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CAVBOSS

CAV: Strike Ops III Kickstarter September 19th 2018

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With the Brexit looking like it is delayed long enough for us to get everyone's rewards out, we are finishing up everyone (non-US or CA) that is left with their shipping invoice. 

There has been some people unhappy with the shipping amounts they have been charged, and I sincerely mean this, if there was a better, cheaper way to do it I would have. I have spent a lot of time over the last two months doing my best to fine-tune this, but this is just where we have ended up.

 

I think a lot of people didn't realize that the Terrain sets actually had more models (and more weight/volume) than the core set and a lot of people bought both (or 2 Terrain Sets) and that added up. With there being a basic shipping charge (beyond just the postage), no matter what you ordered, people that went in just for paint or bought 2 CAVs (or 1 Aircraft) certainly had a higher percentage of postage vs what they bought. I had a good example I used with a CA backer to show what all goes into that shipping fee for them. Not everyone gets this or that, but I thought it broke it down pretty good to show what all goes into getting your rewards to you:

Your shipping invoice is for the following (CA orders):

  • The shipping from China to Denton, TX. This includes a boat, a train, and a couple of trucks.
  • Someone to sort out all the boxes and pull your order.
  • The box, tape, and labels for your order.
  • Someone to pack your order.
  • Shipping your order to Niagara Falls, NY.

  •  Someone to drive from CA to NY and pick up your package.
  • HST when going back across the border.

  • Our forwarder handling the package at their warehouse so it can ship to you..

  • and finally the postage that CanadaPost is charging (which is typically based more on the volume/size of box than actual weight).

 

Lastly, people using other KSs for an example of what they paid there vs what we ended up charging for ours, needs to realize there is a big difference in a $65K vs a $3 Million one. There just isn't any extra for us to pay for this or that, especially as we use ALL the money for molds/models. Our shipping bill ends up being a rounding error almost for them but the same amount of prep, work, etc gets done with our other than just the overall scale when it come time to ship.

 

Now with all that being said, I thought I would show where we ended up cost-wise with shipping estimates from the campaign. I set those based on an average from our 2nd KS and on 2018 prices that I could try to gauge what a Core Set would cost, shipping wise. This is where we are (1st number is our estimate for just the Core Set postage as we noted in the campaign, 2nd number is what people ended up with for shipping (this is for just a Core Set only).

 

USA $15-$25          USA $20

CANADA $25-$35          CANADA $30 (includes 5% HST)

Central/South America $55-$75        Central/South America $75

UK/Europe $25-$40       UK $50   Europe $60 (both includes 20% VAT).

Asia $35-$45          Asia $85 (this one we were way off,  mainly due to a huge increase in air freight shipping in this area of the world).

AU/NZ/Pacific $25-$45     AU $55  NZ $65   Pacific $85 (same reason from above, and all includes 10% HST).

 

So overall I felt we did pretty good with our guesstimates, but as always your mileage may vary. :)

 

I know this is not something I had to do, but I thought I would share anyway to show a little of what goes on "behind the Curtain."

 

Thank you for reading. Best!

 

 

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I'm still rather happy mine was only $49ish USD for everything in the box, doubly so since I was all "would be nice if it were under $50, but I understand if it winds up being more" ^_^

 

Saddened I couldn't get more of the aircraft, or a pack of each of the tanks, but that's how the cards fell, and I got most of what I wanted, which is definitely a good thing, aaaand most of what I didn't get I can pick up at retail ^_^

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Unfortunately the cost of shipping means that this will probably be the last Cav kickstarter I can back - but @CAVBOSS I don't blame you for this at all, it is what it is and I've noticed in general shipping from the US to AU has increased significantly in the past 5 years (Could get a CD shipped from California for about $5US, now it's about $12) for smaller companies that can't get massive discounts :-(

 

Makes it hard to support the artists that I wish to support (or niche miniatures companies, they're still artists)

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17 minutes ago, ratsmitglied said:

Unfortunately the cost of shipping means that this will probably be the last Cav kickstarter I can back - but @CAVBOSS I don't blame you for this at all, it is what it is and I've noticed in general shipping from the US to AU has increased significantly in the past 5 years (Could get a CD shipped from California for about $5US, now it's about $12) for smaller companies that can't get massive discounts :-(

 

Makes it hard to support the artists that I wish to support (or niche miniatures companies, they're still artists)

And I can certainly understand that. The trade-off for this is that companies like us that use a KS to truly fund new product, as opposed to a glorified pre-order system, it is still a great deal for what you get. If you got the Core Set for $100, you will receive something like $360 worth of retail product and if you got a Terrain Set for an extra $50, that package gets into the $500 range. So, still a great deal with everything considered.

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It is a great deal, not arguing about that, it's just the not knowing what the shipping costs are likely to be makes it a lot harder to budget for, even when shipping is charged later. Maybe you'll be able to do this better next time around now you have a better idea of the fixed costs of shipping (i.e. everything up to packing the order for reshipping), but I'll wait and see.

 

I don't have my shipping invoice yet, so can't comment on the exact cost of my shipping, it was just a general comment on the fact that shipping costs make it a lot harder for me to support things I'd love to be able to support.

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48 minutes ago, ratsmitglied said:

Maybe you'll be able to do this better next time around now you have a better idea of the fixed costs of shipping (i.e. everything up to packing the order for reshipping), but I'll wait and see.

 

- That's just it though, I don't think we could of done it any better as we have no idea how much stuff a backer may order. I feel we hit the Core Set estimate pretty much dead-on if you take the taxes away (which is $20 USD on a Core Set to UK/EU), which we had said were separate.

Where I would like to see us change is the actual PM (as the older Reaper one is done for and we have no direct control over it anyway, which makes it hard to use on the "fly"). I think I have a much better solution going forward and people should be able to get a real time shipping charge they can see as they add stuff to it, even just as a preview.

And as long as KS counts shipping towards goals, we will have to continue to do shipping after the campaign.

Edited by CAVBOSS
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11 minutes ago, CAVBOSS said:

 

- That's just it though, I don't think we could of done it any better as we have no idea how much stuff a backer may order. I feel we hit the Core Set estimate pretty much dead-on if you take the taxes away (which is $20 USD on a Core Set to UK/EU), which we had said were separate.

 

And I forgot when looking at it that you were including taxes as part of the shipping costs, so for an AU shipment that brings the shipping and handling down to $45 for a core set...still high but not quite as bad as it looked like initially.

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Just to see, since I know which one is yours... ;)

 

Looks like your shipping is $54.59 US. It may be a bit lower yet as I'm waiting on the final pallet cost and I had put worst case in there for now.

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It looks almost as if even with the costs of shipping to AU in bulk that the shipping costs from US to AU make up more than half the shipping costs :-(

 

It feels like that shipping cost is very close to what it would be for you to ship it directly to AU...but I know I'm probably way out there!

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13 minutes ago, CAVBOSS said:

Just to see, since I know which one is yours... ;)

 

Looks like your shipping is $54.59 US. It may be a bit lower yet as I'm waiting on the final pallet cost and I had put worst case in there for now.

As an added datapoint for the record, shipping a core set, terrain set, 2x Banshees, 2x Tsuiseki II's, and both paint sets to Alberta, Canada was $49.23 USD.  To me, it's nice to see that bulk shipping kept the costs close to each other.

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2 minutes ago, ratsmitglied said:

It looks almost as if even with the costs of shipping to AU in bulk that the shipping costs from US to AU make up more than half the shipping costs :-(

 

It feels like that shipping cost is very close to what it would be for you to ship it directly to AU...but I know I'm probably way out there!

And I did check that early on to see if that was the case and I want to say it was like $75 US, plus when they deliver it, they would collect GST (since last year they changed that to apply to all packages, not just over $1000) and a handling fee for collecting as it was explained to me.

Just now, WhiteWulfe said:

As an added datapoint for the record, shipping a core set, terrain set, 2x Banshees, 2x Tsuiseki II's, and both paint sets to Alberta, Canada was $49.23 USD.  To me, it's nice to see that bulk shipping kept the costs close to each other.

Well that and the fact no airplane is involved getting it to Canada. The pallet fee for KS2 to AU was $770 US, for this one its around $1350 for basically same number of packages and weight.

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13 minutes ago, CAVBOSS said:

And I did check that early on to see if that was the case and I want to say it was like $75 US, plus when they deliver it, they would collect GST (since last year they changed that to apply to all packages, not just over $1000) and a handling fee for collecting as it was explained to me.

Well that and the fact no airplane is involved getting it to Canada. The pallet fee for KS2 to AU was $770 US, for this one its around $1350 for basically same number of packages and weight.

TBH it sounds like at least one of the shipping companies is taking advantage of the changes to screw us over even more - officially the GST is chargeable on small items, however it is the company making the sales that is supposed to collect it, and they don't have to register unless they're shipping more than $75,000AU into the country - as far as I understand it anyway (https://www.ato.gov.au/Business/International-tax-for-business/GST-on-low-value-imported-goods/Information-for-consumers/  it looks like only reshippers are meant to collect GST, not couriers).

 

In my case I basically have to get stuff delivered to a PO Box because no-one delivers out to us (except AusPost, in which case I may as well get it delivered to the PO Box) anyway, and I can't get it delivered to work, so that makes things even more difficult.

 

Having said that, seeing that the cost of the pallet has almost doubled definitely confirms my thought that more than half the shipping cost is the cost of getting it from the US to AU.

 

Edit: the tax side of thing is similar to the rules on Australian companies, if you are running a company within Australia you need to register for GST if your turnover is over a particular threshold (I think it's about 100k), if less than that you don't have to collect GST, but at the same time you can't claim GST refunds, companies registered for GST can claim refunds for GST paid.

Edited by ratsmitglied
Added a bit more info...
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Our freight forwarder bids the delivery out, so I would be more inclined that the price for it has increased in that area of the world for delivery...the reason we have to collect GST is that Aetherworks is involved with the whole process, which is an AU company...but yes, about half of the number I quoted you is just for me to get it into AU from here.

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I understand you're collecting GST because Aetherworks has to collect it - it was more if you were shipping directly then you shouldn't have to - I don't have any problems with this (beyond my standard problem with the Government requiring private businesses to collect Tax on their behalf).

 

And my reading comprehension has been failing a lot today - I just re-read the message about values (I'd read it as Core + Terrain was worth $500, not that terrain on it's own was that), and now the numbers make A LOT more sense!

 

Sorry if I've caused you any undue stress here.

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Probably me causing everyone more stress as I'm overly "chatty" tonight :) 

 

But it does read as you thought, the Core Set has a retail value of around $360. While the Terrain Set is around $250 (as we haven't set retail for these items yet). We are collecting GST on what you bought with your pledge, so in your case $5 of the shipping I mentioned for you is GST. I was going by how they do it in UK/EU so I figured it was like that for you. If I ship direct to those countries, they get slammed by the post man on delivery...but even having to pay it is cheaper than normal post from here do the size of the box and weight. The Terrain sets are like 110 pieces and heavier than the Core Set.

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