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Took advantage of a 50% sale on MMF to get these from AVG,

Lesson learned.

 

If you like at least a few of a monthly set, just take the Patreon, even on sale for 50% off, the Patreon was a better deal.

Oh well.

I got these, wanted them to join my other Bears and some..

 

1077868898_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14162931.jpg.077227047cbb400a95738db2ac7767ca.jpg1340946030_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14162941.jpg.e097e66ec36b546c8b7062d0f0419fea.jpg915706261_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14162949.jpg.b8c4bbfcb0a314d92d760a1c9b091f5e.jpg1527442470_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14162959.jpg.2c5d0c508174c91314da074fe843b5cf.jpg138378901_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14163022.jpg.dd40e992d591b241608a10032a679ea9.jpg399958154_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14163042.thumb.jpg.483f6d50683f19ffc95dc7413fec0b74.jpg283323232_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14163053.jpg.596ac50f83e9d81798ba45295ee8828b.jpg1108484895_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14163103.jpg.56d82a01839e9b0e8a49ea0d63f90dce.jpg1442348806_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14163115.jpg.265e20b3abee0e6b389b6ecb5c93704a.jpg1948026686_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14163125.jpg.cf6d9fa0951c6f82a2bfa6cdc402ee24.jpg1011508596_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14163134.jpg.4fa798d4974c7a8bbd926b9f78c42efb.jpg

 

 

Also Ghamak's Set for May:

300139361_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183129.jpg.74cf18fa402c83d88759bd6c43754d79.jpg1597331642_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183146.thumb.jpg.76e61803310ac8577802771323c90992.jpg1632712601_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183157.thumb.jpg.0f0a5f09b3eb9865d433e626a3a683a9.jpg1406079480_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183209.thumb.jpg.0513dcfc5d265d0c32023c091f211e3c.jpg1606000100_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183220.thumb.jpg.63c47c62982776898fa42d099c49ea09.jpg1931270313_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183231.thumb.jpg.1b6167d84495d40f96b093e358d98d73.jpg1809847819_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183241.thumb.jpg.26728e4eb88e0cf3f5f7316668435afd.jpg494280217_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183251.thumb.jpg.999e931133bbaedaa15fac98606ac34d.jpg1038357905_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183301.thumb.jpg.cfd95be0132689a564401fa8d489e5c4.jpg1076444299_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183310.thumb.jpg.8f7d3ff00dad8efe2c0c0cb123d1f22b.jpg771007883_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183321.thumb.jpg.22330d69269e14dbc1e0bffde2f38ef4.jpg932808737_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183331.thumb.jpg.811828890c60f09f9afd6f7b247a7340.jpg76577748_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183339.thumb.jpg.82675deea29383501caed566b84c1146.jpg1477930649_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183348.thumb.jpg.9bdb7225153bc5962d04746a912b0194.jpg1800657681_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183358.thumb.jpg.9062212ad51f05516003876d44dfb251.jpg37072146_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183408.thumb.jpg.aac8cd5fa3e91b46c283f11db320e58d.jpg216292389_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183418.thumb.jpg.a83ea55e96e8565b85c58282e46c86a1.jpg283923913_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183443.thumb.jpg.f09b4926c5b390aedce70818bc80f021.jpg

 

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2 hours ago, Glitterwolf said:

Took advantage of a 50% sale on MMF to get these from AVG,

Lesson learned.

 

If you like at least a few of a monthly set, just take the Patreon, even on sale for 50% off, the Patreon was a better deal.

Oh well.

I got these, wanted them to join my other Bears and some..

 

1077868898_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14162931.jpg.077227047cbb400a95738db2ac7767ca.jpg1340946030_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14162941.jpg.e097e66ec36b546c8b7062d0f0419fea.jpg915706261_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14162949.jpg.b8c4bbfcb0a314d92d760a1c9b091f5e.jpg1527442470_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14162959.jpg.2c5d0c508174c91314da074fe843b5cf.jpg138378901_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14163022.jpg.dd40e992d591b241608a10032a679ea9.jpg399958154_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14163042.thumb.jpg.483f6d50683f19ffc95dc7413fec0b74.jpg283323232_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14163053.jpg.596ac50f83e9d81798ba45295ee8828b.jpg1108484895_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14163103.jpg.56d82a01839e9b0e8a49ea0d63f90dce.jpg1442348806_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14163115.jpg.265e20b3abee0e6b389b6ecb5c93704a.jpg1948026686_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14163125.jpg.cf6d9fa0951c6f82a2bfa6cdc402ee24.jpg1011508596_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14163134.jpg.4fa798d4974c7a8bbd926b9f78c42efb.jpg

 

 

Also Ghamak's Set for May:

300139361_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183129.jpg.74cf18fa402c83d88759bd6c43754d79.jpg1597331642_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183146.thumb.jpg.76e61803310ac8577802771323c90992.jpg1632712601_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183157.thumb.jpg.0f0a5f09b3eb9865d433e626a3a683a9.jpg1406079480_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183209.thumb.jpg.0513dcfc5d265d0c32023c091f211e3c.jpg1606000100_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183220.thumb.jpg.63c47c62982776898fa42d099c49ea09.jpg1931270313_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183231.thumb.jpg.1b6167d84495d40f96b093e358d98d73.jpg1809847819_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183241.thumb.jpg.26728e4eb88e0cf3f5f7316668435afd.jpg494280217_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183251.thumb.jpg.999e931133bbaedaa15fac98606ac34d.jpg1038357905_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183301.thumb.jpg.cfd95be0132689a564401fa8d489e5c4.jpg1076444299_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183310.thumb.jpg.8f7d3ff00dad8efe2c0c0cb123d1f22b.jpg771007883_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183321.thumb.jpg.22330d69269e14dbc1e0bffde2f38ef4.jpg932808737_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183331.thumb.jpg.811828890c60f09f9afd6f7b247a7340.jpg76577748_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183339.thumb.jpg.82675deea29383501caed566b84c1146.jpg1477930649_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183348.thumb.jpg.9bdb7225153bc5962d04746a912b0194.jpg1800657681_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183358.thumb.jpg.9062212ad51f05516003876d44dfb251.jpg37072146_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183408.thumb.jpg.aac8cd5fa3e91b46c283f11db320e58d.jpg216292389_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183418.thumb.jpg.a83ea55e96e8565b85c58282e46c86a1.jpg283923913_Schermafbeelding2022-05-14183443.thumb.jpg.f09b4926c5b390aedce70818bc80f021.jpg

 

The aftermarket prices post Patreon are not going to convince me to support all patreons I may think have an interesting sculpt.

 

I just stop buying.

 

Either those post Patreon prices will come down or they'll go unbought by me.

 

I've supported enough Patreons long enough that it's highly doubtful I'll ever print everything I already have a stl for.

 

I appreciate that there's some fantastic art and style coming out of these but the prices are just not worth it IMO.  I hope that they are doing SOME sort of post Patreon business because if too many other customers are like me, well, you might as well NOT sell them after your monthly Patreon.

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The reason they're on the MMF store at all is to entice new Patrons. 

It also means they can 'reward' their Patrons wih 50% off codes so they can buy those .STLs they missed before they joined.   

 

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8 hours ago, Gadgetman! said:

The reason they're on the MMF store at all is to entice new Patrons. 

It also means they can 'reward' their Patrons wih 50% off codes so they can buy those .STLs they missed before they joined.   

 

Some do it right IMO.  Like One Page Rules when they do their 70% off or companies who aren't charging more for a single model than a month's worth on the Patreon.

 

Like I said, maybe I"m an outlier but I'm not paying more for a single model than a month's worth of releases that I didn't support.

 

We'll see if more supply drives down the prices as there are quite a few Patreons/Tribes out there.

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That Ghamak undead scribe gave me an idea for an adventure.

 

Tempted to make a WHOLE BUNCH of undead copyists.

 

Yes, the lich is EVIL, but mostly he is BUSY.

 

And doesn't know from printing presses.

 

NOT Blood of Vol, but they WILL try to recruit him, in my Eberron game.

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Posted (edited)

Or he's a GM working on his campaign. ::P:

On 5/15/2022 at 2:06 PM, JoeGKushner said:

Some do it right IMO.  Like One Page Rules when they do their 70% off or companies who aren't charging more for a single model than a month's worth on the Patreon.

 

Like I said, maybe I"m an outlier but I'm not paying more for a single model than a month's worth of releases that I didn't support.

 

We'll see if more supply drives down the prices as there are quite a few Patreons/Tribes out there.

Not likely.

 

Most of those Patreons will just go out of business.

 

I am willing to pay an artist for their work, I've BEEN the artist that didn't get paid.

 

If the model looks like it is worth more than the Patreon I will join the Patreon.

 

Letting go of the Patreon is harder when the next month ALSO looks good.

 

We joined Ghamak for a month, three months ago. Both tiers, because cowboy orks and creepy undead.

 

Addiction? Why do you ask?

 

Those cowboy orks aren't even for us. They are for a loaner force/bribe.

Edited by PaganMegan
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10 hours ago, PaganMegan said:

That Ghamak undead scribe gave me an idea for an adventure.

 

Tempted to make a WHOLE BUNCH of undead copyists.

 

Yes, the lich is EVIL, but mostly he is BUSY.

 

And doesn't know from printing presses.

 

NOT Blood of Vol, but they WILL try to recruit him, in my Eberron game.

*AHEM*

 

Spoilers!

 

The Auld Grump

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Posted (edited)
22 hours ago, PaganMegan said:

Or he's a GM working on his campaign. ::P:

Not likely.

 

Most of those Patreons will just go out of business.

 

I am willing to pay an artist for their work, I've BEEN the artist that didn't get paid.

 

If the model looks like it is worth more than the Patreon I will join the Patreon.

 

Letting go of the Patreon is harder when the next month ALSO looks good.

 

We joined Ghamak for a month, three months ago. Both tiers, because cowboy orks and creepy undead.

 

Addiction? Why do you ask?

 

Those cowboy orks aren't even for us. They are for a loaner force/bribe.

Here's where I'm seeing a problem.

 

Are the artists getting paid fairly by the monthly patreon rate that comes out to less than $0.50 a model?  

 

Then why is a 'fair rate' for that same model ALSO $4?.   How are $0.50 and $4 both fair rates for the same model, just because I didn't know about the patreon a year ago?

 

I think the big issue here is patreons like Epic-Miniatures (just to pick one of the most egregious) that put an absurd number of models into their monthly pack.   Epic's May release has 91 new miniatures (I'm not even counting the throwback and the welcome pack.)

Their average store price for a humanoid figure appears to be about $3.90.  Even if we assume that all 91 miniatures would go into the store at only $3.90 (They won't be, the bigger ones will be more), then at $12, their patreon price is a whopping 97% off retail price.  At that point a 50% off sale isn't even really a sale....

 

Big patreons and tribes like this I feel are putting pressure on the smaller ones to increase the volume of work, and then the difference between the monthly rate and the after sales rate probably leads to fewer regular market sales, and I think could be a big contributor to burnout among some creators.

Edited by Cygnwulf
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58 minutes ago, Cygnwulf said:

Here's where I'm seeing a problem.

 

Are the artists getting paid fairly by the monthly patreon rate that comes out to less than $0.50 a model?  

 

Then why is a 'fair rate' for that same model ALSO $4?.   How are $0.50 and $4 both fair rates for the same model, just because I didn't know about the patreon a year ago?

 

I think the big issue here is patreons like Epic-Miniatures (just to pick one of the most egregious) that put an absurd number of models into their monthly pack.   Epic's May release has 91 new miniatures (I'm not even counting the throwback and the welcome pack.)

Their average store price for a humanoid figure appears to be about $3.90.  Even if we assume that all 91 miniatures would go into the store at only $3.90 (They won't be, the bigger ones will be more), then at $12, their patreon price is a whopping 97% off retail price.  At that point a 50% off sale isn't even really a sale....

 

Big patreons and tribes like this I feel are putting pressure on the smaller ones to increase the volume of work, and then the difference between the monthly rate and the after sales rate probably leads to fewer regular market sales, and I think could be a big contributor to burnout among some creators.

The Patreon pays for the time spent creating the models.

 

The profit is in the models sold later.

 

Some price to drive people away from later purchase, looking for income being solely from the Patreon. But the biggest example of that is actually using the 3D models to create physical models. For Raging Heroes the profit is in the physical models that their own 3D models are competing with.

Patreon made ALL the difference between Raging Heroes making money or losing money.

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At the upper levels the Patreons are healthily self supporting, so their prices are closer.

 

Ad sometimes those bigger STLs are worth the money, but were created because the artist WANTED to.

 

Most of these Patreons are run by the artists, including Raging Heroes, so the Patreon paying for development is a pretty big deal.

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57 minutes ago, PaganMegan said:

The Patreon pays for the time spent creating the models.

 

The profit is in the models sold later.

 

And I suppose if they weren't selling any later they'd reduce the price but the mind still boggles at the discrepancy  a 97% discount is staggering.    

 

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I agree.  I've had a few where I find out about it later and it's a case of wow, that's a steep price.  I tend to pick up outside of Patreon, simply because I usually don't have the cash sitting around to do the whole pay at the beginning of the month thing, and too many will be one out of every four or five I like, so I wouldn't ever see loyalty bonuses (as almost all are cumulative backing rewards, not overall) 

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Update on the AG's Epic Loyalty Slot:

 

Epic Slot Update

Early on in this journey, I launched the Epic Bosses rewards in order to make big monsters such as dragons, powerful demons and overlords: I love big baddies and epic monsters!
Things have evolved a lot from that point we have much larger releases and we often have epic bosses like figures each month 🙂

For example, the Turtledragon Leviathan, Thane Hulgrof, King Skutagaard, the Vampiric Barbajiaan or Ornithaax the Majestic (and many more) were planned to be Epic Bosses one day, but they fit so well in certain month that I had to make them!

 

The Lich Lord or Thane Hulgrof were such complex sculpts that it would have been impossible for me as lone sculptor to make them AND an epic boss during the same month.
Loyalty rewards are good from a perspective, but they also draw many days of work (even weeks!) out of the monthly releases. And I don't want to have compromise on releases that coincide with epic bosses.

For this reason I want to temporary suspend the Epic Bosses Loyalty Reward and provide  the best Epic Boss-like figure I can each month, such the Lich Lord and many more.

I really thought about it a lot before making this hard decision, and for now it's the best thing I can do to keep bringing top quality models. I'll always prefer quality over quantity 🙂
I owe you guys really a lot, and I'm sure you'll understand that for my mental health I need to slow down a bit and focus on each monthly release.
Thank you so much for your comprehension! 

 

I've kinda been hanging on to my Patreon spot due to to the Epic reward (as I really don't recall what months are used to get the loyalty award, etc etc, so I've just kept it going. I think I may just switch over to Tribes for AG. Either drop AG before the end of the month & then re-up early in June, as I don't want to get charged for this month's stuff again.

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2 hours ago, haldir said:

Update on the AG's Epic Loyalty Slot:

 

Epic Slot Update

Early on in this journey, I launched the Epic Bosses rewards in order to make big monsters such as dragons, powerful demons and overlords: I love big baddies and epic monsters!
Things have evolved a lot from that point we have much larger releases and we often have epic bosses like figures each month 🙂

For example, the Turtledragon Leviathan, Thane Hulgrof, King Skutagaard, the Vampiric Barbajiaan or Ornithaax the Majestic (and many more) were planned to be Epic Bosses one day, but they fit so well in certain month that I had to make them!

 

The Lich Lord or Thane Hulgrof were such complex sculpts that it would have been impossible for me as lone sculptor to make them AND an epic boss during the same month.
Loyalty rewards are good from a perspective, but they also draw many days of work (even weeks!) out of the monthly releases. And I don't want to have compromise on releases that coincide with epic bosses.

For this reason I want to temporary suspend the Epic Bosses Loyalty Reward and provide  the best Epic Boss-like figure I can each month, such the Lich Lord and many more.

I really thought about it a lot before making this hard decision, and for now it's the best thing I can do to keep bringing top quality models. I'll always prefer quality over quantity 🙂
I owe you guys really a lot, and I'm sure you'll understand that for my mental health I need to slow down a bit and focus on each monthly release.
Thank you so much for your comprehension! 

 

I've kinda been hanging on to my Patreon spot due to to the Epic reward (as I really don't recall what months are used to get the loyalty award, etc etc, so I've just kept it going. I think I may just switch over to Tribes for AG. Either drop AG before the end of the month & then re-up early in June, as I don't want to get charged for this month's stuff again.

Is AG Artisan's Guild?

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18 hours ago, Cygnwulf said:

Here's where I'm seeing a problem.

 

Are the artists getting paid fairly by the monthly patreon rate that comes out to less than $0.50 a model?  

 

Then why is a 'fair rate' for that same model ALSO $4?.   How are $0.50 and $4 both fair rates for the same model, just because I didn't know about the patreon a year ago?

 

I think the big issue here is patreons like Epic-Miniatures (just to pick one of the most egregious) that put an absurd number of models into their monthly pack.   Epic's May release has 91 new miniatures (I'm not even counting the throwback and the welcome pack.)

Their average store price for a humanoid figure appears to be about $3.90.  Even if we assume that all 91 miniatures would go into the store at only $3.90 (They won't be, the bigger ones will be more), then at $12, their patreon price is a whopping 97% off retail price.  At that point a 50% off sale isn't even really a sale....

 

Big patreons and tribes like this I feel are putting pressure on the smaller ones to increase the volume of work, and then the difference between the monthly rate and the after sales rate probably leads to fewer regular market sales, and I think could be a big contributor to burnout among some creators.

 

I see Patreon like I see Kickstarter.

We pay a small amount to help the creator do his thing.

Profits are made in retail. At least that's the plan.

Some creators have higher retail prices ( like Heroes Infinite, that is really a huge difference) others are still very affordable and often throw in some freebies as well.

 

As for EPIC, I have a lot of their sets, and yes you get a lot for your money, on the other hand quality is another matter, they don't compare to ArchVillain Games or Artisan Guild when it comes to the quality of sculpts. AG uses modular parts so you can make more versions of the troops.

 

Prices are higher in retail yes. But you get a file you can print ( and sometimes alter/ use modular parts etc) to create a lot of minis.

We are willing to pay for physical minis, just the one for a price that's usually higher than an STL file will cost at retail.

We are happy with let's say the price per mini a Kickstarter like Bones gives us and we're equally happy to buy such minis later in retail at a higher price.

I think Patreon and the later retail prices are a bit comparable to that.

 

I won't buy every set, but I had my regrets with these AVG minis because I was pondering over them when the Patreon set was released. I already liked the ones I got now in a sale.

It just means to be aware of the price difference later and decide if it might be worth it to just go for the whole set that month.

As for the many sales on MMF, they will always come back, so no need to jump in, if you want something you can always wait for the next time it will be half price.

 

I have collected a lot of files, sometimes I wonder if I should just stop, since I won't be able to print/paint it all anyway, but on the other hand it's also fun to collect them.

And if you print just one big monster from a set you might already break even compared to physical minis or retail prices.

 

As long as I can afford it and have fun with it it's fine.

I can see a moment in the future where I might stop buying though, at a certain point the circle is complete and it will be just more of the same factions I already have legions of.

 

Have fun all, that's the main goal of this hobby!!

 

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