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Beagle

Beagle's Top 10 bad/good things about Jackson's LOTR trilogy

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16 instead of ten, but let's roll with it

 

So for no good reason. Interested to hear your thoughts

 

Bad:

1. Some of the dialogue. Given that Tolkein did much of the work for them, some of the filler is poor. How many times do they focus on a character who says no more than "Yes!" or "nooooo"

2. Gondor is too weak, its soldiers are rubbish. 

3. The Army of the Dead should have been dropped after the taking of the Corsair ships. They ruined the battle of the Pelannor fields

4. Too much - we're going to die.....oh but here comes Eomer, the Eagles, Aragorn etc

5. By ROTK Aragorn, Gimli and Legolas are almost parodies of themselves, the fact that they seem invincible takes away from the seriousness and desperation of the free people's situation.

6. Time and distance. Jackson fails to relay both far too often and this is detrimental to the movies. Bree to Weathertop - a couple of hours?  Rohan - the size of a large garden? 

7. Saruman- needed to be fleshed out more.

 

Good:

1. Elves. I loved the way they realised the elves, especially the arms and armour.

2. The landscapes.

3. The Halflings. Not necessarily as I imagined them, superior to that.

4. The Rohirrim - I absolutely loved what they did with these, they looked fantastic (even though in the Ride of the Rohirrim you can clearly see some of the riders are women with beards stuck on)

5. The Music

6. Gandalf and Boromir. 

7. The Orcs. Really good that they had so much orc diversity, especially when you compare them to what the did with the CGI clones in Battle of the Five armies

8. The Nazgul

9. Casting - universally good

 

Edited by Beagle
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All very shrewd points, and well observed.

On the "Bad" score I would add the contrast been the times when the hobbits (other than Frodo) are just figures of fun and when they are depicted as minor heroes. (Although this is a fair reflection of some of Tolkien's writing.)

 

Like Beagle I was very impressed by the elves costumes and props, but not so much by the elves themselves. They look too much like the Hollywood stars they were, and not an ethereal, utterly different race of non-humans.

 But perhaps this merely proves that most Hollywood stars are, in fact, Aliens.   

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When I first saw Fellowship in the theater, there were two adolescent girls that went 'Eeeee!' every time Orlando Bloom made an appearance.

 

I... had always thought that was something that somebody had made up... :blink: (Not really complaining, mind... they were really enjoying the movie....)

 

And... I was somewhat disgruntled at the lack of the barrow wights and Tom Bombadil.

 

Other than that... I felt like it was a craftsmanly job - not a masterpiece, but obvious that he respected the work.

 

But, Lords and Ladies! How I disliked The Hobbit films.... Though I have a feeling that the studio bears most of the blame for that.

 

The Auld Grump - and the music was incredible. (Even in The Hobbit movies.)

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What I didn't like of the LotR trilogy was how Gimli was mostly a comic relief while Legolas was the "Too cool to fail" character.

 

Contrast dwarf tossing to shield surfing while shooting arrows.

Edited by Cranky Dog
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I liked the fact that the entire "Frodo and Sam walking" half of the two towers  was condensed into only the relevant bits, that entire section of the books i tend to skim read,  if i don't skip it altogether...

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I really hate how they revealed Eowyn when she picked up Meri. My favorite part in the book was when she ripped off her helmet and said "I am no man" which made the Witch Queen hesitate. The best surprise I've ever read in a book and they ruin that scene in the movie before you even get to that scene. :grr:

 

I don't like all the slow motion hobbits in pain, and too much crying hobbits.

 

But all the rest was pretty good.

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13 hours ago, paintybeard said:

Like Beagle I was very impressed by the elves costumes and props, but not so much by the elves themselves. They look too much like the Hollywood stars they were, and not an ethereal, utterly different race of non-humans.

 But perhaps this merely proves that most Hollywood stars are, in fact, Aliens.   

I'm undecided on this, on the one hand I think the elves looked as I imagined them when I first read the books, on the other I think it would have been great if they'd looked like Tom Meier elves.

11 hours ago, TheAuldGrump said:

And... I was somewhat disgruntled at the lack of the barrow wights and Tom Bombadil.

 

Other than that... I felt like it was a craftsmanly job - not a masterpiece, but obvious that he respected the work.

 

But, Lords and Ladies! How I disliked The Hobbit films.... Though I have a feeling that the studio bears most of the blame for that.

 

The Auld Grump - and the music was incredible. (Even in The Hobbit movies.)

I also wanted to see the Old Forest, the Barrow Downs and Tom, but I understand why they left them out, Tom especially. How do you explain in the film what Tom is and leave the audience without Cyrandis-style giant question marks above their heads?

 

The first Hobbit movie was palatable but I agree about the next two, both felt like a rushed mess with everyone just going through the motions. 

10 hours ago, Cranky Dog said:

What I didn't like of the LotR trilogy was how Gimli was mostly a comic relief while Legolas was the "Too cool to fail" character.

 

Yep. Made ten time worse int he Hobbit films

9 hours ago, ratsmitglied said:

I liked the fact that the entire "Frodo and Sam walking" half of the two towers  was condensed into only the relevant bits, that entire section of the books i tend to skim read,  if i don't skip it altogether...

Yep

8 hours ago, Humansquish said:

I really hate how they revealed Eowyn when she picked up Meri. My favorite part in the book was when she ripped off her helmet and said "I am no man" which made the Witch Queen hesitate. The best surprise I've ever read in a book and they ruin that scene in the movie before you even get to that scene. :grr:

 

I don't like all the slow motion hobbits in pain, and too much crying hobbits.

 

But all the rest was pretty good.

It didn't bother me too much as I thought the whole Eowyn defending Theoden scene was powerful enough....but now you mention it

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Add another who wishes we could have seen the barrowdowns and wights (Tom Bombadil less so as he doesn't really fit with the rest of the world)

 

I still haven't made it all the way through all the Hobbit trilogy though, I just find it strays to far from the Hobbit I have in my mind

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12 hours ago, Unruly said:

Good:

1 - they stopped making them.

 

Bad:

1 - they made them in the first place.

Doubly so because every single time I mention I've been to New Zealand, pretty much everyone asks "did you visit the Shire?" 

 

...Uhm,no, I didn't.  The movies weren't even being filmed when I visited... Filming started over three years later - I visited in August 1996, if I'm remembering the months correctly, and filming began (according to Wikipedia) in October of 1999... 

 

 

I do have to say though... New Zealand would probably make a horror film look gorgeous,because man, it's a gorgeous country.... ::P:  I'd love to visit again sometime, it's just the 17 hour $2k CAD (per round trip ticket) flight that causes a pause, as it means the 3-4 weeks I'd want to spend there with hubby could easily climb upwards of $10k CAD in cost...

 

Those are some nice points you've made about the series, Beagle. 

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2 hours ago, Orlando_the_Technicoloured said:

Add another who wishes we could have seen the barrowdowns and wights (Tom Bombadil less so as he doesn't really fit with the rest of the world)

 

I still haven't made it all the way through all the Hobbit trilogy though, I just find it strays to far from the Hobbit I have in my mind

 

The wife wanted to see all the Hobbit movies so I saw them in theater. Wasn't super impressed. I did watch the Tolkien edit at home and it's better IMO. They basically cut out everything not in the book.

 

I Really liked LOTR but had a few issues. Gimli and Legolas were my 2 major complaints. I loved them in the books. I didn't like Gimli becoming comic relief or Legolas' shield surfing and mumak wrangling. But my quibbles didn't ruin LOTR for me. They kind of did the Hobbit films.

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I really love the LoR films, usually, movies come now where close to whats in my imagination reading the books. 

these movies were better.  The art, architecture and music were far better than was what was in my head.

 

More good:

dropping out minor charters as Sir not appearing in this film - and adding larger parts for the women. 

fixing the pacing - putting exciting fights front and center 

Gollum. 

making Pippen and Merri actually responsible for heroic deeds before the battle of Gondor. 

- including some actual training. 

no Tom Bombadil 

 

Bad: 

Gimli - okay I agree his role should not have always been comic relief. 

No reaving of the shire - although I reread it this year and it was not as exciting as I remember, just one fight and lots of intimidation. 

- and leaving it out helped the pacing. 

the barrow wights might have been nice, but its another hobbit saved by Superhero scene. 

 

The hobbit trilogy was rubbish, a saw the second & third at a dollar theater,  which was about what they were worth. 

the cartoon was better. 

 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Zink said:

I did watch the Tolkien edit at home and it's better IMO. They basically cut out everything not in the book.

Did they cut out that stupid dwarf chase? I swear that just dragged on... irritated me to no end.

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