Members SamuraiJack Posted September 4, 2019 Members Share Posted September 4, 2019 Everything except the Saturday entries gets judged Friday night so I dont think moving it up is a problem. Get a pizza by the slice truck and we're golden 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoxe Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 1 hour ago, Clearman said: Fair point, but that follows the victim of it's own success problem too. The more vendor awards, the more entries, etc. I understand the concern about the logistics (burden of logging all the entries in, making judging happen, awards, pickup) of so many entries. I think Reaper does a stellar job of it all. I like that Reapercon is more about being inclusive, at all painting levels, and less about who's the best of the best of the best, or who's cool and who's not cool. I loved seeing the huge tables full of minis - all shapes, sizes, and skill levels - and the ballroom full of people there to celebrate everyone's accomplishments. I'd sit through the awards ceremony tomorrow if I could. 9 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marineal Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 I love the con. Every year I enjoy it a little more. My suggestions: 1. Some sort of emcee. Morning announcements or even a schedule that's projected would go a long way. 2. On that note, fix the projector. One of the best parts of getting your medal is sharing it with the whole group. Being able to put a face to an entry is super cool! And I love seeing the fun puns and names! So,yeah. 3. And I agree with the current consensus of moving awards up a bit. I would hate for the majority of people to not get their medals in front of all their friends. 4. Growtix defeated me, and the reaperpeeps at the desk weren't able to sign us up for classes. When I talked to some of the instructors later, they said they ended up having open spots that could have been filled. Having the desk at least be able to manually add people to classes would be nice. Overall, I loved the venue, I love the peeps, and we'll be back! 13 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Sundseth Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 As an instructor of one of the 5pm Saturday classes, I'll note that moving the awards ceremony significantly forward will probably cut out 10 class slots. And given the complaints from people not able to get into classes, I'd say that's probably a non-starter. I would at least consider, in changing the ticketing system, a significant revamp of the way that class tickets are sold: I would like to see Dutch auction pricing on class tickets. Start the prices higher than anyone is willing to pay, then drop them day by day until all the seats sell or some minimum price is reached. This would let those people who really, absolutely, positively must have (insert class here), the chance to pay for the class. With this, I would further kick back some part of the premium above whatever the minimum price is to the instructor to increase the incentive for those popular instructors to teach more classes. (Econ 101: What you pay for, you get more of.) I think that failing that, there should be a limit on both the number of classes purchased per membership per day and probably on the total number of classes per con ticket sold. If you really care about some class, buy it on the first day as your only purchase for the day. Then you can pick a second class on the second day from the remaining classes. (I know the tricks for getting the classes I want on Day 1; most people don't. The people who know fill the high-demand classes.) And of course there absolutely must be some better way to sell tickets than to put the tickets into a cart, navigate a Byzantine path to get to the checkout, then find out that 2/3 of the classes have no tickets. Given the demand, a prominently noted five minute limit (or whatever) on the time a class ticket can be in the cart would be very useful. (In fact a count-down timer would be even better but would require trickier coding.) 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanael Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 I wasn't there this year, but I know the awards ceremony has felt long even in much less-attended years. I wonder if a solution might be to simply call the names of people winning certificates, bronze and maybe even silver medals during the ceremony, but actually hand out medals when someone picks up their entries. Manufacturer awards, Reaper trophies and BiS awards would be handed out as usual. This would significantly reduce time during the ceremony spent waiting for people to collect medals. On the flip side, it would make entry collection by participants on Saturday night/Sunday harder, and there would need to be some kind of security in place to ensure nobody claims to be someone they aren't, but I feel like another one or two volunteers grabbing medals, and a photo of the entrant as well as their entries, could take care of those issues. Just spitballing, feel free to tear the suggestion apart if I'm missing something obvious! 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Guindyloo Posted September 4, 2019 Moderator Share Posted September 4, 2019 38 minutes ago, Doug Sundseth said: As an instructor of one of the 5pm Saturday classes, I'll note that moving the awards ceremony significantly forward will probably cut out 10 class slots. And given the complaints from people not able to get into classes, I'd say that's probably a non-starter. I disagree. As noted earlier in the thread or in another thread, there are meeting rooms not even being used by Reapercon that could be rented out and used and thus the affected Saturday classes could be moved to the other con days. I think that any solution that involves people not getting their awards during the awards ceremony because they’ve been deemed not important enough to be received publicly goes against the spirit of the MSP Open. IMO that would send a pretty clear message that certificate and Bronze awards don’t matter under such a system (which I don’t agree with) and then what is the point of having an open judging system at all? Better to shake up scheduling than fundamentally change the competition. 10 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heisler Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 I don’t have time for a full reply right now, but Reaper will have all the space for 2020. 7 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Sundseth Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 2 minutes ago, Guindyloo said: I disagree. As noted earlier in the thread or in another thread, there are meeting rooms not even being used by Reapercon that could be rented out and used and thus the affected Saturday classes could be moved to the other con days. I stand by my statement that removing a class slot on Saturday evening is a bad idea as long as there are teachers willing to teach then. And moving the ceremony forward will do just that. 2 minutes ago, Guindyloo said: I think that any solution that involves people not getting their awards during the awards ceremony because they’ve been deemed not important enough to be received publicly goes against the spirit of the MSP Open. IMO that would send a pretty clear message that certificate and Bronze awards don’t matter under such a system (which I don’t agree with) and then what is the point of having an open judging system at all? Better to shake up scheduling than fundamentally change the competition. But I absolutely agree with this. Medal-system judging is intended to reward the pieces that are entered, and in the MSP Open, a major part of that is being called up to the front of the "class" for recognition. I would absolutely oppose not publicly recognizing Bronze and CoM winners. (Cheryl's response to getting a bronze that she really worked hard for was heartwarming.) I would much rather keep the ceremony where it is and accept that it will run as late as it runs. And if that's a serious problem for some part of the contestants, it's not like you need to be there to pick up your award. You can get it the next day when you pick up your mini. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jubilee Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 7 hours ago, LordDave said: Also, before we head down a wromg path, kudos for the 3 folks that managed to inprocess nearly 1000 entries in like 10 hours. we must not forget how fast the line was moving. entering in all those entries must have been tough. There were four of us :). Intake, explanation/swag/organization, photos, and processing. It was probably the least relaxing vacation I've had in a long time... The VIP line was definitely a problem but I think the unexpected uptick in entries (almost double) and entrants (200 to 340) made it even worse as an experiment than it otherwise would have been. We were not expecting to have basically non-stop entries on Thursday (with a brief slow down around 3) and no break on Friday. By the time we both realized how much of a problem it was, many people had been waiting far too long, but we changed it to keep everyone moving more reasonably after that. We were so overwhelmed with the crush that it took a while for us to realize that was going on! We've come up with several ideas for improvements next year, but we're not sure what's going to be reasonable to implement. 6 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanael Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 1 hour ago, Guindyloo said: I think that any solution that involves people not getting their awards during the awards ceremony because they’ve been deemed not important enough to be received publicly goes against the spirit of the MSP Open. IMO that would send a pretty clear message that certificate and Bronze awards don’t matter under such a system That's fair, I hadn't thought about it that way. I wasn't really intending to imply that bronze/certs are unimportant (although I've won silvers and believe I'm capable of gold, I think of myself as a firmly bronze painter, and most of what I've earned have been bronzes), but they are the largest contingent of entrants, so lumping them into a group would save time while still seeing their names announced during the ceremony. But you're right that it would reduce the impact of walking across the stage, and you're right that that would reduce some of the family aspect I've always enjoyed about Reapercon. Hmm. People-wrangling is hard. I also agree with Doug that moving the ceremony too much earlier could be a problem, as classes and gaming events are a major part of the value of the con. Even if classes can go on during the ceremony, it forces the decision of attending a class or going to the ceremony (and given what I've been seeing about growtix and published schedules for this year, it sounds like many people wouldn't even be aware it was a choice... Which inevitably means they'll be upset about missing out on one or the other). And just cancelling classes for that time slot makes the official Saturday that much shorter for at least a few attendees who don't want to attend the ceremony, which reduces the value of their pass. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jubilee Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 3 hours ago, SamuraiJack said: Everything except the Saturday entries gets judged Friday night so I dont think moving it up is a problem. Get a pizza by the slice truck and we're golden We don't do special awards or manufacture awards judging on Friday as it would make it way too late for us. It still takes most of the time from 12pm to 7pm to judge Saturday entries, reaper special awards, organize the various special awards, corral the various judges (including non reaper folks) for the special awards, print judging sheets, input the special awards, QC the data, count/tally the best in show votes, and enter those numbers. We also have to move and stage the awards, print sheets for Anne, print the certificates, get them signed, and this year we also had to design and print the bronze vouchers.. Kit was also doing something to make sure the slide show was in the right order for the various awards, but I'm not sure if that's just because we decided to change from the usual order or if it was because he had done a redesign on the system or if that is just something that he always has to do. 5 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradoxical Mouse Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 Personally, having gotten one this year, I wish the certificates of merit weren't expected to be picked up during the ceremony. I felt embarrassed walking up there to collect mine. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator LordDave Posted September 5, 2019 Moderator Share Posted September 5, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, Paradoxical Mouse said: Personally, having gotten one this year, I wish the certificates of merit weren't expected to be picked up during the ceremony. I felt embarrassed walking up there to collect mine. While I can understand where you're coming from, sometimes a certificate is great. Example would be someone who has never entered a competition. obviously we should celebrate that certificate with them. That person would be proud to get it. It also could be a certificate for some new skill attempted. I entered the Open division for the first time. I am not great at sculpting and was semi expecting a certificate. I barely managed a bronze. No one (at least no one I call a friend) thought any less of you for getting a certificate. Its nice to see your work and to see you honored in anyway. Having seen your work before, Id bet you just barely missed the bronze. Take the certificate with pride, use that as a building block and motivational piece to challenge bronze or silver next year. Then you can say, I have improved in this area or that. My goal for next year's Open is a strong bronze. But should I get a certificate, I will say, "let me point in a different direction" be proud of yourself in all cases. Edited September 5, 2019 by LordDave 12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Chaoswolf Posted September 5, 2019 Moderator Share Posted September 5, 2019 12 hours ago, Guindyloo said: I disagree. As noted earlier in the thread or in another thread, there are meeting rooms not even being used by Reapercon that could be rented out and used and thus the affected Saturday classes could be moved to the other con days. I think that any solution that involves people not getting their awards during the awards ceremony because they’ve been deemed not important enough to be received publicly goes against the spirit of the MSP Open. IMO that would send a pretty clear message that certificate and Bronze awards don’t matter under such a system (which I don’t agree with) and then what is the point of having an open judging system at all? Better to shake up scheduling than fundamentally change the competition. Absolutely agree. Regarding the cancel a class/start it earlier debate: there is absolutely no reason why the award ceremony can't be started earlier. According to the program the award ceremony started at 8 pm (tangent: did it actually start on time? I don't remember...), classes run from 5 pm to 7 pm. There's a whole hour right there that could be utilized without needing to cancel anything. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGP Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 17 minutes ago, Chaoswolf said: classes run from 5 pm to 7 pm. There's a whole hour right there that could be utilized without needing to cancel anything. Some of you need food in that one hour window... ...from 7 to 8. It did start on time. I had entered nothing and did not stay. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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