Jump to content

Sign in to follow this  
Madog Barfog

Question on sealing Bones (which is actually sealing paint, not Bonesium)

Recommended Posts

I've been painting for a while, and recently decided to try a Bones figure. It's the older white Bonesium, and painting it went quite well (although I did not thin my Reaper primer with water as this causes adherence issues).

 

My question is this: I've heard of people having issues with certain spray sealants (possible enamel; it could be that acrylic, which is what I use, works fine). Frankly, I don't understand the issue, as no one should be spraying anything other than primer directly on Bonesium. In other words, I'm spraying Golden Archival matte spray on top of Minwax Polyurethane floor sealer, which itself is on top of acrylic paint on top of primer and the Bonesium is buried under those layers.

 

I finished the figure a few weeks ago; no issues yet, although it could still happen. Is it possible that plasticizer or some other material may take some time to leach through these layers, and I could have problems later? Does anyone think the Minwax Polyurethane forms such a tough coat as to possibly prevent this? It could also be that the Golden product, being archival and thus meant for museum use, is also "good enough" to prevent this, although not many seem to use that particular product for sealing, so I'm not expecting a definite answer there.

 

I realize it's just one figure, so not much of a data point. I'm currently working on 2 more white Bones figures, and am keeping my fingers crossed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Madog Barfog said:

Is it possible that plasticizer or some other material may take some time to leach through these layers, and I could have problems later?

 

The short answer is "yes". It's possible. From the reports, it seems to happen only sometimes, even with exactly the same products, and can take weeks or months to develop.

 

The current suspicion is that it's the plasticizer, which might also be implicated in the hydrophobic tendency of the plastic. I've had some success reducing the plasticity of original Bones figures with isopropyl alcohol, which I think is a result of leeching some of the plasticizer out. Note that plastics (which includes most paint films) are not completely impermeable, so it would be possible for some chemicals to migrate outward over time.

 

Reaper has been reporting that Bones Black (which seems to have less plasticizer from my examinations) does not have the same problems with spray primers or hydrophobia that original Bones figures do. Because of the time problems can take to reveal themselves, I'm still taking this as unproven, but it would make sense. Time will tell on that.

  • Like 4
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

With my knowledge, theoretically you are correct: a painted figure, with all those layers of paint, should not come in contact with any harmful chemicals to the Bonesium. Spraying on your sealers should pose no problem. Again, theoretically. But one possible issue remains: how long between letting the paint cure before one applies the sealers, and how long before one layer of sealer dries before the next, and etc?

 

Acrylic paint, while it dries very quickly, can sometimes take a week or longer before it is "fully" cured (i.e. all water/additives evaporated so all the bonds between acrylic molecules are linked). If one was to finish painting their Bones mini in the morning, and then go spray seal it that afternoon, it is possible that some of the harmful chemicals in the spray propellant could penetrate through the paint and do some harm. A chink in the armor, so to speak.

 

Let's say you let your painted Bones mini sit a couple days then go spray seal it. First layer of sealer goes on well, but you want to do a second coat, so you wait the 10-15 minutes that your brand says before you recoat with the second layer. In this case, it's possible that all the nasty chemicals in the first layer of spray didn't have enough time to off-gas before the next coat of sealer gets sprayed on. Now, those solvents are stuck between layers. They have to go somewhere; they might work their way to the surface and through the second coat of sealer before it fully cures, but there is always the chance it goes the other way; down to the paint, never gets released because of the sealer, and works its way to the Bonesium and does some harm.

 

How likely are these scenarios? I can't say, because I haven't experienced them. If you follow the proper temperature/humidity/can distance requirements for your sealers, I'd say minimal for the second scenario. I wait a day between applying layers of sealers. I've never had a problem with my acrylic paint not fully curing before a sealer and I never wait a full week before sealing. I also use Krylon brand sealers, gloss and varnish, the nice big cans available at Walmart. All my Bones figures are first generation (very first Kickstarter).

 

I do prime my Bones figures though, with a brush-on primer. Gives one more layer of protection.

 

A quick bit on what Doug said regarding the plasticizers: it does take time for the plasticizers to leech out on their own. Certain factors can cause that to speed up (storing in warm temperatures, or submerging them in isopropyl alcohol). Only time can tell if that is a possible reason. If anyone has 10 years to spare, they could buy two identical bones figures, do Doug's IPA technique to leech the plasticizers out of one, then paint both the same way and let them sit...

 

Just my thoughts.

 

-MvM

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

TLDR; I scrub my Bones with a toothbrush and water. After I'm done painting I let them dry for a couple hours then hit them with spray on Testor's Dullcote and haven't ever had an issue. I've been painting Bones since they first came out.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 5/16/2019 at 6:24 PM, Madog Barfog said:

I've heard of people having issues with certain spray sealants

 

Yes I had, see thread about it here.

That said I never had problems with paint on varnishes (I use liquitex). So if you are in possession of an airbrush that might be an option.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the replies.

 

Simply because I like to overengineer, I always give 1 day each between final paint, first gloss seal, second gloss seal,  and matte finish (at least 3 days total from last paint to final sealant).

 

I like the lower cost of Bones minis, and maybe the new material will help. Until then, I suppose I can only blaze on and hope I don't have issues.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

FWIW, here's my take on start to finish, ending in the Matt sealing of recent mini's. As many of you may or may not have seen over in the WIP section (show off coming soon BTW), I did the insane project of doing 30 Mouslings (and Sir Forscale and Mr. Bones 1) in a week and a half for my son's 4th grade class to give out as gifts for his birthday celebration (because I hate giving away cheesy toys that just end up all over someone's house) link here:

https://forum.reapermini.com/index.php?/topic/86269-bones-mouslings-quite-an-assortment/

I basically washed them all in soap and water, airbrush primed with stynlrez, then threw on a basecoat (I ran out of time to get more detailed, cept for Forscale and Bones) before hitting the matt varnish from vallejo on them all. I gave the paint job a few hours till they seemed dry, then put on the varnish straight from the bottle with a size 4 golden taklon brush, and let them dry for about 4-6 hours. They went on cloudy, but were very matte when done and looked good. Not sure if that helped or what you were going for:)

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×