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TaleSpinner

Getting to Know Each Other, October 2018

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Change?  Is that like "Film", "Vinyl Ell-Peas", and other legendary artifacts of the ancients?

 

Pretty much all of the standard aurumancy incantations are easily automated.  Black-Scholes was about as complicated as it got, and I've never used it.  The stats courses are pretty good for telling me when someone isn't putting any effort into lying, though.

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20 minutes ago, TGP said:

The fun begins at the McD’s drive up if one gives the mathematically inept kid at the window a twenty and some loose change. On a bill that is $11.31, Pay with a twenty, plus six cents (because you want to even the coinage off to Quarters...) and see what happens.

 

<_<

 

Yeah. What usually happens is that the cashier will look at you funny, because why that weird number? Then he or she will type the amount tendered into the register to generate the change. Then he or she will look at the register display funny.

 

Then he or she will give you the wrong change anyway.

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19 minutes ago, TGP said:

The fun begins at the McD’s drive up if one gives the mathematically inept kid at the window a twenty and some loose change. On a bill that is $11.31, Pay with a twenty, plus six cents (because you want to even the coinage off to Quarters...) and see what happens. 

I've gotten to the point that I tell them how much change should get back and they're often amazed I'm right. 

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Just now, kristof65 said:

I've gotten to the point that I tell them how much change should get back and they're often amazed I'm right. 

 

When I was a poor college student, I used to calculate the sales tax on whatever I was buying, because that 3% (Wyoming at the time) might be the difference between being able to afford what I wanted and not. Then, since I knew exactly the amount that would be required, I would count out the precise amount before the cashier was done ringing up the order. (In some cases, I would need to have an extra penny ready, because of varying rounding algorithms.)

 

Nearly always funny when you could just point at the counter after the cashier asked for "$11.18, please!"

 

::D:

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I did that once. I was just out of college. 

 

Clerk asked, “how’d you do that?”

 

Me, “...mathematics.”

 

(Wide eyed) Clerk, “Is that like Math?”

Edited by TGP
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32 minutes ago, TGP said:

The fun begins at the McD’s drive up if one gives the mathematically inept kid at the window a twenty and some loose change. On a bill that is $11.31, Pay with a twenty, plus six cents (because you want to even the coinage off to Quarters...) and see what happens

I've genuinely stumped people by doing that, even though the till TELLS THEM how much change to give me.  It's like balancing it out so they have to give me less change PLUS I wind up carrying less is me speaking in tongues. 

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45 minutes ago, klarg1 said:

 

I notice a lot of people saying "NO! NEVER!", but I have to ask:

 

If I owe you $11, and I give you a $20 bill, how much change do you owe me?

 

If you arrive at "$9" without using a calculator, you are, fundamentally, solving the equation: "x + 11 = 20, solve for x" in your head. Very basic algebra is baked into the arithmetic we are told to think of as "math" in elementary school, even though it is really just a structured way to think about numbers.

 

Sure there are much more complicated applications, but that's just detail.

 

For some, the struggle is real.  Simple subtraction is not always a problem, but the more numbers involved the more likely I am to get it wrong.  As a real life example, when rolling dice for a game I have to count each pip.  While other people look at the dice and can see "27", I'm there counting on my fingers because 8+5+7, etc just is not processing automatically in my brain (and I'm likely to get it wrong if I try). 

 

Oddly, I'm very good at looking at something, like a stereo cabinet or a table, or the distance between your mounted knights and my goblins and being able to give you exact measurements and dimensions without a ruler.  But don't ask me to calculate volume.  I know what 8oz of liquid looks like, and that it will fill that cone, but can't make sense of the numbers to prove it. 

 

 

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3 hours ago, TaleSpinner said:

Oct 16: Do you use algebra or other advanced mathematics in your life and, if so, what for?

yes

 

Budgeting, targeting, distance.

 

playing board games

filling storage space

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1 hour ago, Guindyloo said:

What if I just take the money and run?

 

Klarg1 hands $20 to @Guindyloo, and she takes off running at 3.5 m/s. Klarg1 looks at his empty wallet, and can run at up to 4 m/s. Assuming Guindy has a 5 second head start, how long will it take Klarg1 to get his money back?

 

 

 


Answer: Klarg1 turns and runs away from a Xenomorph as fast as he can, and considers $20 a cheap price to pay for his own survival!
 

 

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10 minutes ago, Doug Sundseth said:

(In some cases, I would need to have an extra penny ready, because of varying rounding algorithms.)

Ugh...rounding algorithms and sales tax. In the 90s I worked as a tech at an amusement park. One time I got called to a snack bar by the shift supervisor because a customer was going off on him and the cashier over the cash register's programming and rounding of sale tax. I still remember it vividly - we had to get out pencil, paper and a calculator and prove that we weren't ripping him off a penny.  At the time, sales tax for the area was around 7.125%.  3 cookies for a $1 came up to $1.07.  A single cookie was $0.50 cents, with tax, would come to $0.54 because of rounding. The customer's kid bought 4 cookies, for which they were charged $1.50. With tax it came to $1.61.  I guess that at first he didn't like the fact that the fourth cookie was "full" price, but then decided to double down on the math of the sales tax, because he felt he could use math to prove us wrong.  Keep in mind that this argument was AFTER the cookies were bought and paid for, and AFTER the supervisor had offered to just refund him the penny to make him go away. 

His whole premise was based upon his assumption that all sales tax calculations in CA were to be rounded down, and that we had deliberately programmed our cash registers to round up, so we could make extra money.  I literally had to run a programming report from the cash register - a fairly simple Casio cash register with about a 100 PLU capability - to prove to him that there was no setting to determine if tax was rounded up or down.  He finally took the offered penny, and stormed off, threatened to report us to the tax authorities. 

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31 minutes ago, Inarah said:

 

Oddly, I'm very good at looking at something, like a stereo cabinet or a table, or the distance between your mounted knights and my goblins and being able to give you exact measurements and dimensions without a ruler.  But don't ask me to calculate volume.  I know what 8oz of liquid looks like, and that it will fill that cone, but can't make sense of the numbers to prove it.

 

 

Experience counts for a lot.

 

37 minutes ago, Doug Sundseth said:

 

When I was a poor college student, I used to calculate the sales tax on whatever I was buying, because that 3% (Wyoming at the time) might be the difference between being able to afford what I wanted and not. Then, since I knew exactly the amount that would be required, I would count out the precise amount before the cashier was done ringing up the order. (In some cases, I would need to have an extra penny ready, because of varying rounding algorithms.)

 

Nearly always funny when you could just point at the counter after the cashier asked for "$11.18, please!"

 

::D:

 

When I was but a wee lad, sales tax in my home state was an easy-to-compute 5%. Back then, I would do this sort of thing all the time. I'll admit that the modern fractional rate is too much for me to do quickly in my head.

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I'm so glad sales tax is 5% here now.  It used to be 7.  5 is so much easier to calculate in your head... 

 

And I still amaze people when it's just memorization because multiples of 5 are eaaaasy to remember (way easier than 3)

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4 minutes ago, WhiteWulfe said:

I'm so glad sales tax is 5% here now.  It used to be 7.  5 is so much easier to calculate in your head... 

 

And I still amaze people when it's just memorization because multiples of 5 are eaaaasy to remember (way easier than 3)

 

What, it's 3, 6, 9, 10, 13, 16, 19, 20, ...

 

In base-12.

 

:B):

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4 hours ago, TaleSpinner said:

Oct 16: Do you use algebra or other advanced mathematics in your life and, if so, what for?

 

Yes and no? 

 

Not as much as I like since I haven't been doing physics stuff as much, and my branch of geology isn't currently math heavy. I have to know some math heavy theory to make sense of it, but once you prove it to yourself that it works, you don't need to use it a lot. I'm one of the geologists that isn't mystified by the instrumentation in general (some I know better than others, but I'm well equipped to sit down with the how-it-works books). Doesn't mean I'm perfect and set for operating them; just that the physics isn't scary. 

 

I did at one point use some calculus and trig to figure out how far away the horizon was based off height, because WHAT IF THERE WAS AN ARMY OF ORCS!! It wasn't a perfect calculation as we didn't take into account refraction of light, but we did take into account curvature of the Earth. 

 

Upcoming research may or may not get more math heavy. I'm kinda hoping it does, even if it means brushing the dust off. I'd like to get back into mathing. Won't be doing much wave-equation stuff. More likely to be doing pressure-temperature calculations. 

 

Arithmetic though? Give me a calculator. I *can* arithmetic. But I am a terrible klutz with it. I'd rather have all my equations use letters and no more numerals than 0, 1, 2, e, i, pi. 

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1 hour ago, Inarah said:

 

For some, the struggle is real.  Simple subtraction is not always a problem, but the more numbers involved the more likely I am to get it wrong.  As a real life example, when rolling dice for a game I have to count each pip.  While other people look at the dice and can see "27", I'm there counting on my fingers because 8+5+7, etc just is not processing automatically in my brain (and I'm likely to get it wrong if I try).

 

 

This is a really, really good point.

 

Earlier I wanted to point out that a lot of people react strongly with "I can't do math", when asked directly, but actually have much better mathematical thinking skills than they realize, because a lot of us are taught "math = calculations in my head", which is not what you'd hear from a mathematician. (See reference to papa Klarg earlier.)

 

That is not the same as saying that everybody is good at math, or that everybody functions that way. People can, and do, struggle with these things; brains don't all work the same. I don't want to put down people who's mental strengths lie elsewhere.

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