SPOILER ALERT Force Awakens SPOILER thread

[uncas]

 

 

Oh it was rapey, but for an 8 year old who loves his Dad, Kylo killing Hero Han (he's seen all the other movies), that was horror. Poor kid cried and turned away. After that, I don't think Kylo can redeem himself in his eyes. He's Evil-Terri-Bad and my 8 year old wants a Rey figure.

I'm really curious to see if the writers try to redeem him at some point in the following two movies. My gut says they will, since that's kind of Star Wars' thing, but I'm not sure people will buy it. Of course Anakin/Vader also does horrific, unforgiveable type things and gets his moment of redemption at the end of RoJ, so we'll see.

The thing is, Vader did his horrible terribad things in the prequels. WAAAAAAAY after ROTJ was made. When Ben was killed, Ben let Vader kill him. It was less Vader's doing and more Ben's sacrifice.

 

But in the first movies, Vader wasn't that bad. Kylo, though, is elf cake.

 

It's definitely true that the worst we see Vader do is in the prequels which were made after the fact. Additionally, during the original trilogy we don't really get to see under Vader's mask (into his thoughts and intentions) much. We've actually seen more uncertainty and internal conflict from Kylo than we ever saw from Vader in IV. In some ways that makes it worse. 

 

Additionally, we didn't really know Vader and kenobi's relationship when ben sacrifices himself in IV, but Han's sacrifice to his son in VII is perfectly clear to us, which again makes it seem worse, but Ben was as close to a father as Vader ever had, so it's surprisingly similar. It's just that IV presents it as a former pupil that turned evil which would perhaps be more like if Kylo had killed Luke in this movie. But again, we know Luke and his relationship to Kylo, we really didn't know Ben or Vader when the similar scene occurred originally. 

 

Anyway, I'm with you that Kylo is evil. Depending on how they proceed though, I might be able to get on board with a similar dying moments redemption by Rey that parallels Luke's rescue of Vader. I see both as consumed with evil, but part of the power of the light in these movies is that it's never too late, even when a person thinks it's too late for them. (Though if Han's appeal didn't do it, I don't know what would!!!!)

 

I could also be quite happy with his evilness being destroyed utterly too. It just depends on how they build from here on out. 

 

 

By the way, your son has good taste! If I was his age I'd probably react similarly.

[Kheprera]

I'm actually proud of my boy for his empathy.

 

And I agree that Ren could be redeemable. As a GM I've allowed players a chance to redeem villains if they want to go that route.

 

However, it's a trope that also gets overdone. I, for one, would like to see a truly irredeemable villain who gets his all-powerful elf kicked to smithereens in the final film after the protagonists have gone through elfing elf to fight his evil.

 

But that's just me as I'm working on an Evil-Terribad-Villainess concept and keep saying "Not. Evil. Enough. Needs moar ebil!"

[TGP]

We're not even a Type I civilization yet, I think we have some time...

The first Order went all Type II on us...

 

Was any planet in the Republic or Empire periods beyond Type I ?

[terminalmancer]

 

We're not even a Type I civilization yet, I think we have some time...

The first Order went all Type II on us...

 

Was any planet in the Republic or Empire periods beyond Type I ?

 

I don't think so, although if I remember correctly there were some precursor civilizations in the Expanded Universe that were. I suspect that Type II methods are a little too exotic--and maybe a little too expansive--to be easily adapted into a movie.

[ub3r_n3rd]

Awwww 

 

 

[Dai-Mongar]

Hehehe.

 

[Morihalda]

We don't see movies in theaters very often, but we felt that big space movies were best seen on the big screen. We finally got to see it!

 

I'm in the middle, going positive. It's much better than how I view Star Trek movies, heh. "Oh, look at the pretty space battle. NO! No don't look at the title. Or the uniforms. Those are just... for show. Yeah. Not actually a film for one of the shows I love."

 

I only went back a few pages on this, y'all have probably said everything I wanted to say. Lots of duplication that really threatened my ability to relax and enjoy the film, but a few good hits to nostalgia. Obvious lead ups to big bad guys, but some good funny scenes. Also, I haven't seen the other ones in like 10 years, so a lot of feelings may be totally different.

 

But awww, that cat ear photo.  That's so mean 

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Me blabbering below -

 

Rey does need a nice backup for her fighting, though. I like the student theory.

Yeah, she had to fight for herself when she was alone so she's good, but not that good and so fast. And I was cool with her and Finn fighting Kylo Ren - Ren was already injured, wasn't he? He wouldn't be at the top of his game, and we never really see him use a blade except for tantrums.  Finn was raised for battle and he got torn up by Ren (ooooh man that got me pretty bad when I watched it). Rey spent most of her time running away, it's not like she went crazy superhero on him. There were some parts in the film though, that I was like, "noooo, I know you are a babe and a bad-elf, but you can't be that bad-elf yet!"

 

I can agree that the friendship between the 3 was rushed, but with understandable circumstances. I don't like pairing people off too early, so it's just friendships talking here.

 - Rey and Finn - Once they realize they are on the same "side," they're like, "friend?" "Friend!!" They grew up so isolated that I don't think it's unreasonable to attach to your first true friend in a time of need. 

 - Poe and Finn as instant bros? I'D be Poe's instant bro.  Poe just effortlessly exudes charm. He's just that awesome, charismatic dude with skills that doesn't require magic or anything fancy. Anyone would follow that kind of confidence! I think he was a pretty good example of "next-gen Star Wars" without being identical.

 

I also really, really like Maz for some reason. I've always liked the oracle stereotypes though, so that's probably it.

[Erifnogard]

The speed of people forming friendships and the instant competencies are just pulp genre conventions. People tend to forget that Star Wars is very intentionally an homage to pulp.

[Morihalda]

Yeah, most things I would actually take the time to pick out are just... needless nitpicks in a fantasy setting for movies, video games, etc. Movie critiques for me are the same, whether or not they are fantasy. Soundtracks, direction and speed of the film, the acting, etc. 

 

"They were friends too fast." Dude, one of their friends is a gigantic fuzzy bear and the problem pointed out is that 2 humans were too friendly.

 

But I also love applying some real world thought to fantasy worlds, because I like immersive worlds that can give me answers to those thoughts! I can ask how something works, and it's explained. Full of more fantasy explanations, sure, but it's there.

 

My mind is wandering, haha. Going home early today.

[ub3r_n3rd]

hehe

 

 

 

 

[Arc 724]

I just watched the dumbest theory video on you tube and this guy was serious. He said MAZ (the bar owner) was in all the movies. She was actually a Jawa. Basically every time a main character interacted wit ha Jawa it was "probably maz." I want 5 mins of my life back.

[ShadowRaven]

Jawas didn't show up anywhere other than the first movie....I am so very very sorry for those lost minutes. 

[Erifnogard]

Jawas didn't show up anywhere other than the first movie....I am so very very sorry for those lost minutes. 

Much to the detriment of all the rest of the movies.

 

Ok, maybe not.  But I do love those little scavengers.  I almost talked a GM into letting me run a jawa bounty hunter once.  LOL

 

ETA:  My generic text message tone is  a jawa screaming 'Utinni!'

Edited February 13, 2016 by Erifnogard

[uncas]

Jawas didn't show up anywhere other than the first movie....I am so very very sorry for those lost minutes. 

Actually, at least one is present in RotJ in Jabba's palace. Not particularly significant, but still, present. 

 

But yeah, the theory is pretty rubbish. 

[ShadowRaven]

 

Jawas didn't show up anywhere other than the first movie....I am so very very sorry for those lost minutes. 

Actually, at least one is present in RotJ in Jabba's palace. Not particularly significant, but still, present. 

 

But yeah, the theory is pretty rubbish. 

 

forgott Jabba's palace, but certainly none in ESB.