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mikem91

Bones Black Questions

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Ok, science: ON.

 

*Disclaimer: I am not a formulation or polymer chemist, nor ever will be. But I have slept at a Holiday Inn Express, so here it goes...

 

In PVC-based plastics, the polymer they use is PVC (shocker, I know.) But the actual plastic isn't solely the chemical polyvinyl chloride, it is a mixture of PVC with other chemicals that are called additives. It's the additives that alter the properties of plastics (that's generally speaking; the actual polymer used alters it to). Add certain compounds to the plastic mixture, and it can withstand higher temperatures, change the color, or how strong and flexible it is, etc. Additives called plasticizers are what make plastics flexible. PVC on it's own is pretty brittle. Add some plasticizers to it, and now it starts to become flexible, and thus more durable; PVC piping is a good example, it has enough to reduce the brittleness and to make it durable enough for construction purposes. Add even more plasticizers, and eventually you can get the flexibility of the original Bones material.

 

*Note: other additives contribute to the properties of PVC piping and Bones, I'm just focusing on plasticizers. It's late where I'm at...

 

Based on that, I think this is how the Bones material was achieved; it had a good amount of plasticizers in it. There are undoubtedly other non-plasticizer additives involved in the material contributing to it's properties; I am certain of that. If I am right on that, and if Bones Black is still PVC-based, then whoever formulated the Bones Black material probably reduced the plasticizers to eliminate the floppiness and the mold-line-scraping damage, but added other additives to enhance the detail-retention and all it's other properties.

 

Of course, if the good folks at Reaper completely changed the base polymer they are using, then my hypothesis is wrong. Isn't science fun???

 

Ok, science: OFF. Thanks for letting me share.

 

-MvM

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Reducing the plasticizers would also increase the detail retention. Stiffer plastic means sharper details but more need to have more mold parts because they don't flex as well to come out of the mold.

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Yes, it is a rather general term, but since there are many of them to encompass, the term kind of has to be broad.

 

What I know off the top of my head:

Additives can be broken down into many categories, depending on what properties you want the plastic to have,:

  • plasticizers - can make very rigid polymers softer/flexible/less brittle so they can be shaped
  • dyes/tints/pigments - changes the color, pretty straight-forward category
  • things that allow it to withstand different physical stresses, like torsion, shearing or pulling forces
  • stabilizers - you might have a base polymer that alone can't quite meet the temperatures you need. Mix the right heat stabilizer, and now it works. IT can make the plastic not burn. Or maybe the plastic needs to be used in a certain type of light, but will degrade after being exposed for X time under that wavelength. A stabilizer can solve that.
  • fillers - such a lovely named category, these can be things added to lower the final weight of the plastic (they're less dense than the polymer) without impacting the mechanical properties or reacting in any way. If you have ever done resin casting, and heard of microballoons, this is what they do. Or fillers are added to make the cost of manufacturing lower, letting the final price point be affordable.

And there are others. Each one of those categories can be broken down into specific families of chemicals. So, it's really a broad field. Do note, not every plastic will have a component from every additive category; it all depends on the application in which the plastic is going to be used. Just like how they determine which polymer they want to use (PVC, styrene, ABS, etc).

 

I did some general internet research on PVC a couple years after Bones came out, there are some good sites out there. If you want to know more, PM me and I can give you some recommendations.

 

-MvM

 

EDIT: @Cyradis just thinking about it, additives for plastics are analogous to incorporating other metals for making certain alloys, if that makes sense? Thought maybe metals might be a comfortable conveyance given your geology background. ;)

Edited by ManvsMini
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Oh yes, the alloy analogy does make sense. I think I'm more getting at the "what chemicals are in an additive that are involved in changing the properties of the original material"? 

 

This may be getting too off-topic for the thread though! 

 

<nerding> 

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Ah, yes. I had thought about including specific examples in my previous post, but was worried about hijacking the thread (assuming I haven't already). Apologies if I did.

 

If you'd like, @Cyradis I can PM you (or you PM me) and we can continue science-ing.

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Well, maybe we can start another thread that discusses the science behind our beloved minis? I once had worked up a chart that I thought would illustrate to new hobby-ers the various types of materials they can expect to see in their minis, but shelved it do to life interference. Probably still have it somewhere.

 

If the masses are interested and respond (maybe Like this post so as not to derail the thread further?), we can pursue it? I am a man of the people, after all. Give them what they want!

 

Final query: which forum would such a thread be best placed in? Off-topic? Reaper General (though it isn't exactly focused on all things Reaper...)?

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24 minutes ago, ManvsMini said:

 

Final query: which forum would such a thread be best placed in? Off-topic?

I’d say off topic.

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8 hours ago, Darsc Zacal said:

I’d say off topic.

 

Not that anything stays On topic for long around here...:ph34r:

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Oh, perfect! Solves that query. I've watched all the ReaperLive eps since the Bones Black announcement once, and am working my way through them a second time. Wonder how I missed Ed saying that...

 

My science reasoning has prevailed though! The money spent on school has finally born fruit!

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3 hours ago, ManvsMini said:

Oh, perfect! Solves that query. I've watched all the ReaperLive eps since the Bones Black announcement once, and am working my way through them a second time. Wonder how I missed Ed saying that...

 

My science reasoning has prevailed though! The money spent on school has finally born fruit!

 

Usually only happens for botanists and agriculturalists! 

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1 hour ago, Cyradis said:

 

Usually only happens for botanists and agriculturalists! 

ARRGH! That was very punny!

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Is the bones black owlbear and the other reaper bones black promotions that come with orders over $40 going to be on a limited run or will they be produced again at a later time? I missed the owl bear last January, but would love to get my hands on it.

Edited by SkywalkerPaints
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