Sell me on a miniature/ war game

[fanguad]

Personally, I tend to shy away from the tournament games such as Warmachine/Hordes, Malifaux, etc because so many people are bringing their A list and steamroll casual players. I love the miniatures, love the rules, but the games aren't fun when you keep going against power players.

Before I bought into Warmahordes, I went to check out the local scene. The guys I play with really want others to enjoy their hobby as well, and even though I lost a lot at first, there were very few cases where I felt like I got steamrolled (I did make sure that everyone I played against knew I was a newbie).  There are some players that regularly do tournaments, and when playing me they'll bring their experimental lists or otherwise tone it down a bit.  I'm sure its not like that everywhere, which is why I checked beforehand.  So I guess the moral is, don't dismiss your local group out of hand.  (although it's also possible that they are jerks who would beat up on a new player, in which case, yeah, stay away)

[Deguello]

There are two seperate issues.  Here is how I would decide.

 

I think the most important factor in your decision.

What's my local meta group playing and how often?

 

That's the real tell.. Can you get a game when you want or almost when you want?

 

As far as games that match the miniature sets you already have.

Kings of War is probably your best bet.  I am not a Kings of War miniature fan.. I am a Reaper miniature fan, and the rules do not preclude you use Kings of War miniatures.

 

It is a mass battle system and requires some rank and file troopers. and there are a number of bases required per unit however you can do a diorama. and as long as you have over 50% of the models on the base they are happy at tournaments. and while you are working on miniatures as long as you have the unit size base you can pretty much play a game.

Its quick, Its easy.  and while sometimes you have to roll a lot of dice. (One of my arguments against the game) its fun to play. 

My list of things that that make this something you might want to pursue.

1) You can probably use the fantasy miniatures you already have.

2) You can freely use Reaper miniatures in this game, and I would say you are a fan if you are on their boards.

3) Base rules are free.  and fairly balanced.

4) Avg Games play in about 60-90 minutes.

5) It is a semi tactical game that is not about power but positioning.

 

Another Rule set I'll tell you about is 9th age.  Its an independent rules set built out of the ashes of what was warhammer fantasy.

If you like Warhammer fantasy.  (I did not)  You might want to look at this game.  Its not done by a miniatures company to sell miniatures.

Its being done by fans of the old Warhammer fantasy.  You should be able to use any fantasy miniatures you like.  But word of caution it will take a lot of miniatures rank and file.  Warhammer fantasy was imoo never a great game.  And was designed as a platform to push miniature sales for its parent company.   Still it is a decent game, and since it is being done by fans any models should be allowed.

 

I am not a fan of Warmachine or 40 K.  These games are designed with miniature sales in mind.  Not everything is viable in these games.  Its almost seems as if they are design as a way to push miniatures and allow for players to seek out the best possible rule twists.  All games tend to be the same here.. Good matchup vs bad matchup with very little else to add to their game.  They both have huge followings though and if your area has a meta it is likely going to be one of these two.  With the edge going to 40K for number of players.  Neither game is very balanced.  Not all miniatures have practical application on the battlefield.  And certain faction struggle while other factions have an easier time. If you are interested in either of these two definitely get some demo games before purchasing models.

 

Bolt action is a pretty good 28 MM WW2 game (I am not a fan of their miniatures or prices) but it is a decent game and if you have the right division between allied and axis players is fun to play.   Another WW2 game on a different scale is Flames of War.  Its a better game than bolt action and shares some of the same principles with 40k.  It is a game.  You will run into players trying to turn it into some sort of tactical battle recreation.  Its definitely not that.  I am not a fan of the price of their models.  But there are a gluttony of miniatures available in this scale. So finding a price point to buy at is usually pretty easy to find.

 

The last game I am going to talk about in any kind of depth is Infinity.  Its a skirmish (near/far future setting)  Things I like about this game:

Low model count <20 models

All models on the table have a purpose and a counter.

Several factions to choose from (and while they have their strengths and weaknesses) The game is fairly balanced.

This is the game where if you see a group of models you like in a particular faction its probably worth the purchase.

This is the only game where I buy miniatures strictly because I like the model.  If I don't like the model.. I don't buy them.

Free ruleset

 

Things that were an issue for me in game

Require lots of terrain

Small but growing meta

Rules are translated into English from Spanish and sometimes that's an issue

ITS missions require lots of specialists, Which really is an adjustment from the rules.

Miniatures tend to be pricy, Difficult to assemple and on a slightly smaller scale than other 28mm miniatures.

 

Malifaux. (I haven't played)  I like some of the models and The card turning mechanic is fairly unique.  But I haven't played so I am going to leave this a question mark

 

Board games with a miniature component I'd recommend.

Zombicide

Super dungeon explorer (if you like Chibi)

Arcane quest is fun as well (if you like Chibi)

Decent

There are others but I am drawing a blank.

 

 

Ok after all I have said above.

The most important thing is to find out what your meta is playing.

Game can be really cool; Models could be really cool.  but if no one is playing the game, you probably wont be either.

If you don't like who you are playing you probably wont play either.  So keep that in mind.

The above is the most important 90% of the decision.

After that its just deciding which game you want to play.  Good luck

[VitM]

 

I am not a fan of Warmachine or 40 K.  These games are designed with miniature sales in mind.  Not everything is viable in these games.  Its almost seems as if they are design as a way to push miniatures and allow for players to seek out the best possible rule twists.  All games tend to be the same here.. Good matchup vs bad matchup with very little else to add to their game.  They both have huge followings though and if your area has a meta it is likely going to be one of these two.  With the edge going to 40K for number of players.  Neither game is very balanced.  Not all miniatures have practical application on the battlefield.  And certain faction struggle while other factions have an easier time. If you are interested in either of these two definitely get some demo games before purchasing models.

 

 

I just wanted to star this in particular.  Having been into both of those games at one point; I can say that they've made me swear off any war game intended to sell a line of miniatures going forward.  Not that there's anything particularly wrong with a company bringing such a thing to market--it's just hard to shake the feeling that decisions about the game are unduly influenced by the realities of the miniature sales.

[Rob Dean]

So, Dragon Rampant is out since the last entry. My copy is awaiting me when I return from my wanderings, but I couldn't wait and downloaded the Kindle version, too.

 

It looks pretty reasonable. It's nominally based around units of 6 mounted or 12 foot figures, but they anticipate that heroes and large creatures will be fielded as single or reduced model count units (say 3 or 4 trolls as a foot unit). Retinues/warbands have 4-10 units, so the model count can be whatever you want. I've been sitting here while the roast beef is in the oven considering some lists to try. I have one drawn up with a single dragon, a single hero, a unit of six mounted, and a unit of twelve foot, for a total of 20 models. My second is elves, with a couple of single figure units, two foot units, and two mounted, for a total of 38 models.

 

Their stated intention is to permit you to choose a profile for any unit or figure you might happen to already have, so, in that sense, it's something like Hordes of the Things, but with more granularity in the rules.

 

More after a test battle...

[TGP]

Are Dragon Rampant, Lion Rampant, and Frostgrave all from Osprey?

[Dilvish the Deliverer]

Frostgrave is published by Osprey. Not sure about the others.

[Heisler]

Yes, they are all published by Osprey, but Frostgrave is definitely by a different designer. Not sure if the other two are by the same designer or not. Osprey is really providing a publishing avenue for designers.

[Rob Dean]

Dragon Rampant is the fantasy version of Lion Rampant, and is by the same designer, Dan Mersey. He also did Dux Bellorum, a post-Roman Britain game with a different set of mechanics, and Song of Arthur and Merlin, an Arthurian adaptation of the Song of Blades and Heroes rules.

[Rob Dean]

 

My son and I had a chance to try Dragon Rampant put this morning. I took a warband of a fire-breathing dragon, a captain on a land dragon (elite rider), a unit of lizard rider skirmishers, and a band of goblins, and my son took the defenders of the forest: an elf captain (heavy rider), elf pikes, elf archers, a band of centaur warriors and a lighter band of centaur skirmishers, and a scout unit (depicted as a magic-slinging elf princess). The figures today were all vintage Ral Partha, brought along for another purpose, which speaks well for the versatility of the game. It would have been helpful to have the rules in paper rather than Kindle, because we needed to flip around through the rules quite a bit on the first playing. It will also be helpful to have the warband sheets printed out, since they contain most of the information needed to play. I scrawled them out quickly by hand, so I skimped a bit on the special rule information.

 

With 4 and 6 units respectively, the turns moved along quickly. Despite my son's distaste for random activation rolls, he did pretty well, and eventually his captain slew mine. My high value dragon did not perform as well as I had hoped, probably because I spent time breathing fire rather than charging in with claw and fang.

 

Overall, I thought that it went well, and I am looking forward to playing again soon. Most of my figures are already grouped into 6 figure mounted units and 12 figure foot units, so I've got a functionally unlimited range of warbands ready to go.

Edited December 27, 2015 by Rob Dean