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Bad brush?


rfusca
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So, I've just started recently and after much research, I figured out that I'd need a few 'throw' away brushes for dry brushing, gluing, etc, and then at least one decent brush.  I picked up a cheap variety pack of brushes from walmart for $3 and a winsor newton #1 .  My expectations on the WN were...not met.  It doesn't hold a tip well at all, the moment I touch it to anything, it starts to splay out. In fact, the cheap brushes from Walmart seem to do better. 

Bad brush possible? Or bad technique? Am I expecting too much?  I've definitely not let paint into or dry in the ferule, I rinse often, and i tend to twirl the edge of the tip to bring it to a point on the pallet.

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There has been some bad W&N brushes on the market. Particularly on Amazon and eBay. Some may even be fakes. 

(It should have come in a transparent plastic tube if it was a real, unused W&N)

 

Remember to follow the 7 Commandments:

http://forum.reapermini.com/index.php?/topic/73906-77051-orc-stalker-second-ever-paint-job/&page=2#comment-1532818

(Actually, it sounds like you're adhering to the Commandments)

 

My tip for cheap brushes is to search the Bay of Evil for 10packs of #0 and #2 brushes. 

 

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I had very much the same experience with the one Windsor & Newton brush I bought.  Decided to try a couple of other brands (Rosemary & Co., Raphael) and they were much more to my liking.  I delegated that nasty WN brush to base coating.  Somehow it's gotten better over the years, but still tends to split after a little bit of use.  

 

Sorry, that's not much help but I figured it's always nice to know that you're not the only one with the problem.  Like Gadgetman said, fake brushes have been a thing, it's part of the reason why I like my Rosemary & Co brushes--they come direct from the manufacturer.  

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It is hard to say.  I have gotten bad W&N brushes in the past.  It could also be your technique. You need a lot less pressure with a sable brush than others.  I also don't like the WN larger sizes (over 0) because they have a large belly and seem hard to keep a nice point for fine work. I use my #1 for base coating and my 0 as my workhorse precision brush.  Occasionally, I'll still reach for the 00 for doing things like the White Dot from Hell.

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Just now, LittleBluberry said:

I had very much the same experience with the one Windsor & Newton brush I bought.  Decided to try a couple of other brands (Rosemary & Co., Raphael) and they were much more to my liking.  I delegated that nasty WN brush to base coating.  Somehow it's gotten better over the years, but still tends to split after a little bit of use.  

 

Sorry, that's not much help but I figured it's always nice to know that you're not the only one with the problem.  Like Gadgetman said, fake brushes have been a thing, it's part of the reason why I like my Rosemary & Co brushes--they come direct from the manufacturer.  

Do you like the Rosemary & Co? That was the other brand that I keep hearing about.

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Just now, TaleSpinner said:

It is hard to say.  I have gotten bad W&N brushes in the past.  It could also be your technique. You need a lot less pressure with a sable brush than others.  I also don't like the WN larger sizes (over 0) because they have a large belly and seen hard to keep a nice point for fine work. I use my #1 for base coating and my 0 as my workhorse precision brush.  Occasionally, I'll still reach for the 00 for doing things like the White Dot from Hell.

Interesting.  As somebody new, I keep hearing largely that it will be rare to need that tiny 0 brush since even a larger brush comes to a fine point.  I suppose its largely a matter of preference and work style.

Just now, BLZeebub said:

Sounds like a technique issue.  Or else you got one of the super soft-bristled W&Ns.  Or your bristles may be too long for traditional miniature-painting techniques...  Pics?

Will take a pic when home.

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8 minutes ago, rfusca said:

Do you like the Rosemary & Co? That was the other brand that I keep hearing about.

 

I like R&C brushes in that size range better than the WNs.  Davinci brushes are also good.  I always get my brushes through DickBlick.com because they are an authorized dealer for all three companies.

 

7 minutes ago, rfusca said:

Interesting.  As somebody new, I keep hearing largely that it will be rare to need that tiny 0 brush since even a larger brush comes to a fine point.  I suppose its largely a matter of preference and work style.

 

It is likely what I am used to.  When I started painting, I did everything with a 5/0 to 10/0.  My largest brush was a 00 (this was in the 90's).  As I got better and developed control, I went to larger brushes with bigger bellies so I could paint for longer.  I still prefer the 0 over the 1, but that could be that my current 1 (also a WN) is, like yours, a bit flakey.

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Another thing that is highly recommended is that before using your brush for the first time, wash it with mastersons brush soap. This removes any glues or other particles from the bristle hairs which could cause splitting. Then use a tad bit of the soap to point it and allow to dry. A quick swirl in the water before starting to paint and reforming of the point at that time should help in most cases. 

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Just now, ub3r_n3rd said:

Another thing that is highly recommended is that before using your brush for the first time, wash it with mastersons brush soap. This removes any glues or other particles from the bristle hairs which could cause splitting. Then use a tad bit of the soap to point it and allow to dry. A quick swirl in the water before starting to paint and reforming of the point at that time should help in most cases. 

I didn't do that before the first time, but I have since (right after the first usage) cleaned the brush with masters soap and allowed it to dry.

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Just now, rfusca said:

I didn't do that before the first time, but I have since (right after the first usage) cleaned the brush with masters soap and allowed it to dry.

As others have stated, some brushes are just bad. Contact the seller. See if they will refund or replace. 

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I like my Rosemary & Co size zero round and filbert. The size 1 and 2 I am finding I use less. The size 0 is occasionally getting a fray at the edges though, which is annoying. Better than through the center though. 

 

I got a W&N 0 and so far I like it. Thus far I've left it for more rigorous precision work. 

 

Thinking of getting some Raphael and/or Davinci ones soon. 

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8 minutes ago, rfusca said:

Interesting.  As somebody new, I keep hearing largely that it will be rare to need that tiny 0 brush since even a larger brush comes to a fine point.  I suppose its largely a matter of preference and work style.

 

Actually, I wanted to comment a little deeper on this.  Yes, people are technically correct that a large brush with a good point is ideal because it can do both the fine details and the large work.  But the caveat to that is that it will only do that fine work well IF you have developed the brush control to fully control exactly how much paint is coming off of the tip or side with any given stroke.  If you have not developed that degree of control yet, it will be frustrating when using properly thinned paint because you will invariably flood an area with paint stored up in the belly of the brush. So it is all good and fine for those of us who have been doing this for years to recommend Size 2 brushes, but I bet you'll find that the vast majority of us didn't start out there.

 

Not wanting set off a Pingo storm, but human saliva in the point left to dry after a session sets the point very well.  Be warned though that even non-toxic paints still have stuff that are not great for you. never lick a brush that hasn't been cleaned.

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