Laoke Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 (edited) 11 hours ago, etherial said: They went the very expensive way of rearranging things to avoid your paying import taxes. The only problem with that is that unlike the EU, the Asia-Pacific region doesn't have free-trade agreements which means that only Australia will be getting no duty on shipping, which as is indicated above Sanwah wasn't even a factor for them. Look, I appreciate what you're trying to say but the bottom-line is that Asia-Pacific backers are going to be feeling rather justifiably annoyed. Again. There is a pattern here, and as much as I like and admire Reaper the only logical conclusion is that ROW shipping for their Kickstarters, especially to the Asia-Pacific region, is not high on their priorities. There are steps we can take to mitigate this, sure. I'm one of the people who basically saw something like this coming after Bones I & II, and took as much control of the shipping process as I could as a result. But lemme put it to you this way: The shipment from Reaper to Australia for Asia-Pacific distribution has not, to my knowledge, even made port yet. The wave 1 shipment that I reshipped from the US myself, for a roughly equivalent price, was delivered to me on the 13th of June. There's something wrong when I can get something shipped to Portland, Oregon & from there sent to the orc-end of the world, New Zealand, a minimum of a month before the Asia-Pacific backers have a container load landed. I thought at the time I backed that the shipping prices from Reaper were very reasonable, but that was comparing it to air-freight. Comparing it to a bulk shipment via sea? Yeah, that makes the question "Are we going to get refunded?" a reasonable one. They'll likely get hit for duty outside Oz, and they paid air-freight prices for sea-freight which seems, I dunno, wrong. If Reaper had indicated that this was the plan from day dot, or even given us a heads up that this was the plan sometime before shipping started, we could have gone "Oh, right, that makes the Reaper shipping option not a good one, I'll arrange something myself". The fact that the first we heard of this was when the fulfilment began meant that we were unable to mitigate this at all. The two provisos I will make are that we don't know if the "Waves" are being used for shipping within the regional hubs or not yet, so complaining about the waves seems a bit premature. And, some backers were screaming for regional hubs for distribution after the previous Kickstarters, so I can absolutely see good reasons why Reaper chose this route. I'm also rather pleased that it's largely an academic question as far as I'm personally concerned. But please, don't try and tell the Asia-Pacific region that Reaper are doing them a favour with this shipping method. I can only speak for myself, but if I was waiting for fulfilment still I'd be feeling very frustrated. Edited July 10, 2017 by Laoke 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gadgetman! Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 Not every country in Europe is a member of the EU, either, so it's going to be interesting to see what's going to happen... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocPiske Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 Update 100 stated that Reaper was paying the duty and import fees on those items shipped to the EU and Australia. The respesctive governments will still be paid, just not by the backer. So no refund on shipping because that money went to pay duty and/or fees. How this works with Australian orders I cannot say. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ratsmitglied Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 Basically with Australian orders vey few, if any, of these individual orders would have paid duty, however, with the bulk shipment duty would have to be paid on the entire amount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanwah Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 I personally have split my order into 3 separate orders to make sure I was under the duty amount as customs use the exchange rate on the day of arrival to calculate the taxes, and who knows what the exchange rate is going to look like a year out. I would think that most Aussie backers with large orders would do the same. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beagle Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 16 hours ago, Edsterdoom said: Well let's see what happens in the coming few days. It would be nice to improve as this will take a while. They managed to ship one parcel in the first two hours this morning, we could be in for a long wait. But if you're in Kortenberg Belgium, congrats. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edsterdoom Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 19 minutes ago, Beagle said: They managed to ship one parcel in the first two hours this morning, we could be in for a long wait. But if you're in Kortenberg Belgium, congrats. I've seen that as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyK Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 (edited) Regardless of whatever excuse is being given about paying for taxes, etc. Australian's were overcharged for shipping. Sorry we paid for Air Mail, not Sea Mail. If Reaper had have actually said that was their option from the beginning then yes, other options could have been organized for getting stuff here quick smart. But no where did they say when we were paying for shipping that Sea Mail would be the option they would take and we would pay according to that option. Considering the time and updates they made in the year since the KS was meant to be fulfilled they could have said something and refunded monies back to people they overcharged on the actual shipping. Instead they just announced 'oh we are sending via boat' and that was that. Using the argument they were paying shipping taxes, etc is bogus. If it had have been sent via Air Mail. It wouldn't have been hit by this new import tax on everything the government is proposing. Unless someone ordered over $1000 in the KS and to be honest if you are spending over $1000 in most cases people know they will incur the import tax. If not. Apologies to be blunt. You have too much money to just throw around. My mates wanted to all get Bones III pledges on my KS account and I told them a big no specifically as I did not want to deal with the Customs process of extra duties. As someone earlier said. It just seems that Reaper is just looking after their own 'people' in the US and the rest of the world is just the matter of hey deal with it. The fact that there seems to be absolute silence from them in regards to the overcharging of shipping costs pretty much says it all. They don't care. Even a simple 'hey we are busy once the shipments are finished we will look at doing a reimbursement'. In the end it appears to boil down to something Wizards of the Coast once said. We will make it, you will buy it. Shut the frack up. Am I annoyed. Yeah I am. I have been a very loyal customer of the company. Have bought many people to them for business at every chance I had. Now I just feel extremely slighted and screwed over. At least they could have bought me dinner to make me feel okay. Edited July 11, 2017 by CrazyK 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glamberry Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 I feel very sorry for you Aussies. Cutting the import charges actually didn't cost me less but also not more. If I knew, I would have ordered more to take advantage of it but oh well. I get why they did it for the European zone. What bugs me most is the lack of communication and the fact that it seems that the UK distribution center is not really fit to handle the amount of shipments in the timeframe reaper put out in the email.Whether it's manpower or organisation I don't know but this tracker is moving dreadfully slow. The Aussie shipment makes me feel like I don't have that much room to complain though. The fact that I'm a supporter, but regular customers can now purchase the items directly and will get them probably even faster than me, who was waiting in anticipation for two years just has me a bit disappointed :/ 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocPiske Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 I get that Australians are worse off, but the most of the rest of the world is getting a better deal. Reaper is paying the import fees and or duties, and paying the the regional shipping companies, and or the local Reaper employees. They have stated that the saving to them are minimal, and this will improve RoW backer costs for future projects. There have been many complaints about the campaigns not being EU or RoW friendly, so Reaper has taken steps to make future projects RoW friendly. If B3 had not been delayed I suspect it would have shipped as planned, but the delay was long enough to allow the new process to be used. No one is saying it's perfect, but Reaper appears to making an effort to make future campaigns RoW friendly. I'm sorry it made this campaign worse for some, but saying they just dont care about RoW is simply not true. If that were the case there would be no attempt at making future projects RoW friendly. I'm not saying you shouldn't be disappointed, but I am saying you might be doing something similar to what you're accusing Reaper of doing: only taking into account the local circicircumstances and not the big picture in regards to circumstances in the rest of the world. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beagle Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 2 hours ago, Edsterdoom said: I've seen that as well. 4 hours late they've done their second!!!! Do I see some momentum building? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gadgetman! Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 8 minutes ago, Beagle said: 4 hours late they've done their second!!!! Do I see some momentum building? Nah, that's probably just an accident. Someone clicked on a button they shouldn't have, or something. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nunae Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 The problem appears to be that even though they are geographically close, the Australian/East Asian countries don't have the kind of union than most European countries. So they don't necessarily profit from less/no import taxes when they get their stuff out of Australia. It kinda feels like the tactic that works reasonably well for the EU got applied to the other group as well, without giving people the option to back out of the ship ride. Personally I really hope they will repeat this shipping for the EU again, as I would profit from that, but knowing beforehand and ideally being able to back out of it (e. g. when the UK leaves the EU and it results in unfavorable import laws). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maglok Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 I have to admit... It is oddly slow. Can we get a Reaper reply on this? OMG my place in my wave just popped by! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SamuraiJack Posted July 11, 2017 Members Share Posted July 11, 2017 World Expo was this weekend.. I'm sure someone will update once they get back to the office if they have details.. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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