Jump to content

Bones 5 dragon sizing vs Wizkids (updated pics of Arveiaturace in todays reply, with scale vs some bones/gw, etc ))


Recommended Posts

On 8/7/2020 at 6:04 PM, ksbsnowowl said:

The bases are 3", but the dragons are vastly oversized for that 3" base.  They are easily Gargantuan compared to previous offerings by other companies.  I posed a photoshop comparison with the Huge Red Dragon figure from the Wrath of Ashardalon game a month or two ago.  Trust me, the dragons are bigger than Huge.

 

Here, I hunted down the pic again.  Both of these Red Dragons are on 3" bases, FYI.

 

446124036_KalanzarvsAshardalon3.jpg.9cd1d9142b53b0171a791ccef70244ce.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

is that true though?  why wouldnt it be huge if the base determines that?

 

Wizkids, who does the official D&D models (in line with the models from GF9 that are also official) have a line of dragons coming, starting in dec/jan, that they said are their new gargantuan dragons and described them as properly sized or something .    

Here's a pic of the first, the white:

 

https://www.enworld.org/attachments/f53d5c97-bd1f-4dc4-b29c-ba25bced7bcd-jpeg.123086/

 

Maker: Wizkids / Wizards of the Coast
Brand: Icons of the Realms
Set: Gargantuan White Dragon, Arveiaturace
Date Released: Jan 2021

 

really like the greek set. so nice!!

 

regards,


Sanjay

Edited by StarFyre
  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 39
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

Cornering issues with flanking.   Rather than change the flanking rules... they made the dragons smaller.       Yeah, I'll take the WizKids version....  

Yeah that’s a 1” gridded chessex mat, and the mini’s are on 1” round bases.    (Chessex does make 1.5” gridded mats, so you need the combo with the 1” round bases to ensure it’s a 1” gridded ma

Wizards had decided not to HAVE dragons bigger than Huge with later 4e.   I never understood why, the Gargantuan dragons they had prepainted for the tail end of 3e sold okay, and the Gargant

Posted Images

I like that those dragons fit a 3 inch base, even though they seem a bit big for it. Means I can use them as adult or ancient dragons as I see fit. Adult dragons are probably going to see more game time, but for the bigger ones I can just find a nifty base solution.

I usually oversell the size of my dragons in RP anyway, so I'm okay with super big adult dragons.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, StarFyre said:

 

is that true though?  why wouldnt it be huge if the base determines that?

 

Not even WizKids follows the rules of base diameter determines game rules size. 
 

And Reaper sells 100mm black bases... which is my plan. 
 

Regardless of the base size on the model, the more important issue for me is the relative scale to other models. Kalanzar is noticeably and sufficiently larger than known Huge sculpts that he looks right as a gargantuan. 
 

I've seen and examined all the available photos of the new WizKids dragons coming out. They are purposely over sizing them compared to what they’ve produced over the last several years. There is an “Adult” White Dragon coming out in the fall which is on a 4” base that has a 3” ring painted on it, because it is supposed to be “Huge.” They are over-sizing the base for stability. I’ve done similar photoshop comparisons with the old Hasbro gargantuan white dragon, Icingdeath, and it is smaller in scale than Icingdeath. 
 

The “Gargantuan” white dragon they are releasing in December is MASSIVE, and doesn’t comport to any previous sense of scale in official D&D miniatures. It appears to be as big as the old Colossal Red Dragon (which was itself oversized, being on an 8” base, rather than a 6” base). But it’s also going to be $120, IIRC.

 

All that to say, Kalanzar and his ilk can easily be used as Huge or Gargantuan, depending on the end user’s desires, and the relative scale of their other miniatures. 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, ksbsnowowl said:

Not even WizKids follows the rules of base diameter determines game rules size. 
 

And Reaper sells 100mm black bases... which is my plan. 
 

Regardless of the base size on the model, the more important issue for me is the relative scale to other models. Kalanzar is noticeably and sufficiently larger than known Huge sculpts that he looks right as a gargantuan. 
 

I've seen and examined all the available photos of the new WizKids dragons coming out. They are purposely over sizing them compared to what they’ve produced over the last several years. There is an “Adult” White Dragon coming out in the fall which is on a 4” base that has a 3” ring painted on it, because it is supposed to be “Huge.” They are over-sizing the base for stability. I’ve done similar photoshop comparisons with the old Hasbro gargantuan white dragon, Icingdeath, and it is smaller in scale than Icingdeath. 
 

The “Gargantuan” white dragon they are releasing in December is MASSIVE, and doesn’t comport to any previous sense of scale in official D&D miniatures. It appears to be as big as the old Colossal Red Dragon (which was itself oversized, being on an 8” base, rather than a 6” base). But it’s also going to be $120, IIRC.

 

All that to say, Kalanzar and his ilk can easily be used as Huge or Gargantuan, depending on the end user’s desires, and the relative scale of their other miniatures. 

 

Similiar to the "young" dragons in the Nolzur's lineup. They are based on Huge bases for stability. I've always liked bigger dragons anyways, so bigger dragons are always nice. 

 

Thanks to everyone that has posted about those big dragons from Wizkids. I'll probably pre-order those through my shop.

 

Alt view of garg. white dragon:

 

Spoiler

wizkids-nolzurs-marvelous-miniatures-arv

 

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for finding and posting a pic. He’s a BIG boy. If I can swing it, I’ll get him, but I don’t plan to get the flying “Huge” adult white. I have Icingdeath, and I’d just use it as another Gargantuan White. 
 

The upcoming massive one you posted will work great as a colossal white (3rd ed allows for colossal whites in the Epic Level Handbook).

Link to post
Share on other sites

The expressions of my players when plunk down a huge dragon is worth the cost of them. I don't use allot of dragons, thou I've used more with my games at the FLGS then I did in my previous years as a DM/GM.

 

 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, I ran the original 3.0 adventure path modules, and when we reached the climax two years ago, and I brought out that colossal red dragon to represent Ashardalon (who was a half-fiend great wyrm), my players’ reactions were worth the considerable cost. I’d hid the fact I’d bought it a year earlier, in preparation for that moment. 
 

I think these Bones 5 dragons fill a needed niche in the market (granted, Reaper has other, similarly representative dragon models). Yes, there are huge and gargantuan prepainted models, but they are always rare, and are very expensive to acquire. And these Bones 5 sculpts are generally pretty darn good. 

7 minutes ago, Sirithiliel said:

$120? Never mind, I will pass lol. Not worth it for a cool pose

 

The Huge/Gargantuan one next month is $60, IIRC. And keep in mind that the colossal red was $75, what? Thirteen years ago?  The fact they are doing something on a similar scale, and the price has only increased 60% in the intervening years is actually surprising. I would have expected it to be more.  

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, ksbsnowowl said:

 

The Huge/Gargantuan one next month is $60, IIRC. And keep in mind that the colossal red was $75, what? Thirteen years ago?  The fact they are doing something on a similar scale, and the price has only increased 60% in the intervening years is actually surprising. I would have expected it to be more.  

 

Indeed but on a limited hobby budget, something that expensive is a immediate no

 

$60 isn't as bad, hm

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

TBH, I wish the Bones 4 dragons actually fit into a 3" base. Sure, they stand on 3" bases, but they're clearly gargantuan dragons, not huge dragons. I have a full assortment of gargantuan and colossal dragons as Pathfinder assigns them, and all the Larges from my DDM days, but I lack Huge dragons for Red, White, and Blue dragons, and my Black hs a sorcerer riding him, so I was really hoping these dragons could pass as huges.

 

I'm currently hoping the dragons in the Core will work for huges comparable to the "Pathfinder Red" that I painted up as a green many years ago.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, ksbsnowowl said:

Not even WizKids follows the rules of base diameter determines game rules size. 
 

And Reaper sells 100mm black bases... which is my plan. 
 

Regardless of the base size on the model, the more important issue for me is the relative scale to other models. Kalanzar is noticeably and sufficiently larger than known Huge sculpts that he looks right as a gargantuan. 
 

I've seen and examined all the available photos of the new WizKids dragons coming out. They are purposely over sizing them compared to what they’ve produced over the last several years. There is an “Adult” White Dragon coming out in the fall which is on a 4” base that has a 3” ring painted on it, because it is supposed to be “Huge.” They are over-sizing the base for stability. I’ve done similar photoshop comparisons with the old Hasbro gargantuan white dragon, Icingdeath, and it is smaller in scale than Icingdeath. 
 

The “Gargantuan” white dragon they are releasing in December is MASSIVE, and doesn’t comport to any previous sense of scale in official D&D miniatures. It appears to be as big as the old Colossal Red Dragon (which was itself oversized, being on an 8” base, rather than a 6” base). But it’s also going to be $120, IIRC.

 

All that to say, Kalanzar and his ilk can easily be used as Huge or Gargantuan, depending on the end user’s desires, and the relative scale of their other miniatures. 

Wizards had decided not to HAVE dragons bigger than Huge with later 4e.

 

I never understood why, the Gargantuan dragons they had prepainted for the tail end of 3e sold okay, and the Gargantuan Blue sold through several times.

 

Sometimes it almost seemed like they were TRYING to cripple their sales, in everything.

 

Rules, novels, and minis, if it made them money, they did something to make sure it wouldn't. Even their online support, when they drove their character generator into a tunnel painted on a rock. Hey, we're taking away offline use, but to make up for it we're taking away a lot of other features too!

 

WizKids, on the other hand... Thems some nice minis!

1 minute ago, Disciple of Sakura said:

TBH, I wish the Bones 4 dragons actually fit into a 3" base. Sure, they stand on 3" bases, but they're clearly gargantuan dragons, not huge dragons. I have a full assortment of gargantuan and colossal dragons as Pathfinder assigns them, and all the Larges from my DDM days, but I lack Huge dragons for Red, White, and Blue dragons, and my Black hs a sorcerer riding him, so I was really hoping these dragons could pass as huges.

 

I'm currently hoping the dragons in the Core will work for huges comparable to the "Pathfinder Red" that I painted up as a green many years ago.

Diagonal on square bases works fine for us. ::):

 

We wargame, and square is our norm, in more ways than one!

 

I have been waiting to use that pun. ::P:

 

And I hate the 4e Huge Green with his pointy nose.

 

I see that Wizards has officially buried that look, and is pretending it never happened.

  • Like 4
Link to post
Share on other sites

 

7 hours ago, PaganMegan said:

And I hate the 4e Huge Green with his pointy nose.

 

I see that Wizards has officially buried that look, and is pretending it never happened.

 

Every time I sneeze, I get a panicked flashback..  I'm honestly not sure that should be purple, bu-ut...

  • Like 1
  • Haha 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, ksbsnowowl said:

The “Gargantuan” white dragon they are releasing in December is MASSIVE, and doesn’t comport to any previous sense of scale in official D&D miniatures. It appears to be as big as the old Colossal Red Dragon (which was itself oversized, being on an 8” base, rather than a 6” base). But it’s also going to be $120, IIRC.

 

hey, checked the wording in the D&D live video just now. I guess since 5e doesnt have colossal as a standard size category im told, these are meant to be the upper range of gargantuan maybe?

 

for 3e, maybe they would be at the start of colossal. in 2e, adults (2e dragons are much larger). I still use the 2e sizing, so i put a miniature on a larger cardboard board according to size i need and say "it looks kinda like that, but the players know the 'counter' its on is the size range).   

 

Back to wizkids, what the 2 folks presenting the massive white dragon said was, one of them asked the other a year or so ago that please make definitive dragons, so they decided to do this line of bigger ones. 

 

is the colossal red too big? IIRC, 3e dragons were in the 120-150 ft range for non epic dragons.  If you use the older standard GW bases, the 1 inch square base was basically a 5 ft square. 2 inch base (what they called large base) was 10 ft square equivalent.  So you're looking at 12 to 15 large GW bases long. the red is 14 inches tall, if it was out stretched out it would probably be around 24-26 inches i think due to the tail? so that would be about right. 

 

sadly, im having trouble estimating the size of the white. some pics have a d20 but for some reason it feels like its larger than my d20s.  not sure. this image im attaching has scale to a medium wizkids figure but i dont know the size of those so not sure.  I'm estimating 12-16 inches long somewhere. (if anyone can give a better range, it would be appreciated for a better estimate).  im already planning to strip it and basing it (initially it will be a prepaint but the post on FB indicates the wizkids CEO said unpainted ones may come after based on how they sell initially and demand, etc)

 

f53d5c97-bd1f-4dc4-b29c-ba25bced7bcd-jpe


white dragon scale.jpg

117595884_3179590855451391_5169552602422995680_o.jpg

 

Like, how wide are those round bases for the prepaint figures? 0.75 inch diameter?  1 inch?

 

regards,

 

sanjay

Edited by StarFyre
  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Similar Content

    • By Orlando_the_Technicoloured
      Dungeons & Lasers Second Edition prelaunch page

      https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/archonstudio/dungeons-and-lasers-second-edition/









      -The 2nd campaign will offer products from the 1st campaign as well (called Legacy Products) with an option for shipping within a month from the end of 2nd ed Kickstarter. So ultra-fast, in the scale of Kickstarter, delivery.

      - 6 YES! that's 6 Dragons as a single pack or to buy individually, or as a free stretch goal with your terrain pledge! Please give us feedback in the questionnaire about prices! Link to the questionnaire at the bottom of the update.


      Here are 4 dragons out of 6! and yes that DnD miniature is in scale (28mm). More pictures below.
      Currently, we have only planned to make fantasy themed dragons! Please convince us in the comments to make one in a Sci-Fi theme (please! I need good arguments to convince the boss!)

      -optional half-walls - we are making, as we speak (see video), 1st test tool for half-walls, this was requested by you in the post-KS questionnaire. Half-walls will be an OPTIONAL buy (or selected in the pledge manager instead of 50mm ones, we are still working on it). Cost of it - as it will be optional we will make it as close to manufacturing costs as legally possible!

      - as requested, we will be also making a large tool with end-half-clips, available to purchase for manufacturing cost / or will be part of a stretch goal, no only that we have some ideas for clips supporting next tier (more to come in next updates), this option will allow you to build easily several dungeon levels.

      - 3 more themes, 2 fantasy Dwarven Mine, Cursed Cathedral, and Temple of the Operators. )and POSSIBLY MORE?








      - All new stretch goals! We are aiming to DOUBLE the number of stretch goals to 1st DnL Kickstarter! Yes, twice more!



      - Pre-launch Stretch goals! : For the first time, we are introducing Pre-Launch Stretch Goals. The more folks subscribe to our Pre-Page on Kickstarter, LINK: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/archonstudio/dungeons-and-lasers-second-edition the more free items we are adding to the pledges! Head on to our KS page and click "subscribe"! Make sure your friends know about and share the link: archon-studio.com/dnl2



      We want to make as the best deal for backers as possible, thus, we need your feedback and support about DnL 2.0 here is the link to the new questionnaire:

      https://archon-studio.com/content/dungeons-lasers-second-edition-early-survey

      You will find more information on our blog here: https://archon-studio.com/blog/dungeons-lasers-second-edition




      they did the rapid delivery of existing stuff for their previous terrain KS and it worked well, and came in on time, and their plastic is pretty good so if you like the look of it well worth considering

      also do sign up for KS notification as that's going to help backers get more stuff!
       
    • By MoonglowMinis
      Buckle in folks, I've got a lot for you today.  Over the past year or so I've slowly collected and painted a set of the five Chromatic Dragons.  When I first started collecting minis I'd picked up a couple of Dragons from Safari Ltd which were easy to find at craft stores.  Rather than buy a bunch of new models from Reaper or elsewhere, I decided to see if I could make a unique set of Dragons using mostly Safari Ltd models.  I flipped through my Monster Manual and browsed online catalogs and slowly picked out models that I wanted to use to represent each of them.  I eventually ran out of models that I liked and I supplemented a McFarlane Toys dragon for the Red.  I finally completed them early this past summer:
       

       
      The White Dragon

       
      Read on for More:
       
      The Black Dragon
      Moving up the Chromatic Hierarchy, we have the Black Dragon, represented here by the Safari Ltd. Cave Dragon.  This is actually the model that inspired me to paint up the dragons, as it looked so much like the 5E Black Dragon artwork.

       
      Read on for More:
       
      The Green Dragon
      Next up, we have the Green Dragon represented by the Safari Ltd. Twilight Dragon.  Funnily enough, that sculpt is also available in a green variant as the "Forest Dragon," but i already had the black copy on hand.  It was all getting painted over anyways.

       
      Read on for More:
       
      The Blue Dragon
      The last of the Safari Ltd. Dragons, this is the Fog Dragon, which got a tiny bit of green stuff to look the part of a Blue Dragon.

       
      Read on for More:
       
      The Red Dragon
      I used up the biggest Safari Ltd Dragon with the blue, and I wasn't seeing anything I liked from any of their direct competitors, so I chose something a little different for the Red.  I ended up with the Komodo Clan dragon from McFarlane Toys Dragons Series 2.  And though this guy showed up in shades of red, I wanted to paint it myself, so it got primed and re-painted.

       
      Read on for More:
       
      It was a lot of fun painting up these guys, and I like having a unique collection.  I'm also glad they're all done.  Though I do still have a Shadow Dragon and a Dracolich primed and waiting for paint... and then all the dragons that are still boxed... and then that big five-headed guy I keep meaning to get around to... and then all those new dragons coming with Bones 5...
       
      Which dragon do you like best?
    • By BrokenWolf668
      So this is fun, because I can show you folks the Christmas presents I'm working on, so it's like I get to give them twice. Anyway, here's my take on her, really enjoyed going for a winter feel.


    • By Axolotegaming
      We just launched our campaign for awesome gargantuan dragons, they are 20 cm high, they will look huge compared to 32mm miniatures, the design of every dragon is also unique and different. 
       
      https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/dracostudios/dragons-of-the-red-moon
       
      We hope you can join us on this draconic adventure!
       

       
    • By wickedshifty
      I finished up a year long project recently. Started with white, then blue, then green, then black then finally red...
       
      its been a while journey with these dragons..

       


       




  • Who's Online   6 Members, 1 Anonymous, 33 Guests (See full list)


×
×
  • Create New...