't really playing off any bits of actual Polish identity. Dwarves being all grumpy and industrious as Germans, sure that's a part of German self-identity. So if that same sort of logic were being followed I'd assume Poles would be ogres or halflings or some other rural fat folk, but nope it's instead it's a race of rat people for some reason. The only remotely Polish things in that army are the bear brute and the grandma looking lady serving drinks.

 

I don't know if I'd call it actively racist yet, but it's definitely worrying.

 

 

This is actually an interesting point that I haven't been bothering to consider until you brought it up. I find it, now when you mention it, quite interesting in seeing what kind of characteristics they have decided to give each race/faction. The polish being rat people..yeah, I can see how that would be a bit offensive. But I find it more interesting how they portray the Russians as demons/devils. In the context, I find it interesting, and more so than the Polish version.

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I have no Polish heritage that I know of but I can't help be a little offended on their behalf... :mellow:

 

Italians as Elves? Hmmmmm.

 

Italian Elf Chick. <<<=== I am gonna guess that is a phrase one would be wise to leave un-googled.

 

As an American of Polish and Mexican descent I'd say that the trogs are kinda worrying. If only because they aren't really playing off any bits of actual Polish identity. Dwarves being all grumpy and industrious as Germans, sure that's a part of German self-identity. So if that same sort of logic were being followed I'd assume Poles would be ogres or halflings or some other rural fat folk, but nope it's instead it's a race of rat people for some reason. The only remotely Polish things in that army are the bear brute and the grandma looking lady serving drinks.

 

I don't know if I'd call it actively racist yet, but it's definitely worrying.

 

 

This is actually an interesting point that I haven't been bothering to consider until you brought it up. I find it, now when you mention it, quite interesting in seeing what kind of characteristics they have decided to give each race/faction. The polish being rat people..yeah, I can see how that would be a bit offensive. But I find it more interesting how they portray the Russians as demons/devils. In the context, I find it interesting, and more so than the Polish version.

 

We Brits are evil, baby killing orcs. I couldn't care less, they're using fantasy races to fill in for real life nationalities. Anyone who reads any more into it than that has a screw loose or is looking for a reason to be offended.

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I have no Polish heritage that I know of but I can't help be a little offended on their behalf... :mellow:

 

Italians as Elves? Hmmmmm.

 

Italian Elf Chick. <<<=== I am gonna guess that is a phrase one would be wise to leave un-googled.

 

As an American of Polish and Mexican descent I'd say that the trogs are kinda worrying. If only because they aren't really playing off any bits of actual Polish identity. Dwarves being all grumpy and industrious as Germans, sure that's a part of German self-identity. So if that same sort of logic were being followed I'd assume Poles would be ogres or halflings or some other rural fat folk, but nope it's instead it's a race of rat people for some reason. The only remotely Polish things in that army are the bear brute and the grandma looking lady serving drinks.

 

I don't know if I'd call it actively racist yet, but it's definitely worrying.

 

 

This is actually an interesting point that I haven't been bothering to consider until you brought it up. I find it, now when you mention it, quite interesting in seeing what kind of characteristics they have decided to give each race/faction. The polish being rat people..yeah, I can see how that would be a bit offensive. But I find it more interesting how they portray the Russians as demons/devils. In the context, I find it interesting, and more so than the Polish version.

 

We Brits are evil, baby killing orcs. I couldn't care less, they're using fantasy races to fill in for real life nationalities. Anyone who reads any more into it than that has a screw loose or is looking for a reason to be offended.

 

 

Of course, but if you DO analyze it a bit more and look upon how the races/factions have been portrayed there are indeed a few similarities that would reflect on how the symbolic nations have been looked upon. Is it not true that the Polish were looked upon as "rats" and didn't the west portray the communists to be the "evil of the world"? It's interesting that they decided to take it in that direction, as they could have gone in another direction that wouldn't actually be any risk of misinterpretations.

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Since panzerfaust was an existing game they really had to keep to what had been set up before as to what was what (even if it was a small existing fan base that was what they were trying to leverage for their initial funding explosion)

 

look at all the nerd rage that happened when GW changed the background for their Necrons

 

think what would happen if D&D 5th had decided Dwarves were a proud noble race that lived high in the treetops, and elves were grumpy gold obsessed miners

 

(I exaggerate somewhat, but having people you know will back to start with is really crucial for a small KS as day 1/2 performance is what makes other people take notice)

 

 

I also think looking at the art the troglodytes are closer in appearance to the vision of trolls according so a variety of Scandinavian myths, (small, beasy eyes, large bumpy noses, large floppy ears, and a stringy tail, stubborn or brave depending on your point of vier) than they are to rats..... now whether you think this is better or just as bad, that's up to you

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I have no Polish heritage that I know of but I can't help be a little offended on their behalf... :mellow:

 

Italians as Elves? Hmmmmm.

 

Italian Elf Chick. <<<=== I am gonna guess that is a phrase one would be wise to leave un-googled.

 

As an American of Polish and Mexican descent I'd say that the trogs are kinda worrying. If only because they aren't really playing off any bits of actual Polish identity. Dwarves being all grumpy and industrious as Germans, sure that's a part of German self-identity. So if that same sort of logic were being followed I'd assume Poles would be ogres or halflings or some other rural fat folk, but nope it's instead it's a race of rat people for some reason. The only remotely Polish things in that army are the bear brute and the grandma looking lady serving drinks.

 

I don't know if I'd call it actively racist yet, but it's definitely worrying.

 

 

This is actually an interesting point that I haven't been bothering to consider until you brought it up. I find it, now when you mention it, quite interesting in seeing what kind of characteristics they have decided to give each race/faction. The polish being rat people..yeah, I can see how that would be a bit offensive. But I find it more interesting how they portray the Russians as demons/devils. In the context, I find it interesting, and more so than the Polish version.

 

We Brits are evil, baby killing orcs. I couldn't care less, they're using fantasy races to fill in for real life nationalities. Anyone who reads any more into it than that has a screw loose or is looking for a reason to be offended.

 

 

Of course, but if you DO analyze it a bit more and look upon how the races/factions have been portrayed there are indeed a few similarities that would reflect on how the symbolic nations have been looked upon. Is it not true that the Polish were looked upon as "rats" and didn't the west portray the communists to be the "evil of the world"? It's interesting that they decided to take it in that direction, as they could have gone in another direction that wouldn't actually be any risk of misinterpretations.

 

As usual Orlando is more diplomatic than I. But I have to say Grefven I completely disagree with you and Toasty. The Troglodytes are only rat like if you're looking for them to be, and even if they are I see no link to rat monsters, Poland and WW2. To imply racism when none exists is bad form.

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I have no Polish heritage that I know of but I can't help be a little offended on their behalf... :mellow:

 

Italians as Elves? Hmmmmm.

 

Italian Elf Chick. <<<=== I am gonna guess that is a phrase one would be wise to leave un-googled.

 

As an American of Polish and Mexican descent I'd say that the trogs are kinda worrying. If only because they aren't really playing off any bits of actual Polish identity. Dwarves being all grumpy and industrious as Germans, sure that's a part of German self-identity. So if that same sort of logic were being followed I'd assume Poles would be ogres or halflings or some other rural fat folk, but nope it's instead it's a race of rat people for some reason. The only remotely Polish things in that army are the bear brute and the grandma looking lady serving drinks.

 

I don't know if I'd call it actively racist yet, but it's definitely worrying.

 

 

This is actually an interesting point that I haven't been bothering to consider until you brought it up. I find it, now when you mention it, quite interesting in seeing what kind of characteristics they have decided to give each race/faction. The polish being rat people..yeah, I can see how that would be a bit offensive. But I find it more interesting how they portray the Russians as demons/devils. In the context, I find it interesting, and more so than the Polish version.

.

I would have made the Russians Bears. Gone for the obvious pun. Also: Polar Bears = White Russian Sub-faction.....  :B):

 

 

Edit: further musings—

With a starting point of this: link to coat-of-arms, I might have made the Polish faction into wingless bird people, fierce eagle heads... ...maybe a rare few who have [mechanical?] wings for a different take on Polish Winged Lancers.

.

.

Not sure who I would turn into the rat people...GW has forever tainted Fritz Leiber's vision of were-rat folk...with all things Skaven.  

 

Why are mice-lings so cute and adorable, but were-rats/ratlings are craven and awful?

.

.

Monkeys, Baboons and Apes are another problematic mammal to anthropomorphize [sp?]

Edited by TGP

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As usual Orlando is more diplomatic than I. But I have to say Grefven I completely disagree with you and Toasty. The Troglodytes are only rat like if you're looking for them to be, and even if they are I see no link to rat monsters, Poland and WW2. To imply racism when none exists is bad form.

I think racism is far too strong a word. More active cultural research could result in a better product. Like the Russians are zombies given a large part of their national identity is about endurance and simply outlasting all comers "We will be there when they bury you" etc, which seems to show at least some consideration for "matching" as it were. It's a nifty product I just think there are a few missteps that could have been improved by more active matching.

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The Polish trogs are some kind of lixard/troll people, I think

 

With the Russians, I see the zombies as the Russian WW2 way of sending millions of soldiers into the meat grinder. Zombies work the same way. And since zombies are always evil they need some evil gits to control them

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Out of curiousity. What race portrays Canadians?

<<<MOD>>>Galaxy-Quest-clapping.gif removed.

 

Non animated gif provided

 

21831038_2.jpg?v=8D2370A1492D8F0

Edited by Beagle

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Out of curiousity. What race portrays Canadians?

Werebeavers
<_<

 

 

Out of curiousity. What race portrays Canadians?

 

Galaxy-Quest-clapping.gif removed
:rock:

 

Also. Bad doggy Mr.Beagle. Animated gifs, even humorous ones, are a nono.

Edited by Darsc Zacal
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I have no Polish heritage that I know of but I can't help be a little offended on their behalf... :mellow:

 

Italians as Elves? Hmmmmm.

 

Italian Elf Chick. <<<=== I am gonna guess that is a phrase one would be wise to leave un-googled.

 

As an American of Polish and Mexican descent I'd say that the trogs are kinda worrying. If only because they aren't really playing off any bits of actual Polish identity. Dwarves being all grumpy and industrious as Germans, sure that's a part of German self-identity. So if that same sort of logic were being followed I'd assume Poles would be ogres or halflings or some other rural fat folk, but nope it's instead it's a race of rat people for some reason. The only remotely Polish things in that army are the bear brute and the grandma looking lady serving drinks.

 

I don't know if I'd call it actively racist yet, but it's definitely worrying.

 

 

This is actually an interesting point that I haven't been bothering to consider until you brought it up. I find it, now when you mention it, quite interesting in seeing what kind of characteristics they have decided to give each race/faction. The polish being rat people..yeah, I can see how that would be a bit offensive. But I find it more interesting how they portray the Russians as demons/devils. In the context, I find it interesting, and more so than the Polish version.

 

We Brits are evil, baby killing orcs. I couldn't care less, they're using fantasy races to fill in for real life nationalities. Anyone who reads any more into it than that has a screw loose or is looking for a reason to be offended.

 

 

Of course, but if you DO analyze it a bit more and look upon how the races/factions have been portrayed there are indeed a few similarities that would reflect on how the symbolic nations have been looked upon. Is it not true that the Polish were looked upon as "rats" and didn't the west portray the communists to be the "evil of the world"? It's interesting that they decided to take it in that direction, as they could have gone in another direction that wouldn't actually be any risk of misinterpretations.

 

As usual Orlando is more diplomatic than I. But I have to say Grefven I completely disagree with you and Toasty. The Troglodytes are only rat like if you're looking for them to be, and even if they are I see no link to rat monsters, Poland and WW2. To imply racism when none exists is bad form.

 

 

If you make references to real and actual happenings of our society, one needs to take into account that people will interpret it, and as a creator, I would actually find it to be a very positive aspect if other people were to analyze my work.

 

And just to make things clear so I don't get misquoted or anything. I do not claim or  imply anyone to be a rasist. I am merely pointing out details that could be misinterpreted and thusly would lead to that people could take offense by it. Anyway, just to highlight the connection between rats and Poland just to illustrate this point. There is this famous anti-jew propaganda film used by the Nazis, from 1940, "Der Ewige Jude", in which jews are directly compared to rats. Regarding the devils and the Russians. There is another famous connection, a speech made by president Reagan, in which he directly states that Russia is the most evil that they will face and that it is a struggle between good and evil.

 

Of course, all this above are interpretations of the symbolic value that is in fact tied into real and actual historical references on which this theme is connected to.

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